T3x vs a Sako

[CerebralDistortion]

Sako or Tikka, which ones?

Sako A-seies (not including the A7) are really good rifles if you could live without a removable magazine. The Tikkas from the same era M55/65 are also excellent rifles.

After those things started to decline in regards to fitting and craftsmanship. Still really good rifles.

And today, besides that Tikka T3x is the best rifle you could buy for the money spent, it's all about taste. If you're not interested in controlled round feed (which disqualify both of them) it's just small "things" that differ. Two or three lugs? Single or double stack mags? Action length to fit the round? Accessories? Scope mounts?

IMHO, the best rifle to come out of the factory I Rihimääki is the Sako M995/TRG-S (and well see about the follow up the S20) but then again, it is about taste.

If you want to buy a rifle and then use it as it is, buy the Sako that fits your demands the best and be done with it. If you want to tinker with it, buy a Tikka.

 

[david1]

I all ready owned a Sako 85, bought a new Tikka t3x ctr, sold it quite quickly and bought another Sako 85

 

[ejg]

Sako or Tikka, which ones?

Sako A-seies (not including the A7) are really good rifles if you could live without a removable magazine. The Tikkas from the same era M55/65 are also excellent rifles.

After those things started to decline in regards to fitting and craftsmanship. Still really good rifles.

And today, besides that Tikka T3x is the best rifle you could buy for the money spent, it's all about taste. If you're not interested in controlled round feed (which disqualify both of them) it's just small "things" that differ. Two or three lugs? Single or double stack mags? Action length to fit the round? Accessories? Scope mounts?

IMHO, the best rifle to come out of the factory I Rihimääki is the Sako M995/TRG-S (and well see about the follow up the S20) but then again, it is about taste.

If you want to buy a rifle and then use it as it is, buy the Sako that fits your demands the best and be done with it. If you want to tinker with it, buy a Tikka.

Then again people like Hakan Spuhr threw out the TRG action and replaced it with a T3 in the TRG stock for competition use. Is on his fourth barrel in that T3.
When it comes to an action, craftmanship is overrated, you need engineering not someone fiddling with a file to get things to fit. T3 has it down to a fine art, even aftermarket barrels are being offered that do not need a barrel nut. They headspace just fine because the T3 action is engineered not fiddled to fit. That is the difference to older actions, that is why I prefer the newer actions. I have an old Sako rifle, it is not as well made as newer ones.

edi

 

[CerebralDistortion]

Well, if I'm correctly informed, he threw it out because it was too much work modifying the bolt to accept a 6.5x55AI cartridge. And the Tikka action, since being a similar and closed design, worked just as well.

He also made an aluminium block to be able to fit the Tikka action in a TRG42 stock, but has since replaced it wit a PSR.

He did try though to use a TRG-S bolt for 6.5x55 in his TRG which worked well but swedish gun laws does not make exceptions for even people like him.

(And I bet he's on here and could correct me in any of this should I be wrong)

And the quality of inletting is due to experience and thoroughness of the guy doing the job, so of course the hand fitted rifles by committed and experienced guys will be better.

 

[ejg]

Hakan did not use 6.5x55 recently. Was something in 6mm? At least when he was shooting with us here.
Well, those times of hand fitting are over if you want quality, talk to some good tool makers, they will laugh at you if you come with hand fitting. My first trade is/was very much hand fitting lapping etc. believe me I have enough experience in that direction. All BS as soon as you need to change a part. That's where engineering comes in not messing around.
edi

 

[wildfowler.250]

As far as actions go, every smith ive messaged in the last year or so basically steered me towards a T3 action.

I assueme a T3 rifle,(not for custom build) can be picked up fairly cheap new now that the T3X is out? Is one a better buy over the other? T3X in stainless is about £1,200 so not exactly a cheap rifle

 

[CerebralDistortion]

Hakan did not use 6.5x55 recently. Was something in 6mm? At least when he was shooting with us here.

No, probably a 6GT. I could ask him when I get a chance.
But that was not the discussion now, was it? Or the reason he choose a Tikka over a Sako...

I assueme a T3 rifle,(not for custom build) can be picked up fairly cheap new now that the T3X is out? Is one a better buy over the other? T3X in stainless is about £1,200 so not exactly a cheap rifle

The T3 has an aluminium recoil lug, plastic bolt shroud and an ejection port that sits a bit too high, which interferes with the ejection if you use a Spuhr-mount.

Otherwise it's the same rifle.

 

[antsa]

Then again people like Hakan Spuhr threw out the TRG action and replaced it with a T3 in the TRG stock for competition use. Is on his fourth barrel in that T3.
When it comes to an action, craftmanship is overrated, you need engineering not someone fiddling with a file to get things to fit. T3 has it down to a fine art, even aftermarket barrels are being offered that do not need a barrel nut. They headspace just fine because the T3 action is engineered not fiddled to fit. That is the difference to older actions, that is why I prefer the newer actions. I have an old Sako rifle, it is not as well made as newer ones.

edi

I agree with you here. One of the things though that I like with the older Sako AI .222 that I have is the action size. I also have three Sako 85s in the XS action. Sako chambers the XS in .204Ruger, .222Rem and .223Rem. The length of this action is 131mm with the rear bridge at 30mm, the ejection port at 57mm and the front bridge at 44mm.
On the AI the action length is 123mm with the rear bridge at 30mm, the port at 54mm and the front bridge at 39mm.

Of course I recognise the need for economic production and accept that this level of scaling is no longer viable in today's market.

Cheers

 

[ejg]

There is good and bad with the different action sizes. The T3 action is lighter than a short action remmy which is already lighter than a short action Howa. Meaning weight is not the issue. Yes it does seem a bit of a waste having such a long action and travel and then maybe only a 223 chambered. Then again shoot a T3 in 223 and one does not really notice the long action. I had no issue selling my little 223 CZ and it being replaced by a T3.
Maybe some overestimate the amount of revenue created by rifle sales, there is a huge amount of competition out there and the market is actually not that big compared to other sports. At the IWA show for example Blaser had possibly the biggest stand, even before the virus they had announced they will pull out of future IWA shows in Germany.
One should not underestimate the pull of the aftermarket industry, many will not purchase a brand because they can hardly tinker with the rifle or no parts are available. Every rifle is built to a price and some components might not suit the customer others are perfect. For a T3 or Heym SR 30 SR21 you just have one action that covers all, saves in production and aftermarket costs. Just look how long it took for S&L to come out with a plastic injection moulded stock, it is a huge investment for one alone, how about 4 or 5 moulds.
I missed to see how many action lengths the new Sako S20 will be made in? 2 or only one? Will the 85 be phased out? maybe that is also a sign of how it will be in the future.
edi

 

[CerebralDistortion]

I missed to see how many action lengths the new Sako S20 will be made in? 2 or only one? Will the 85 be phased out?

One as far as I know. It's a replacement for the A7 and the 85 will remain a while yet.

 

[User00040]

The fact that a T3x can be configured to be a lightweight stalking rifle or heavy varmiter just bu changing parts is the biggest selling point for me.

If you are buying a T3x for deer stalking, get a 'long action' calibre (.270 Winchester, 30-06, 6.5x55 etc.) foxing or varmiting get a 'short action' CTR (.308, 6.5CM, .260 Rem).

Add a PSE stock (multipurpose for stalking, E-Tac or E-Lite for the CTR) and good bottom metal (not needed for CTR) and you are sorted.

Sterk makes the best bolt handles and shrouds, pricey optional upgrade but also worth it IMHO.

No point swapping the trigger unless you must have a two-stage.

 

[booradley]

I’ll take a Sako. I prefer the larger ejection port. I also like the SAKO DBM system better, it seems more robust. Since I have a bad shoulder I avoid light rifles so in that regard Sako usually wins over Tikka. Sako feels more substantial in my hands.

 

[ChesterP]

T3 dropped into a Mcmillan or GRS lamiante stock. Mine shoots well sub moa (laminate GRS) and has the benefit that the stock is very light, and adjustable, for both LOP and cheek weld. Been using it for a few years now and it's a nice shooting rifle with a very crisp trigger set at 2.5lbs. Not as nice as a Blaser trigger but better than the equivalent remmy or howa imho. I also have the T3 Tac A1 and the trigger on that is superb. Looked at a Sako 85 and thought it wasn't worth the extra. Prefered the older Sako 75 by some margin.