Trophy heads - are we falling into a trap or just a marketing ploy?

[John Gryphon]

Equally, finding and shooting a medal class buck is largely down to luck/management or dare I say it opportunism

err also the fact that the top of the line stags/bucks are far fewer in numbers than the 'also rans'

A pair of ptarmigan shot as a left and a right in the "bleak midwinter" are in my mind a far greater candidate

Oh yeah agreed,five shots for five ducks lifting off a reed enclosed waterhole factor highly for me. They had to lift vertically.

I turned down a gold roebuck a few years back, he later was sold to a continental for a few grand,

oh you miserable git ha ha ha

I shot this stag below very early one morning, just me, me dawg,me 7mm mag and most importantly I was wearing my KJV cap. My old and great mate Kelvin John Viney a real Tasmanian deer hunter had passed away from cancer and he had requested that 'the blokes wear some camo to his funeral' The cap was my camo choice for the funeral and I put his initials inside it as can be seen. I wear the cap often when I am out. The sambar stag? Who gives a ****! It was a rippin` shot and a **** poor quality "head" but its the memory of my mate that holds fast. Some of my and others experiences of shooting 'schitt heads' often outweigh the classy heads.

 

[Apthorpe]

I think we need to honest here - releasing “farmed” animals the day before or even on the day is not acceptable - to me and I suspect to the general public. That is on a par with releasing partridges from crates over the guns which we all know is going on - on a shoot near you….

Wonderful PR. Who needs antis?

 

[VSS]

Wonderful PR. Who needs antis?

He's not wrong though.
It does happen, and it's not acceptable.
And if we don’t call out that sort of behaviour then the antis will.
Someone has to.

 

[jimmer.13]

Perhaps it boils down to our basic instincts of providing the kill to our community or families. The bigger the better and the elevation in the community at being the better hunter. ( just guessing here)
Not hunting to supplement our diet or choosing not to eat meat is a relatively new phenomenon in the grand scheme of human evolution.

 

[Apthorpe]

He's not wrong though.
It does happen, and it's not acceptable.

How do you know? If you have knowledge of it happening, why haven't you reported it to the police?
To me, this seems as spurious as other anti fieldsports claims people have made without identifiable factual basis - most of which have not beem found true.

And if we don’t call out that sort of behaviour then the antis will.
Someone has to.

If it exists. But if it doesn't exist, then we're being useful idiots for antis.

 

[Foxyboy43]

Wonderful PR. Who needs antis?

Not PR just fact and has been said it needs to be stopped - best from within rather than by those who only wish to harm shooting.

 

[Foxyboy43]

How do you know? If you have knowledge of it happening, why haven't you reported it to the police?
To me, this seems as spurious as other anti fieldsports claims people have made without identifiable factual basis - most of which have not beem found true.

If it exists. But if it doesn't exist, then we're being useful idiots for antis.

Are you seriously saying “if” and do you really think reporting it to the police with the resultant negative impacts on shooting is best?

 

[Apthorpe]

Are you seriously saying “if” and do you really think reporting it to the police with the resultant negative impacts on shooting is best?

Yes. Are you seriously saying you think it's better to ignore the law and withhold evidence from the police? That would seem a touch unethical to me, wouldn't it?

 

[Foxyboy43]

Yes. Are you seriously saying you think it's better to ignore the law and withhold evidence from the police? That would seem a touch unethical to me, wouldn't it?

The simplest way to stop this is within by quietly spreading the word round the shooting community - you may be surprised how effective this is…

 

[Mountain Bug]

Those who wish to harm hunting or shooting are not going to be swayed by anything that I do to try and appease them. I'm confident that in most of their minds I am a horrible person whether my target is a buck, doe, boar, sow or a silhouette that looks like an animal. I will never hide who I am or what I do nor feel any shame because of it. If someone wants to try and discredit me, then let them try because I live as honest a life as I can, free from the charades of society, and my choice of trophy head or trophy meat is not any of their business. You can't be liked by everyone without swallowing your own weight in cr#p during a lifetime.

Scott

 

[NoIDeer]

There is nothing wrong with trophy hunting, it can put a lot of money into the economy of the area where it is done and nowadays often to the benefit of the hunted species.

Canned trophy hunting is a **** poor show but from an animal welfare point of view I can't really see the difference between that and "wild" park deer, both are kept to be shot at some point.

Lastly, I think that most of us keep a good head when we shoot one, is that trophy hunting?

 

[Cootmeurer]

Trophies aren't to my taste at all, but who does it benefit to disparage those people who value such an animal at thousands, rather than merely £2 a kg?
If someone values shooting a fine headed animal highly, so much the better for everyone. All this anti-trophy hunting stuff is nothing more or less than emotive silliness generated by antis, and should be treated as such.

Exactly my line of thought. Plenty of room
In the sport for people of all persuasions. Some one may desire to spend thousands/tens of thousands/hundreds of thousands on a monster racked animal. And that person most certainly contributes to conservation with dollars that make that species worth something - and the habitat is therefore valuable.

At the opposite end is someone that shoots nothing but cull animals for meat and never takes a photo. That person also contributes to conservation

To each their own - enjoy it your way, and as long as it’s ethical let others enjoy it their way

 

[alberta boy]

I am a meat hunter first and foremost , as my late father used to say ," horns make thin soup ". A lot of that comes from where I am , geographically and culturally. The majority of my friends are first nations , Cree or Metis , they hunt for meat and care nothing for Antlers . They've rubbed off on me over the years . I don't have a problem with Trophy hunting , it's just another part of what we do . As long as it's done respectfully and legally and the meat isn't wasted . I've kept a few sets of Antlers over the years , mostly because they were taken on a particularly memorable hunt ,not because of their trophy quality . If hunting animals with Trophy sized antlers is what it takes to get you out in the field , I'm all for it , it just isn't my thing .

AB

 

[John Gryphon]

I can't really see the difference between that and "wild" park deer, both are kept to be shot at some point.

well who shoots either? I dont and that is for sure.

 

[VSS]

How do you know? If you have knowledge of it happening, why haven't you reported it to the police?
To me, this seems as spurious as other anti fieldsports claims people have made without identifiable factual basis - most of which have not beem found true.

If it exists. But if it doesn't exist, then we're being useful idiots for antis.

Interesting. I never previously had you down as the naive type.

I have witnessed such practices with my own eyes, and challenged it.
(Partridge being released on the morning of a shoot).
And have heard first-hand accounts, from trusted sources, of similar occurences involving "trophy" stags.

So there's no doubt in my mind that it happens.

Yes. Are you seriously saying you think it's better to ignore the law and withhold evidence from the police? That would seem a touch unethical to me, wouldn't it?

I don’t think it's illegal.
It's just shockingly bad practice, contrary to all the game shooting welfare codes, and the sort of behaviour that brings fieldsports into disrepute. And the sort of thing that antis love to use in their propaganda against animal cruelty. We're just handing it to them on a plate, unless we stamp it out.

 

[cjm1066]

I have a few heads on the wall, some have been scored, they are memories.

In south Africa I was stalking black wildebeest, then the trophy fees were discussed. The one I shot was wary and a stalk, the trophy male was sitting and hadn't seen me.

Stalking for a trophy say a gold medal means getting close to and rejecting many animals, it gives you more challenges than meat hunting when you can shoot the first legal animal.

But then targeting the 3 leged fallow in a wood full of fallow was a similar challenge.

 

[Apthorpe]

Interesting. I never previously had you down as the naive type.

I have witnessed such practices with my own eyes, and challenged it.
(Partridge being released on the morning of a shoot).

With respect, that is not what was alleged - releasing birds directly over guns is illegal and zi don't think it happens. I shall remain naive until there is some evidence to show otherwise.
Releasing birds during the shooting season is a different matter and rather a case of damned if you do and damned if you don't. Where antis complaon about environmental impacts, those are obviously minimised by releasing closer to the time of shooting. I've little sympathy for commercial shoots but they do provide a lot of wider benefits (as well as often being obnoxious ****s). People need to make a living in the countryside and for many, that is a part of it.

This fits a pattern of people making damaging claims on the bath of rural myth. They generally turn out to be false or ar best seriously misrepresentative.

And have heard first-hand accounts, from trusted sources, of similar occurences involving "trophy" stags.

So there's no doubt in my mind that it happens.


I don’t think it's illegal.

That's because you may be blurring the line. Releasing animals directly to be shot is not the same as releasing them beforehand.

It's just shockingly bad practice,

it's a fair enough viewpoint, it's certainly not very sporting, but then in my view nor is shooting pheasants on the ground. I'm just not sure whether that means it needs stamping out. By shooters turning anti.

contrary to all the game shooting welfare codes,

Is it?

and the sort of behaviour that brings fieldsports into disrepute. And the sort of thing that antis love to use in their propaganda against animal cruelty. We're just handing it to them on a plate, unless we stamp it out.

In your.mind, the choice is we're handing antis propaganda if we don't act as antis for them?
Just about any activity can be made to look bad if one takes an unbalanced perspective - including farming animals, or what I call the "my cousin vinny" perspective on deer stalking.....
Here

Must we also stamp ourselves out? Or could we instead take a sensible view where we're not all shooting each other in the foot over spurious allegations?
There are certain groups of people who cannot be negotiated with and who one can't reach a compromise with. It is best not to indulge them.

 

[John Gryphon]

Btw one very well known scoundrel here in Vic was releasing (maybe still does) fallow bucks onto a property for the unknowing client. I imagine that after buying the buck/s they were kept without feed for "x" amount of days prior to release so when let go the first thing they do is put their head down to feed close to the release point without heading off to another property. "oh look,theres one,ooh he`s a good one too,26 points or more,take him"

 

[Rafter]

Appeasing the antis is a short and slippery road to nowhere.
By doing that, you give them power they otherwise wouldn't have, so **** em, and carry on.
Just for the record, I have never shot anything that ended on a wall - but I have zero problems with folks who do.

 

[John Gryphon]

Appeasing the antis is a short and slippery road to nowhere.
By doing that, you give them power they otherwise wouldn't have, so **** em, and carry on.

Exactly this. Give the ****S nothing!