Heym SR20
Well-Known Member
Rather my view as well. I like it, but it is a specialist longer range rifle for open country.
Which 6.5?
- Thread starter North Cornwall Deer
- Start date
Rather my view as well. I like it, but it is a specialist longer range rifle for open country.
Tikka has got it right with the .25-06. You can buy it in 20”, of which 99% here will be suppressed, or 22” which in my experience works fine, no louder than my .308 and I certainly wouldn’t say its anything particularly unpleasant.
It’s just another option, its got odd-ish character for sure but man does it work well. I like it, for entirely hypocritical reasons, because for example I far prefer the .308 over the .30-06.
So a lot has been said - generally negative - about the meat damage caused by the EldX rounds. I finally shot the first roe buck with my creedmoor last night. An awkward 100m shot off sticks that I pulled high, so it went through the top of the shoulder blade and the spine.
Frankly, no more or less damage than I’d expect from a soft point .243 or .270 in the same place. Soft point .308 would produce less damage, ballistic tip about the same. Clearly not something I’d want to repeat, and I think I’ll try to restrict use of this to 150m plus shots, but also not the savage disaster I initially feared.
Frankly, no more or less damage than I’d expect from a soft point .243 or .270 in the same place. Soft point .308 would produce less damage, ballistic tip about the same. Clearly not something I’d want to repeat, and I think I’ll try to restrict use of this to 150m plus shots, but also not the savage disaster I initially feared.
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Did the bullet directly strike the vertebrae bone or the scapula? Do you have a neat little entry on the other side? Heavy bone shots are interesting, in terms of how the bullet performs.
It's interesting to compare the 6.5mm 143gr ELD-X and the .243 100gr ProHunter. Me and the wife will shoot close range deer (sub 150m or so) in the neck with the ProHunter, depending on the position of the animal usually the C1/C2 vertebrae below the rear of the skull. The ProHunter at 2800fps will obliterate the vertebrae and vaporize the bullet, all you'll find are little bits of copper jacket and a grey lead coating on the neck meat around the wound. But it never exits. All you'll find is a the neat 6mm wide entry. This spiker is a good example, shot at almost bang on 100m, you'll not know its been shot until you pick up the head and realise the spine is pretty much completely disconnected. Entry on left photo, other side on right.
With the 6.5mm ELD-X, which I only really use for medium range shooting, in general a side on chest shot between say 250m and 600m will punch through, but the exit hole will be half the size of the one in Mungo's photo above. One of my favourite shots is from steeply above, as you have clear access to the CNS. This one was shot at -27° at 325m or thereabouts, in through the T1/T2 verterbrae, down through the front of the chest cavity and into the rear of the brisket. No exit. Neat 1.5" diameter hole through the spine, below the back muscle, which was largely undamaged. Remains of the bullet shown.
The 143gr ELD-X for me is a longer range bullet, I have shot short range game with it (only goats I think) but I wouldn't choose to use it as a stalking bullet where I'm anticipating animals close in, so your comment about 150m+ makes sense. I'm certainly not surprised to see how its punched a hole through the little roe at that range after impacting hard bone.
But.. there's always a but... whilst I get the focus on meat recovery and fussy game dealers and so on, flattened instantly dead deer are a nice-to-have especially when you're in or adjacent to the woods, and in that sense the ELD-X excels. It delivers one helluva thump to a roe, fallow or red deer and assuming you've shot it in the front half of the chest, they certainly don't go far if anywhere at all. It's quite forgiving of shot placement in that sense.
Bottom line is that I prefer a lighter frangible hunting bullet at close ranges, say sub-200m, one that I can bank on impacting where I want it, stay in the animal and not create gaping great big wounds. That's what the ProHunter excels in.
It's interesting to compare the 6.5mm 143gr ELD-X and the .243 100gr ProHunter. Me and the wife will shoot close range deer (sub 150m or so) in the neck with the ProHunter, depending on the position of the animal usually the C1/C2 vertebrae below the rear of the skull. The ProHunter at 2800fps will obliterate the vertebrae and vaporize the bullet, all you'll find are little bits of copper jacket and a grey lead coating on the neck meat around the wound. But it never exits. All you'll find is a the neat 6mm wide entry. This spiker is a good example, shot at almost bang on 100m, you'll not know its been shot until you pick up the head and realise the spine is pretty much completely disconnected. Entry on left photo, other side on right.
With the 6.5mm ELD-X, which I only really use for medium range shooting, in general a side on chest shot between say 250m and 600m will punch through, but the exit hole will be half the size of the one in Mungo's photo above. One of my favourite shots is from steeply above, as you have clear access to the CNS. This one was shot at -27° at 325m or thereabouts, in through the T1/T2 verterbrae, down through the front of the chest cavity and into the rear of the brisket. No exit. Neat 1.5" diameter hole through the spine, below the back muscle, which was largely undamaged. Remains of the bullet shown.
The 143gr ELD-X for me is a longer range bullet, I have shot short range game with it (only goats I think) but I wouldn't choose to use it as a stalking bullet where I'm anticipating animals close in, so your comment about 150m+ makes sense. I'm certainly not surprised to see how its punched a hole through the little roe at that range after impacting hard bone.
But.. there's always a but... whilst I get the focus on meat recovery and fussy game dealers and so on, flattened instantly dead deer are a nice-to-have especially when you're in or adjacent to the woods, and in that sense the ELD-X excels. It delivers one helluva thump to a roe, fallow or red deer and assuming you've shot it in the front half of the chest, they certainly don't go far if anywhere at all. It's quite forgiving of shot placement in that sense.
Bottom line is that I prefer a lighter frangible hunting bullet at close ranges, say sub-200m, one that I can bank on impacting where I want it, stay in the animal and not create gaping great big wounds. That's what the ProHunter excels in.
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Yes. Clipped nearside scapula, deflected up, hit spine full on. I’d expect virtually any bullet to make a bit of a mess if it does that.
Astonishingly, the animal was still alive when I got to it and needed a second shot to the head.
Yes, I have a 6.5x57 Sauer 90 and it's a lovely rifle to shoot and very accurate. The downside is the effort it took to get it shooting well.
The problems were:
S&B cases splitting necks on first firing, solved by using only RWS cases.
Hopelessly weak US loading data which gave such low pressures that the cases didn't obturate in the chamber, so soot and gas came puffing back along the bolt and out into your face.
Quite fussy about bullets, RWS factory kegelspitz worked quite well but eventually settled on 140gn Nosler custom competition for target work.
Faster powders seemed to give poor results, so ended up with Viht N165 which was perfect.
I'd say it's now more accurate than a 6.5x55, but it would be hard to justify against a 6.5x47 where it's quite a challenge to find a load that doesn't shoot well.
The 6.5x47 Lapua is a very useful cartridge. I shot one in Tassie on fallow and it was extremely accurate and easy to shoot. Only problem is the availability of components. Its a rare-ish chambering and supplies reflect that. At least in this part of the world it is.
I have to say the range of factory ammo for the creedmoor just keeps getting better and better!!
Dauntsey Guns, Wiltshire, Wiltshire's Friendly Gun Shop: Centrefire, 6.5mm Creedmoor
For the non reloader I think it surpasses the swede now, i note the 156 gr sako deerhead is also marketed for boar - I may give these a go for deer rather developing another load for the few deer I'll take with the creedmoor!
Dauntsey Guns, Wiltshire, Wiltshire's Friendly Gun Shop: Centrefire, 6.5mm Creedmoor
For the non reloader I think it surpasses the swede now, i note the 156 gr sako deerhead is also marketed for boar - I may give these a go for deer rather developing another load for the few deer I'll take with the creedmoor!
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Chikentikka
Well-Known Member
6.5x284 ?
paul newham
Well-Known Member
nicely said chickentikka.
Interestingly just seen today that a company called Blackjack Bullets is making a 131gn .257 caliber bullet for long range targets which will be available middle of next month with a BC of 0.33!
Spotterdog
Well-Known Member
Coming back to 6.5 x 57 for a moment, I'm on my second rifle in this calibre. Originally I was after a 7x57 but wanted to go just a shade lighter in bullet weight and a touch faster. Knowing how sweet the 7x57 shoots I took a bit of a gamble as I'd never used a 6.5 previously. My first rifle in 6.5 x 57 was a Sauer 90, a fabulous rifle with some unique design features. The only thing I didn't like was the single stack mag and not being able to top load it, otherwise excellent.
I changed that for an MO3 ten years ago in the same calibre, but with an extra barrel in 8 x 68S. This gave me the double stack top load facility and single-set-trigger similar to the Sauer, and again, an excellent rifle for lowland stalking. The downside to my ramblings here, is that Mauser have ceased offering 6.5 x 57 in their calibre line up. A great shame to see this, and previously the 25-06 fall from favour. Although rifles are few and far between in 6.5 x 57, it is an effective very pleasant shooting round that deserves some consideration. If my Mauser barrel ever wears out, I will without any hesitation use the Mauser breach and fit in a new 6.5 barrel and chamber it out to 57mm.
I changed that for an MO3 ten years ago in the same calibre, but with an extra barrel in 8 x 68S. This gave me the double stack top load facility and single-set-trigger similar to the Sauer, and again, an excellent rifle for lowland stalking. The downside to my ramblings here, is that Mauser have ceased offering 6.5 x 57 in their calibre line up. A great shame to see this, and previously the 25-06 fall from favour. Although rifles are few and far between in 6.5 x 57, it is an effective very pleasant shooting round that deserves some consideration. If my Mauser barrel ever wears out, I will without any hesitation use the Mauser breach and fit in a new 6.5 barrel and chamber it out to 57mm.
Great choice if you're happy for barrels to last less than 1000 rounds!
I would guess 90%+ of rifles sold, a bit like sports cars, are never tested to anywhere near their capabilities
If you accept that once that 6.5mm bullet leaves the muzzle it no longer has anything to do with the cartridge....then ANY 6.5 chambering is capable of an awful lot more than the vast majority of us will ever ask of it. (that goes for ANY chambering!)
in order to demonstrate the INTERNAL ballistic advantages of a 6.5cm over a 6.5x55, 6.5x57, .260, x284, etc etc
YOU, the fleshy bit behind the gun need to be performing at a world class level.
The external ballistic part is taken care of by your bullet choice and associated MV it leaves your possession at.
You also need to bring your "A Game" if you want to demonstrate the true potential of the bullet in flight at the ranges it is capable of
Cartridge choice for factory ammo will severely limit your high BC VLD bullet choice
6.5x57 and x55 do not have good factory options for LR target shooting
.260rem, 6.5x284 has a poor coverage in the UK for any factory ammo
simple terms....it doesnt matter to the vast majority of users what cartridge you choose
Choose a bullet for the work the majority of the rifle is going to do
Choose a chambering you can reliably source components or ammunition for
If you accept that once that 6.5mm bullet leaves the muzzle it no longer has anything to do with the cartridge....then ANY 6.5 chambering is capable of an awful lot more than the vast majority of us will ever ask of it. (that goes for ANY chambering!)
in order to demonstrate the INTERNAL ballistic advantages of a 6.5cm over a 6.5x55, 6.5x57, .260, x284, etc etc
YOU, the fleshy bit behind the gun need to be performing at a world class level.
The external ballistic part is taken care of by your bullet choice and associated MV it leaves your possession at.
You also need to bring your "A Game" if you want to demonstrate the true potential of the bullet in flight at the ranges it is capable of
Cartridge choice for factory ammo will severely limit your high BC VLD bullet choice
6.5x57 and x55 do not have good factory options for LR target shooting
.260rem, 6.5x284 has a poor coverage in the UK for any factory ammo
simple terms....it doesnt matter to the vast majority of users what cartridge you choose
Choose a bullet for the work the majority of the rifle is going to do
Choose a chambering you can reliably source components or ammunition for
tackb
Well-Known Member
wise words ^^^^^
tackb
Well-Known Member
well that's a game changer , as long as you are prepared to re-barrel in a faster twist to shoot it..........................
And import them from the states then work up a new load as I doubt there's any published data for it!
interestingly, as I predicted with my FEO when I got my creedmoor last May heavier 6.5 target bullets are appearing, Sierra are doing a 150 gr matchking with a G1 BC of 0.71 - as you say though would be a re-barrel as most factory 6.5s seem to be 8-8.5".
Ed makes a good point, funnily enough my 6.5x55 (main stalking rifle) and 6.5 CM (occasional / backup stalking rifle) 140 gr soft point loads use the same bullet within 50 fps of each other, so they behave in the same way as soon as they leave the muzzle keeping drops etc. for me simple!
Both could be run hotter too, but don't need to be
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6.5Harasser
Member
Go back to 6.5x55, tried and true.
Heres a 3 shot group at 579y with my bone stock tikka t3 varmint. (The x is a tear)
Load is once fired Hornady brass, 147eld match over 45.5gr of H4350 doing 2835fps.
Heres a 3 shot group at 579y with my bone stock tikka t3 varmint. (The x is a tear)
Load is once fired Hornady brass, 147eld match over 45.5gr of H4350 doing 2835fps.
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