Dsc2 assessor
- Thread starter W16OEN
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sikamalc
Administrator
6pointer
Well-Known Member
It is not a closed shop all you need to do is apply and hey presto. What i will say is make sure you have good ground to take people out because i have only been out on some one elses ground once and we coverd a lot of ground and it was a deer desert not even any real signs. But you are correct i have taken out people with as much if not more stalking expearience than me. But then again i went out with my AW who didnt have any more expearience then me and so on. Sorry MALC any fool with the correct money can shoot all six spieces of deer. That is just the way of deer stalking with regards me shooting a deer that i would need to travel 500 miles to shoot are you for real mate . Then again i am sure i could manage them but would need to live just a tad closer.
Paul at Fechan
Well-Known Member
Eh calm down mate, I shoot between 20-30 a year and that's plenty. You don't have to kill something to learn about it. Books and observation aren't bad ways to build up knowledge and experience and some people hunt very well with a camera.
devilishdave
Well-Known Member
Some strange ideas here. My thoughts are if a guy is experianced in the species he is asessing on then I so no negitave impact from not being experianced in a species that perhaps does not exist within 300 miles of you. But if you are assessing on it you should be experianced on it; simple!!
Dave
Dave
Mannlicher_Stu
Well-Known Member
Mannlicher_Stu
Well-Known Member
Mannlicher_Stu
Well-Known Member
How do you make that out?
As Robert says and its not often I agree with him
they are all the same inside ,shot placements the same the only difference is size and slightly different family traits and the witness isnt there to teach a would be candidate, only to observe his competence in all sections of the module not to correct or train him whilst undergoing the assessment. The only time a witness should directly interfere if he can see a potential flaw in safety.He may offer advice after the assessment to the candidate should the candidate not be up to the reqd criteria so why does a witness need to shoot 6 species of deer.
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sikamalc
Administrator
Yes you are right there are AW's who take people onto deer parks to sign them off. As your are an AW is that taken as a fair stalk then ? and sign off ? because if it is that to me is not stalking.
Say what you like there are to me AW's without what I and others would regard as adequate experience, having met one or two it makes you wonder how they managed it. Also taking good Cw out of the loop as I have said is going to make a whole lot harder for people to achieve Level 2, dont tell me it wont. Again its moving the goal post as you so plainly pointed out
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6pointer
Well-Known Member
Funny Robert you should mention the woodland and open hill as differnt aspects of a assessment. I was told that this might be the new assesment makeing it a requirement to do both before you can stalk in scotland . Also the requirement to be put on to the SNH . Register.
You are right in one thing that the removal of SOME CW,s has made it harder but at the time change any one that had been doing regular CW witnessing was invited to the briefing to becoe an AW. So he has to be said the take up was pour and no one wanted to move on.
You are right in one thing that the removal of SOME CW,s has made it harder but at the time change any one that had been doing regular CW witnessing was invited to the briefing to becoe an AW. So he has to be said the take up was pour and no one wanted to move on.
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sweep 6.5x55
Well-Known Member
Sorry Paul but 80 deer a year as a minimum before you can be an AW is not alot to ask it is not even 2 deer a week.
If you are shooting less than this I dont think you have the currency to be able to witness.
20-30 deer a year is barely enough deer to be experianced and compentant enough to undertake DSC2 as a candidate never mind witness or assess a candidate.
This is what is wrong with the DSC's as Malc has already said.
Too many keyboad experts and not enough properly experianced stalkers
6pointer
Well-Known Member
Sweep now thats a strong statement ha ha but what of the chap who shoots 80 a year then starts to do DMQ2,S and because of this his cull gose down. But i do agree 20 a years is a wee bit thin infact Paul its anorexic 
But in all walks of life this happens My own proffesion driving. I had a chap assessing me to teach people to drive and he had never ever taught any one he went through the Examiners route .I feel this is probably what Paul has done and then picked it up as he has went along.
But in all walks of life this happens My own proffesion driving. I had a chap assessing me to teach people to drive and he had never ever taught any one he went through the Examiners route .I feel this is probably what Paul has done and then picked it up as he has went along.sweep 6.5x55
Well-Known Member
6pointer wasnt it you you said people should have shot at least 50 deer before dsc2?
6pointer
Well-Known Member
No but i think that would be not a bad start and only after they have been shown Best Practice !. Teaching is one thing and your knowlage on the subject and all its differences is very important. But assessing some one who already has the knowlage is completly differnt.
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Putting numbers on things is seldom a good idea but, from an AW's point of view, it does start give some idea of the level of experience that a person may have.
Having said that, I know of several professional stalkers you shoot very few deer themselves but gralloch lots, I know of some park deer managers that shoot hundreds of deer a year, under very difficult (despite what those who have never done it may think!) circumstances but shoot very few wild deer, I know of several 'keepers who shoot quite a lot of deer but have no idea about food hygiene, biology or legislation, I know of several very skilled amatuer stalkers who only shoot a few deer but every one is done in a text book fashion, I have done witnessed stalks for a couple of profesional hill stalkers who were, frankly, shocking in their lack of basic knowledge. I have been to a best practice event where the demonstration of gralloching was more like worst practice, so bad that I was embarassed for all concerned.
I've lost track of the point that I was trying to make but it is clear to me that the system has to be robust enough to cater for many different elements which, I think that it is as long as it isn't abused.
I do not think that it is nessesary for an AW to have shot all six species (as has been pointed out, that can be done quite easily if the cheque book can stand it) but they should have 'extensive' experience of most aspects of working with deer in the UK. Equally importantly, they must be the kind of person that is able to put a candidate at ease without mollycoddling them, they must be able to extract information and record it correctly and they must have the integrity and desire to do all of this to 100%.
JC
Having said that, I know of several professional stalkers you shoot very few deer themselves but gralloch lots, I know of some park deer managers that shoot hundreds of deer a year, under very difficult (despite what those who have never done it may think!) circumstances but shoot very few wild deer, I know of several 'keepers who shoot quite a lot of deer but have no idea about food hygiene, biology or legislation, I know of several very skilled amatuer stalkers who only shoot a few deer but every one is done in a text book fashion, I have done witnessed stalks for a couple of profesional hill stalkers who were, frankly, shocking in their lack of basic knowledge. I have been to a best practice event where the demonstration of gralloching was more like worst practice, so bad that I was embarassed for all concerned.
I've lost track of the point that I was trying to make but it is clear to me that the system has to be robust enough to cater for many different elements which, I think that it is as long as it isn't abused.
I do not think that it is nessesary for an AW to have shot all six species (as has been pointed out, that can be done quite easily if the cheque book can stand it) but they should have 'extensive' experience of most aspects of working with deer in the UK. Equally importantly, they must be the kind of person that is able to put a candidate at ease without mollycoddling them, they must be able to extract information and record it correctly and they must have the integrity and desire to do all of this to 100%.
JC
Sweeps
Lets look at this in another way
some stalkers don't hav access to ground that is crawling with deer so to acheive 30+ deer a year is quite an acheivement
they hav to work hard , read the weather , lie of the ground and study their species of deer well just to get an understanding
often these type of stalkers have to proove their worth, before they pull the trigger
is that not wot the experience you are talking about
wot do they know that a stalker that shoots 80+ a year don't?????
Paul at Fechan
Well-Known Member
.I feel this is probably what Paul has done and then picked it up as he has went along.
cheeky monkey!Sweep, while I admire your blood thirsty spirit, you learn something then you use that knowledge. I don't need to kill something to proove I understand it and have the beans to stalk it. Fact is I've been shooting quarry for 25 years and deer for 15, I've got nothing to proove but if you have a problem with me being an AW because I'm not worthy, that's your opinion and I respect that but invite me staking so you can teach me something?
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