badger cull

Badgers are the major wildlife vector of bTB in the UK.

Other countries have their own vectors (NZ - Possums and feral ferrets, the latter fellow mustelids). Deer play a very minor, if any role in the spead of the disease to cattle. There is so much ******** talked about this subject, but other countries have identified and gone a long way to solving the problem years ago. New Zealand and Ireland in particular. The powers at be may wish to decide on how this problem will be dealt with but no reasonable person who has studied the evidence can doubt the science behind the link.

Think back to when TB was a major killer in humans, it spread between people in damp tenament buildings in overcrowded conditions. These conditions are replicated perfectly in setts. One infected badger entering an infected sett will potentially infect all the others. The tubercle bacteria can then persist of a year or so in that sett once it has been cleared of the last animal. Culling of a badger population may not be sufficent if the sett can not be kept depopulated for at least this period. We are of course all waiting for an effective oral vaccine. It would be a relatively easy exercise to give to all badgers in an area given their ready acceptance of baits such as peanut butter.

In Ireland as previous mentioned they have an effective seek and destroy on badgers on setts on and around bTB infected farms. Local farmers are visited. Setts identified and animals caught by cage trap or snare, most of which are autopsied. Land owners have the right to refuse entry to allow culling. though most do not as they feel for their neighbours who have their cattle herds locked up. In NZ there have been mass arial poisoning of possums with 1080, the other extreme, and not to be advocated - though it does show that control of the vector population has a real effect on the disease levels in domestic stock.

Just as the role of the badger in bTB spread is underplayed there seems to be general overplaying of the role of deer in disease spead. Scientists generally consider wild deer to be end hosts in the disease. They get TB and are indicators of disease in the environment but don't really pass it on to other animals, particularly cattle. There would of couse be a small amount of deer to deer spread from mutual grooming and deer to badger spread if infected carcases are scavenged upon. Infected badgers are a different matter, the bacteria in the badger has a predeliction for the kidney and infected animals urinate large numbers of bacteria onto pasture where they can infect cattle. Also cattle, being inquisitive animals will sniff and lick dead and dying badgers.

Deer to deer spread of bTB is greatly increased if animal are concentrated for winter feeding.
 
It is almost impossible for people to catch bovine tb or spread it

Absolute rubbish.

How people forget. Bovine tuberculosis now rarely occurs in people because of the safeguards in the farming industry. Proper meat inspection and pasturisation of milk products. But humans are as susceptable to the disease as much now as they ever were. And if they do get it they will pass it to their friends and family.

Tell those affected in the third world that TB is just an economic disease..........
 
Already covered mel. ;)

HO Guidance

Badgers
14.21 The Protection of Badgers Act 1992
makes it a criminal offence to kill or injure
badgers except in limited circumstances
(for example, as a mercy killing, as an
incidental result of a lawful action or under
a licence issued by DEFRA). If badgers are
to be shot, this must be done with a
smooth-bore weapon of not less than 20
bore or a rifle using ammunition having a
muzzle energy of at least 160 foot pounds
and a bullet weighing not less than 38 grains.
.270Win perfick then!!!!:D
 
As usual alot of crxp spoken by ill-informed people on this forum, humans do not pass tb to cattle it is almost impossible for people to catch bovine tb or spread it,bovine tb is a economic disease like foot and mouth, without control would destroy the uk meat industry. Camilids are a possible source of infection along with deer, at present there is not a reliable test for either. There is no doubt that badgers carry Tb and are a possible source of infection and the only way to find out is sustained cull in a test area. As for the member of this forum who suggested farmers who take advantage of the cull, should not claim for there losses under TB, needs to ask himself that if he was in a industry where so called do gooders could prevent him from making a living would he be happy. And I Hope the the land he shoots on never has a tb outbreak or he may never see a deer again.

Camelids a possible source of infection? Horse poo! Camelid breeders are far more aware of Bio-security than most livestock breeders as they receive bugger all compensation if the poo hits the fan. You are correct in that a lot of crap is spoken by ill informed people. Correct that a reliable test has yet to be perfected. As a pedigree camelid breeder I live in fear of TB, I have over £140k worth of livestock and without either a vaccine or a properly managed cull I could be shut down over night if ever (God forbid) I have an issue, if I lose an animal worth nearly £10k I will receive £750. The sooner sanity is restored and badgers reduced to a sensible population the better. Anyone on here who gets a proper licence to cull badgers gets a free range session with me!

HME
 
if they are going to do it, they would be better just doing it!
my dad had a meeting with local MP last year and was discussing, amongst other things, this issue, the MP, who to be fair seemed to talk sense on a variety of subjects, said that the problem is any time someone comes up with a decent plan, somebody else says they need to write another report and another report! The MP suggested that while they were trying to decide upon details of a cull, then await probably another report, why not just work around the known setts, test it for tb. if tb present, gas the sett, if not leave it. Seemed like a fairly sensible idea to me, although im pretty sure i have a lot less knowledge on the subject than others.
 
Craigievarkiller if you you put your brain in gear before your mouth you would know that Scotland is TB clear therefore healthy badgers cannot infect healthy cattle and visa versa. 375 Mag you are ill informed and ignorant of the facts, I am surprised that you can carry a rifle and that chip at the same time.

Dear JeffreyL

Firstly, there is/was no need to be rude and impolite when replying to posts. Although forum members will at times have different opinions, you can put these forward in a civil and polite manner. Frankly, you were insulting to both myself and 375 Msg.

Secondly, you would do well to take onboard your own advice and make sure of your facts prior to comment.
Recent studies have shown that in certain areas in Scotland, Badger populations have been shown to be up to 10% positive for TB.
Although Scotland does enjoy EU TB 'clear' status (only since 2009), this does not actually mean that no cases of Bovine TB are encountered. Positive TB reactors have been and are still being encountered in the Scottish herd, although at a very low level and at a level that secures qualification for clear EU status.
 
Meat inspection as we know it in the uk was brought in to combat TB,for someone to say its not contagious is ridiculous.........
 
They could have just put them on the general licence without publicising it..... and the anti's would have been none the wiser.

Does anyone know what the plans are for carcass disposal?
 
They could have just put them on the general licence without publicising it..... and the anti's would have been none the wiser.

Does anyone know what the plans are for carcass disposal?

Remembering that the general License is for avian pests I have visions of "flying pigs"
 
Is there a way of scoring a trophy badger?

Amazingly...............yes!

Dachs Meles meles (Linné, 1758)

English: Badger; French: Blaireau; Albanian: Vjedulla; Bulgarian: Jasowez; Czech: Jezevec (lesni); Croatian: Jazavec; Danish: Graevling; Estonian: Mäger; Dutch: Das; Finnish: Mäyrä; Greel: Asvos; Hungarian: Borz; Italian: Tasso; Irish: Broc; Japanese: Nihon-anaguma; Korean: Osori; Lettish: Apsis; Lithuanian: Barsukas; Mongol: Dorgo; Montenigrin: Jasovec; Norwegian: Grevling; Pashto: Gurkach; Polish: Borsuk; Portuguese: Teixugo; Romanian: Bursuc, Viezure; Russian: Borssuk; Swedish: Grävling; Serb: jasavac; Slovakian: jazvec (lesny); Slovenian: jazbec; Spanish: Tejón; Turkish: porsuk; Urdu: Bijjoo.

transparent.gif

Former distribution: Europe and Asia to China, Korea and Japan.
Present distribution: As formerly, except northern Scandinavia, Iceland, Corsica, Sardinia and Sicily. South to Israel, Lebanon, Syria, Turkey, Iran, Tibet (Xizang) and southern China, Burma, northern Vietnam.
Behaviour: Preferred habitat: mainly forests, open woodlands, parks, mountainous and rocky areas in moderate climates. Activity predominantly nocturnal, also at twilight. They are omnivorous, eating various small prey, worms, young rabbits, mice, beetles, larvae, eggs, young birds, all kinds of plants and fruit, also carrion. They are gregarious, and hibernate in the northern areas of their range i.e. Scandinavia, Poland and northern USSR.
Population status: Stable.
Brief notes:
Body weight: 10-20 kg
Head and body length: 60-95 cm
Tail length: 15-19 cm
Shoulder height: 20-30 cm
Gestation period: 4-12 months
Maximum age: 25 years in captivity
Trophy: Skull length 11.7 cm, width 7.5 cm; CIC: 19.2 points.
Hunting methods: With terriers, dachshounds in the setts (burrows), traps and from a hide.
Subspecies: 14
 
Remembering that the general License is for avian pests I have visions of "flying pigs"

Now there's a point... I heard someone refer to badgers as pigs recently and struggled to make the connection, is it a common term for them or just coincidence?
 
Now there's a point... I heard someone refer to badgers as pigs recently and struggled to make the connection, is it a common term for them or just coincidence?

Might be because the male is a boar and the female a sow? Other than that I can find no reference, ancient or modern, to them being referred to as 'pigs'. Could it be a localised thing?

The only other very tenuous link might be via the Dutch/Afrikaans 'Aardvark' for Earth Pig - was he from South Africa?
 
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Good response from Dama. Trouble is the whole debate is polarised by which "side" you are on, the badgers or the cattle. The best and simplest explanation I heard was: "We have the same disease in big black and white animals and little black and white animals. They share much of the same environment. We've decided to control it by testing and slaughtering the big animals but not the little ones"
HME, sorry, but camelids are a huge problem. Partly because the response to the test is poor. Agree that the TT skin test is not perfect, but it is currently all we have.
 
Good response from Dama. Trouble is the whole debate is polarised by which "side" you are on, the badgers or the cattle. The best and simplest explanation I heard was: "We have the same disease in big black and white animals and little black and white animals. They share much of the same environment. We've decided to control it by testing and slaughtering the big animals but not the little ones"
HME, sorry, but camelids are a huge problem. Partly because the response to the test is poor. Agree that the TT skin test is not perfect, but it is currently all we have.

Buchan
To suggest Camelids are a huge problem is laughable at best. 99% of Camelid herds are locked down because we do not receive the compensation that other livestock breeders do and simply cannot afford the risk of contamination. Badgers spread TB, fact. I live in one of the hotspots where the authorities are conducting their ridiculous vaccination trials. My farm where the range is based is surrounded by farms shut down by TB where it was unheard of before the explosion in the badger population. Camelids are well known to react to the test and then prove negative as a good friend of mine found to his cost after having over £200k of livestock destroyed. The sooner the stripey b******s are reduced in number the better.
 
I SEE SO MANY" ROADKILL" BADGERS IT,S ALMOST AS IF THEY WERE BEING SHOT AND THEN BEING DUMPED AS A SUPPOSED ROAD CASUALTY...SURELY NOT !:suss::stir:Anton
 
ytene, I'm sure there are unscrupulous people out there who take the law into their own hands, but I would expect them to find better ways of disposing of the evidence than that. Personally I fail to understand why the badger, a species which is classified as "Least Concern" on the IUCN Red list, enjoys the protection it does. Other species in that category include fallow deer and red deer, as well as the red fox. The common thread here is that all these species can be shot almost at will. Whilst I admire the badger, they are undeniably powerful and fascinating, if they were a threat to my livelihood I would want to be able to protect myself, as I could against rabbits, deer and foxes. Why does the badger enjoy this lofty status of protection?

As an aside, I hear that badger is actually pretty good eating!
 
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