Why cant farmers be honest

[StephenToast]

Think the safety aspect in all of this needs to be pressed home to said Farmer as there is potential for a life threatening accident .

This is annoying I'm sure but there should be no safety issue. No-one should ever pull the trigger without confirming their backstop.

You can never guarantee that you are on any ground alone. If you are shooting where you can't see, into unconfirmed backstop you shouldn't have an FAC.

 

[LarryLightFoot]

This is annoying I'm sure but there should be no safety issue. No-one should ever pull the trigger without confirming their backstop.

You can never guarantee that you are on any ground alone. If you are shooting where you can't see, into unconfirmed backstop you shouldn't have an FAC.

All you say I know and practice so not sure what point you’re making and if directed at me ?
My point is the OP’s situation had the potential to evolve into something more serious and yes they made themselves known to each other which is the right and sensible thing to do .
The person giving out the permission is the one who needs to sort out having multiple people at a given time shooting CF Firearms and at night . It’s not rocket science the probabilities of something happening rise considerably.

 

[StephenToast]

All you say I know and practice so not sure what point you’re making and if directed at me ?
My point is the OP’s situation had the potential to evolve into something more serious and yes they made themselves known to each other which is the right and sensible thing to do .
The person giving out the permission is the one who needs to sort out having multiple people at a given time shooting CF Firearms and at night . It’s not rocket science the probabilities of something happening rise considerably.

You, among others suggest that there is a safety issue here. There isn't. Or at least, there shouldn't be unless someone is neglegent.

The shooter is responsible for ensuring their activities are carried out safely. Nobody else.

The probabilities of something happening should not rise, day or night. If that's the case then you are shooting unsafely full stop.

 

[LarryLightFoot]

You, among others suggest that there is a safety issue here. There isn't. Or at least, there shouldn't be unless someone is neglegent.

The shooter is responsible for ensuring their activities are carried out safely. Nobody else.

The probabilities of something happening should not rise, day or night. If that's the case then you are shooting unsafely full stop.

We’re talking about two groups unknown to each other in any way, how can you know what level the other total stranger is operating at ? They could be a pair total idiots not giving any due care or consideration Cowboys you just don’t know in the middle of the night.
Lets face it there are enough numpties out there who possess a FAC licence .
Fact is the Farmer in question is not going about it the right way and that is the crux of the matter not what is the right way to go about night shooting as most right minded and conscious folks do on a regular basis .

 

[Overlay]

You, among others suggest that there is a safety issue here. There isn't. Or at least, there shouldn't be unless someone is neglegent.

The shooter is responsible for ensuring their activities are carried out safely. Nobody else.

The probabilities of something happening should not rise, day or night. If that's the case then you are shooting unsafely full stop.

Hi Stephen
fully agree 100% with you BUT you know as well as I do some shooters idea of safe operation wouldn’t be the same as mine or yours, I know for me I would need to know who’s out on the ground, on the errrr to being safe, I would rather tell the guy I won’t shoot the ground until something is sorted permanently, you may be the safest most concise shooter out there if someone is out there who isn’t - your safe shooting is compromised, dangerous and your in a bad situation

shooting permission shouldn’t be used to promote unsafe procedures, best not to have it

 

[Limpo]

One farm I shoot is forty acres another is 1200, you could shoot the large farm with someone else but surely you would have to communicate as to who shoots where and where not to shoot? Personally I wouldn't like to have someone I didn't know sharing ground at night.

 

[devon deer stalker]

Unfortunate but it also happened to me once, my friend invited me onto his ground, this was years ago, no thermal or night vision, good old fashioned lamps, just as well, we saw their lamps, and we 'lamped' them back, had a friendly chat, and I never returned to that farm with my friend.

But I have to ask @foxhunter, over an hours drive just to shoot some foxes, you must love that game.

 

[foxhunter]

But I have to ask @foxhunter, over an hours drive just to shoot some foxes, you must love that game.

I love foxing but not great numbers round here so have to travel, an hours drive is nothing I used to regularly drive 2 hrs to go rabbitting.

 

[foxhunter]

Update ..

We have informed the farmer we wont be back.

 

[swaro79]

just wondering are you paying any money to shoot these foxes on his ground??money is always a factor on these issues?if no money has changed hands well im shocked.

 

[Home Loader]

The others guys had spoke to the farmer that day but he still never thought to tell us when we phoned
If he had told us we wouldn't have wasted our time going...wont be going back.

Perhaps the other two were not telling the truth and the farmer was blissfully unaware?

 

[Taff]

Unfortunate but it also happened to me once, my friend invited me onto his ground, this was years ago, no thermal or night vision, good old fashioned lamps, just as well, we saw their lamps, and we 'lamped' them back, had a friendly chat, and I never returned to that farm with my friend.

But I have to ask @foxhunter, over an hours drive just to shoot some foxes, you must love that game.

Had the same thing happen, except we only had dogs with us, we all became good friends.

 

[stevec]

I know a farmer who is a very nice man but just struggles to say no, so ended up with a lot of people on his land. I think a polite call from the FEO to the farmer resolved it in the end.

 

[Taff]

I know a farmer who is a very nice man but just struggles to say no, so ended up with a lot of people on his land. I think a polite call from the FEO to the farmer resolved it in the end.

Really

 

[stevec]

Really

Yes, he was giving permission to anyone who asked.

 

[North Cornwall Deer]

Yes, he was giving permission to anyone who asked.

I know a farmer like that. Not really a permission worth having

 

[Rhodesianjess]

We had a new tenant farmer on the estate, probably 9/10 years ago,who started giving people permission for pigeon and rabbit shooting, that had him in the office to have a quiet chat with the boss, the owner of this estate.
Turned out he'd also given permission for two rifles as well, that got the local FEO involved as he'd checked with the farmer and all was rosy as far as he knew.
He's no longer with us, this farmer, his tenancy not renewed after trial period expired. Just beggared belief that he would do that,he knew that he was on a shooting estate and still let people go. I actually found two guys setting up hides and decoys, that's when it came to light what he'd done. Feel sorry for the chaps involved,as far as they knew they had rights to be there.
Goes to show, you don't know how others think.
Know of a chap locally that rents stalking rights on his land to someone but lets selected friends of his have a walkabout with rifle when they fancy. That's not only dangerous but IMO downright dishonest.

 

[VSS]

We had a new tenant farmer on the estate, probably 9/10 years ago,who started giving people permission for pigeon and rabbit shooting, that had him in the office to have a quiet chat with the boss, the owner of this estate.
Turned out he'd also given permission for two rifles as well, that got the local FEO involved as he'd checked with the farmer and all was rosy as far as he knew.
He's no longer with us, this farmer, his tenancy not renewed after trial period expired. Just beggared belief that he would do that,he knew that he was on a shooting estate and still let people go. I actually found two guys setting up hides and decoys, that's when it came to light what he'd done. Feel sorry for the chaps involved,as far as they knew they had rights to be there.
Goes to show, you don't know how others think.
Know of a chap locally that rents stalking rights on his land to someone but lets selected friends of his have a walkabout with rifle when they fancy. That's not only dangerous but IMO downright dishonest.

The tenant farmer did at least have the right to give permission for rabbit shooting, under the terms of the Ground Game act.

 

[Rhodesianjess]

The tenant farmer did at least have the right to give permission for rabbit shooting, under the terms of the Ground Game act.

As I understood it from the boss,he can do that only if the landlord doesn't do anything about the rabbits. If it's all been taken care of before damage gets out of hand,he wasn't supposed to let people just have a wander around on the place to see what's about.

 

[25 Sharps]

As I understood it from the boss,he can do that only if the landlord doesn't do anything about the rabbits. If it's all been taken care of before damage gets out of hand,he wasn't supposed to let people just have a wander around on the place to see what's about.

No, the landlord has no control over the ground game (hares and rabbits) the whole point of the Act was to prevent landowners keeping the rights to rabbits. Any tenant has the right to give permission to a member of their household or one other person, for payment, to control ground game and the landowner cannot prevent it or stipulate the method.