BASC Fighting Fund helps member win appeal against Kent Police

[Julian S]

This is why we really need 1 organisation that every shooter joins to give us more clout and protect our interests,

 

[Curried Venison]

What is the story behind this story? What is the unprovoked attack and how did that event lead to a decision to revoke?

 

[Bowland blades]

For those who think every BASC should get legal services to fight revocation of certs , are they also ok with paying many hundreds a year more at each renewal . Go buy your own legal cover insurance for such events or take a mortgage out / dive into your own funds etc .

 

[Conor O'Gorman]

Thanks @Whitefront @chriswjx and @Steve Q for those observations. I have checked with colleagues and its very much each case on its merits and @Steve Q has it right on the criteria.

 

[Andy morton]

Well done BASC & to all involved , great to know that we have got a voice if treated unfairly , & not just lie down & accept it

 

[timbrayford]

Just out of interest, does anyone know if the other shooting organisations are taking legal action on behalf of their members in similar situations?

Apparently NGO do

 

[timbrayford]

This is why we really need 1 organisation that every shooter joins to give us more clout and protect our interests,

Or perhaps excellent cooperation between organisations on matters that they agree on?

 

[timbrayford]

Or perhaps excellent cooperation between organisations on matters that they agree on?

Actually as the NGO BASC and CA insurances more or less amount to the same thing why not just have a block policy for the whole lot?

 

[nic531]

people make a lot out of the insurance for legal cases..... remember that Insurance companies are not there to be your mate and bail you out in all circumstances, they are only there to make a profit for their stockholders. They will only support you if you have a strong prima facie case where there expectation of winning is high. Usually there in the small print is a phrase along the lines of 'you must follow our legal advice' .... when that advice is sell your guns and stop shooting, it is then down to you if you continue you court case! I do not personally know people who have had this issue on firearms cases but do on Motoring matters and trademark disputes... ( and before anyone bright spark says it, no they were not told to stop shooting and .....)

well done to BASC for these results.

I was told after making an enquiry that when BASC had the insurance, the excess on it, for each case, was astronomical.

 

[Steve Q]

I believe BASC asks members to make a contribution to the Appeal costs, but it understand the level is negotiable depending upon income.
Seems reasonable to me that those in trouble have skin in the game, but what do others think?

 

[Conor O'Gorman]

Actually as the NGO BASC and CA insurances more or less amount to the same thing why not just have a block policy for the whole lot?

Just to clarify that they are not the same thing at all. BASC is a first resort policy, the NGO and CA’s are both last resort policies. In other words the BASC policy responds immediately when a claim is made, for the NGO and CA you have to convince them that you have no other policy – such as your home insurance that covers you before they will take up your claim. BASC also has some additional coverage included for its members which is not available in all the other policies. It important to read the small print and to see what is and is not included in each liability policy to see which one suits your needs.

BASC member insurance

BASC membership comes with insurance you can rely on.

basc.org.uk

 

[Conor O'Gorman]

I believe BASC asks members to make a contribution to the Appeal costs, but it understand the level is negotiable depending upon income.
Seems reasonable to me that those in trouble have skin in the game, but what do others think?

No, we don’t do this.

 

[kieran222]

Well done BASC.

Would it be worth targeting one particular constabulary and using the funds to persistently challenge that constabulary. A single win against one constabulary would not really change the constabulary's policy but multiple cases would. If BASC's policy was to target the constabularies that had the most revocations in turn this might persuade each constabulary to keep the number of revocation down.

Multiple losses by a constabulary is likely to change their policy and deter others from being targeted by BASC in the future. That must be the ultimate goal, to ensure revocations are only done after detailed review by the police. At the moment there are no consequences for the police if they don't do a thorough review of the facts.

 

[Steve Q]

Hi Kieran,

Nice thought but BASC can only challenge where there has been a genuine injustice. Launching an Appeal where revocation is justified is a pointless exercise if the objective is simply to "kick" one force. Besides, doing that would destroy BASC's ability to work with that force in other issues.
Better to pick the "just" battles and fight them where ever they are.

 

[ContinShots]

For those who think every BASC should get legal services to fight revocation of certs , are they also ok with paying many hundreds a year more at each renewal . Go buy your own legal cover insurance for such events or take a mortgage out / dive into your own funds etc .

Not a single person has advocated for that in this thread, not that I can see. You seem to be pushing back against something that no one has been arguing for.

 

[ContinShots]

Most members will have received copious comms from BASC about support for legal challenges. I know I have, for some time. And BASC has a long history of supporting legal challenges that benefit the shooting community as a whole - dating right back to the case that established that handguns could be still be held on a FAC for humane dispatch.

We had lots of info at the time about why BASC dropped its short-lived experiment with legal fees insurance. As for such insurance from other orgs, SACS dropped their legal fees element but, unlike BASC, didn't make any public announcement. The NGO (of which I am also a member) has a bolt-on, costing about £28. Fair enough. The BDS made much of its legal insurance until recently, and then dropped it. So did the CCC, in a very hasty manner which left some of its longstanding policy holders in the lurch - though I believe that both it and the BDS now offer the same bolt-on as the NGO, at about the same additional cost.. The CPSA include legal insurance, but for SGCs only, and when I asked them about any court successes, they couldn't name a single one!

That's great. But not everyone has the time to listen to podcasts. I really don't understand why it seems to be such a big deal for there to be a short overview of a) the support available and b) basic criteria for supper being considered by BASC on the membership pages (which I've just had a look over and can't see any mention of this anywhere amongst the run down of potential member benefits). Relying on historic emails or something said in a podcast doesn't inform members who for whatever reason missed or didn't see them, and it certainly doesn't appraise new or potential members. The reluctance to be more open about it is really most odd. I don't understand it. You can flesh it out a bit and advertise it as something members may be able to apply for without creating a rod for your back, if that's the concern. It would not only be helpful to members, it may also make it clearer to the police that unfair, unjustified or ultra vires refusal are revocations are going to he challenged.