And to complete the rant, I’ll say this: In 39 years of .243 shooting and reloading, I’ve never come across a 10 twist rifle that won’t shoot a 100gr flat base softpoint such as the ProHunter or the Hornady spire point (that Hornady has discontinued now I think). The problem if you can call it that is that guys insist on trying to shoot longer boat tails, which broadly speaking are optimised for the slightly faster twist Remington and Savage rifles. Simple really.
243 legal??
- Thread starter jb7x57
- Start date
Dodgy, I think the issue is not the 100gr cup core bullet even with boat tail it is more down to the copper bullets that will be forced upon us. Not sure who makes 100gr 6mm copper bullets and how to stabilise them with factory twist rifles. The 6.5's have a bit more reserves if the law wants 100gr min and copper at the same time.
edi
edi
Sonicdmb73
Well-Known Member
I remember the thread you mentioned. It still amazes me how many people think the 243 was a Varmint/light bullet gun. When it is a good all rounder.
I will admit I have just sold mine. A Sauer 202 in 6.5x55 was too good to miss. It also solves the problem of deer legal (in Scotland) monolithic bullets.
I would not of ever considered myself under gunned with the 243 though.
Smellydog
Well-Known Member
This is why I dropped it after three rifles. When I did switch I did not miss it one bit.
Excellent foxing round at long distances mind.
I call it the 'imbetweener'. Don't mean it's rubbish or garbage, just err well the Inbetweener.
Just for a bit of interest since a lot are sitting at home - a .243 bullet that I found in a healthy, heavy hind. Glancing shot that had damaged the shoulder and broken a few ribs but failed to penetrate into chest. Bullet was sitting against the ribs under the skin.
I would happily use a .243 with the right bullets on deer btw.
I would happily use a .243 with the right bullets on deer btw.
It fascinates me endlessly this business of blaming the tools. I spotted for a couple last year, supposedly half decent and reasonably experienced shooters. He with a .300 Win Mag and she with a .270. Both shot red hinds within 200m and both fvcked up their shots, both deer ran, only one was found, still alive. I’ve told the story before on here... jeez it was sad. Both blamed their tools.
I guess at the end of the day I should defer to our mate @bogtrotter. He tells it as it is, in his own way. A pro, a lifetime in the Highlands. Me, I’m an amateur, too garrulous, and honestly I can’t really be bothered tonight.
Shot placement, fellas.
We shoot red deer here with .223s FFS. Bang, flop.
I guess at the end of the day I should defer to our mate @bogtrotter. He tells it as it is, in his own way. A pro, a lifetime in the Highlands. Me, I’m an amateur, too garrulous, and honestly I can’t really be bothered tonight.
Shot placement, fellas.
We shoot red deer here with .223s FFS. Bang, flop.
Freeforester
Well-Known Member
I'm guessing of course, but it's quite possible too that the bullet used was not 100 grain when it left the rifle of the person responsible for the non-lethal shot at the hind? Irrespective, it's more apparent that the wounding shot as it was found appears to have been somewhat taken/made 'in desperation', and highlights the need for correct shot placement, and cool heads when the chance to end the life of an animal is marginal at best; if in doubt, don't.
I do love it when the first point made in an argument is an insult. Well played sir, do you believe that this approach makes your point even more believable?
You said it yourself. " In 39 years of .243 shooting and reloading, I’ve never come across a 10 twist rifle that won’t shoot a 100gr flat base softpoint such as the ProHunter or the Hornady spire point (that Hornady has discontinued now I think).". Then you start to reel off reasons why, folk use the wrong bullet and that it causes problems etc. Whatever, stick any bullet you like in a 6.5 calibre and you're sorted. That Fiesta can still do 100mph, what's your point and how does that make what I say nonsense? If you read what I said again and compare it to what you said, you actually agree with some of the things I said but are angry about it? I never said it couldn't kill deer, I said it struggles with 100gr bullets and you backed that point straigh up with your "In 39 years of .243 shooting and reloading, I’ve never come across a 10 twist rifle that won’t shoot a 100gr flat base softpoint such as the ProHunter or the Hornady spire point (that Hornady has discontinued now I think) ". Why can't it shoot a boat tail or monolithic? Because it's marginal.
And that's spot on. You can hardly make up for being a crap shot by using a bigger gun. My point didn't even touch upon it not being suitable for killing deer, I said it struggled to comply with the deer act. My .416 Rigby struggles to comply with the deer act in Scotland too!
Why would you want to burn more powder when the creedmoor achieves the same or better velocities with less powder in a short action......?
However most of Europe holds a different view and don't allow red deer to be shot with a 243 Win. I still remember last century arriving at an estate to stalk and being told to leave my 243 Win in the car. Europe's view reflects what experience and science have told them. We need to keep the science and animal welfare in mind at all times.
Regards
JCS
8x57
Distinguished Member
Hypothetical - just supposing that legislation to use only non lead bullets is introduced at some time in the future, and also that the authorities are totally unwilling to vary the present requirement in Scotland to use a minimum of 100 grn bullet for the larger species of deer.
Is there a simple, practical and affordable way to re-chamber or re-bore a .243 win rifle to a cartridge that would accept suitable non lead bullets without the need to re-barrel or relegate .243win rifles to lesser duties using what at that time would be legally acceptable ammunition. Or would the very popular .243win rifle suddenly become redundant in Scotland for the larger species of deer?
Is there a simple, practical and affordable way to re-chamber or re-bore a .243 win rifle to a cartridge that would accept suitable non lead bullets without the need to re-barrel or relegate .243win rifles to lesser duties using what at that time would be legally acceptable ammunition. Or would the very popular .243win rifle suddenly become redundant in Scotland for the larger species of deer?
Suddenly is not the right word. It's been clear for some considerable time that 243 Win and other 6mms are very likely to cease to be red deer legal in Scotland. Anyone not currently trialling non-lead factory ammunition with bullet weights in excess of 100 gr in Scotland risks being unable to shoot red deer in the future in Scotland. I'd also suggest that we are not far away from 6.5 Creedmoor being the designated entry level deer rifle for new deer stalkers in Scotland.....Or would the very popular .243win rifle suddenly become redundant in Scotland for the larger species of deer?
Regards
JCS
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