Are you a Deer Stalker or a killer?

[Dorsettaff]

Man has used technology since the dawn of time to give him an advantage in catching/killing game...bows, spears, flint/bronze/iron heads, throwing sticks etc....
Even apes use sticks and rocks to prise animals out of trees to eat....does that make them technicians?

No matter how we dress up, both literally and metaphorically, what we do, the end result is a kill, which in my mind should be quick and humane. If that means GPS located, laser guided, range locked, smart projectiles then so be it.
As other people have said if you want to have an evenings foot stalk and get up close and personal then fine....take your camera and enjoy the challenge.
If its to fill your freezer, appease your landowner or stuff your trophy room then slings, sights and bipods are all great adjuncts in my book.

Artschool....make sure those spears and arrows you use are over 6mm please.....you don't want to be under-speared on a hunt!

 

[David T]

Come on, the guys on the wind-up. Don't bite. Probably a good personal friend of daven !

 

[Lightyear]

Me....I just like eating them...Too old and slow to run after them so shoot them off a bi-pod or sticks, or bag or from a high seat.

Moreover, don't give much thought to how that would label me !

Cheers & ATVB

Philip

 

[jimbo1984]

The American lads sure have some great ideas ....God I miss daven !

 

[MARCBO]

As I asked earlier; Are you a stalker or a killer. If your only concern is to take meat I propose that you are just a deer killer and anything (technology or tactic-wise) goes. If you are a stalker, as a sportsman, not a subsistance hunter, you should not be relying on technology to substitute for your lack of knowledge or skills.

There is a group in the US that calls themselves "The One-Mile Deer Hunters". They set-up with benchrests, lasers etc. and actually fire test shots before engaging animals they locate in their "hunting area", a distance side hill. While certainly successful they are not true sportsman. There is little difference between using s benchrest and a bipod in my mind, just a step above basic shooting skill. I could care less how small of a group you can shoot from an artifical rest, it proves nothing. A real rifleman can hit what he is aiming at on unknown terrain at an unknown distance (within his limitations) with the first shot without a bunch of supporting technology.

SS

 

[jonylandrover]

I shoot deer off sticks or bipod or anything I can use to help at the time, I use a scope. I shoot mainly most of my deer to eat myself or if causing damage to crops on a small plot of 35 acres. What am I? Killer or stalker?

 

[MARCBO]

I shoot deer off sticks or bipod or anything I can use to help at the time, I use a scope. I shoot mainly most of my deer to eat myself or if causing damage to crops on a small plot of 35 acres. What am I? Killer or stalker?

The psychologist would ask: "What do you think you are"?

SS

 

[urx]

If we are going to resort to the latest technology to take game are we even truely hunters? I propose that we are not, merely technicians.
SS

classic troll behaviour - dont feed the

 

[David T]

God I miss daven !

Like a hole in the head.

 

[plonker]

As I asked earlier; Are you a stalker or a killer. If your only concern is to take meat I propose that you are just a deer killer and anything (technology or tactic-wise) goes. If you are a stalker, as a sportsman, not a subsistance hunter, you should not be relying on technology to substitute for your lack of knowledge or skills.

There is a group in the US that calls themselves "The One-Mile Deer Hunters". They set-up with benchrests, lasers etc. and actually fire test shots before engaging animals they locate in their "hunting area", a distance side hill. While certainly successful they are not true sportsman. There is little difference between using s benchrest and a bipod in my mind, just a step above basic shooting skill. I could care less how small of a group you can shoot from an artifical rest, it proves nothing. A real rifleman can hit what he is aiming at on unknown terrain at an unknown distance (within his limitations) with the first shot without a bunch of supporting technology.

SS

Awe,I'm glad for you.You certainly know what your on about
Opinions are like arse holes,everybody has one!
Hunter,killer or stalker,who cares,put whatever tag on it you like.
Dave

 

[Stingercargill]

The American lads sure have some great ideas ....God I miss daven !

Where is daven ?? Is he banned ?

 

[MARCBO]

Hunter,killer or stalker,who cares,put whatever tag on it you like.
Dave

Although it may be semantics, there is a difference between sportsmen and deer killers.

SS

 

[palmer_mike]

Where is daven ?? Is he banned ?

No still on here

 

[Ronin]

Here in the UK there are several types of "deer manager"

The recreational stalker who has a small or several small patches of land and kills a few deer a year, stalking them in the traditional manner

The recreational stalker who has no land and pays to go with professional guides / stalkers - again low volume

The semi professional stalkers / deer managers who manage woodland on behalf of landowners and cull as per the owners wishes - cull numbers are usually higher, stalking may be traditional, but may also involve ambush techniques to achieve numbers to acceptable levels

The professional stalker / ranger / guide - someone who is employed to manage large tracts of land, has cull figures to achieve and will employ stalking (close), longer range "ambush" and are pretty effective at what they do.



Which am I?

Well the closest category for me is the third, I can stalk close, I can take them from further out, it depends on the circumstances, terrain, topography and season - I wouldn't discount or dismiss rifle skills when managing deer. Neither would I dismiss or discount skills of those who get in close where applicable.

However much I like to see and watch deer, I'm a killer.

 

[Chasey]

I see a lot a traffic here about high value guns with higher value scopes being shot off of some form of artifical rest, bipod etc. I propose that those using such are not stalkers but rather shooters. A friend of mine who is a professional forester there in the Uk described hiself as a deer killer, not a stalker. I think these folks with their "sniper" set-ups are also "Deer killers", not stalkers. We are no longer subsistance hunters and in my mind are not true sportsmen unless we are shooting off our elbows or at most using a leather sling. Any moron with hi-tech equipment can shoot deer fron long ranges but they are certainly not stalkers.

SS

I have never shot a deer that I havent eaten

I strugled for a while with the concept of shooting fox magpie and crow because I dont eat them but now I am convinced it helps the farmer I am all right with it.

I cant get excited about trophies in dear stalking. 5 pointers and gold what ever meen nothing to me I would prefer to shoot the smaller younger more suculant one

Having shot a deer on a stalk I loose any desire to shoot a second one the same day unless I can think of somone to give it too who realy wants it.

QED I dont consider my self a dear killer. If I wanted to kill deer id do something stupid like use a big gun to shoot them with thus blasting half the meet to hell

ATB

Chasey

 

[NigelM]

You sir, are a Dinosaur.

I'm just an amateur, not a pro like I'm sure you are. I have only knocked over 6 deer so far this year, the furthest was 120 yards, the nearest about 40 yards. All on foot, none from a high seat. I consider that range about normal for the southern stalking I do, when on the hill it's more like 100 to 150 normally. A good stalk is a lot more satisfying than a long shot. I shoot 40 to 50 a year and have done for 10 years or so.

I do however have all the "high tech" kit you refer to and am very happy to use it. Of the 6 I have shot this year 4 were off a bipod, 2 off the sticks. None were shot freehand and I did use a big variable power scope rather than iron sights. I will always get on the bipod if it's possible. I home load for accuracy and consider my rifles to be surgical instruments.

Why? Because it's bloody irresponsible not to in my opinion. We owe it to our quarry to be as accurate as we can possibly be, not take risks so we can talk opinionated bo**ocks about people making it too easy for themselves these days. That means I use the technology and why none of use are still using bow and arrows. I love deer, they are some of the most beautiful creatures on earth. I cull them because the population has to be controlled by someone and I love everything about the management and the sport.

And every now and again you are grateful that you have the kit and know how to use it. The beast with the broken leg at 450 yards that needs putting out of it's misery, the Switch holding hinds on the flats that you have not been able to get into for the past couple of days but is keeping the Royal at bay. There is a time and a place for it.

I find it best to respect other peoples opinions and ways of doing things rather than ram my opinion down their throats, the world would be a pretty boring place if we all thought the same way and from time to time you learn something new. Perhaps you might like to think about a similar approach.

 

[MARCBO]

You sir, are a Dinosaur.

I'm just an amateur, not a pro like I'm sure you are. I have only knocked over 6 deer so far this year, the furthest was 120 yards, the nearest about 40 yards. All on foot, none from a high seat. I consider that range about normal for the southern stalking I do, when on the hill it's more like 100 to 150 normally. A good stalk is a lot more satisfying than a long shot. I shoot 40 to 50 a year and have done for 10 years or so.

I do however have all the "high tech" kit you refer to and am very happy to use it. Of the 6 I have shot this year 4 were off a bipod, 2 off the sticks. None were shot freehand and I did use a big variable power scope rather than iron sights. I will always get on the bipod if it's possible. I home load for accuracy and consider my rifles to be surgical instruments.

Why? Because it's bloody irresponsible not to in my opinion. We owe it to our quarry to be as accurate as we can possibly be, not take risks so we can talk opinionated bo**ocks about people making it too easy for themselves these days. That means I use the technology and why none of use are still using bow and arrows. I love deer, they are some of the most beautiful creatures on earth. I cull them because the population has to be controlled by someone and I love everything about the management and the sport.

And every now and again you are grateful that you have the kit and know how to use it. The beast with the broken leg at 450 yards that needs putting out of it's misery, the Switch holding hinds on the flats that you have not been able to get into for the past couple of days but is keeping the Royal at bay. There is a time and a place for it.

I find it best to respect other peoples opinions and ways of doing things rather than ram my opinion down their throats, the world would be a pretty boring place if we all thought the same way and from time to time you learn something new. Perhaps you might like to think about a similar approach.

Discourse is a great way to learn things. Often closely held beliefs are disproven when dicussed. Boring are the ideas that are never discussed and everyone just nods their head in agreement, the "kings new clothes" thing.

SS

 

[Chasey]

Discourse is a great way to learn things. Often closely held beliefs are disproven when dicussed. Boring are the ideas that are never discussed and everyone just nods their head in agreement, the "kings new clothes" thing.

SS

On this you have my full agreement

ATB

Chasey

 

[highland stalker]

I see a lot a traffic here about high value guns with higher value scopes being shot off of some form of artifical rest, bipod etc. I propose that those using such are not stalkers but rather shooters. A friend of mine who is a professional forester there in the Uk described hiself as a deer killer, not a stalker. I think these folks with their "sniper" set-ups are also "Deer killers", not stalkers. We are no longer subsistance hunters and in my mind are not true sportsmen unless we are shooting off our elbows or at most using a leather sling. Any moron with hi-tech equipment can shoot deer fron long ranges but they are certainly not stalkers.

SS

What a plonker.

 

[Tackleberry270]

Although it may be semantics, there is a difference between sportsmen and deer killers.

SS

I agree but in your first 'response provoking' statement you have implied that the difference is in how the individual equips himself for the task. This couldn't be further from the truth. Its the mindset of the individual behind the rifle not the type of kit they decide to use. Also, some have a foot in both camps as I'm sure some who are involved in larger culls can be killers to achieve the quota but take a different approach at other times.