Confusion with Reloader 19 data.

[FrenchieBoy]

I am about to start developing a load for my .243 using Reloader 19 with Norma 100g SP bullets. I have found the load data online as supplied by and listed as Alliance Powder Reload Recipes but it has left me a little confused so I am hoping that someone " a little more in the know than me" can advise me.
The Data for Reloader 19 gives a Charge Weight of 43.5 grains. This is the only figure given for the charge weight, it does not give a Start Weight or a Max Load Weight. Should I assume that the weight of 43.5 grains is the MAXIMUM LOAD or the MINIMUM LOAD for 100g bullets?
Can anyone who knows about and uses Reloader 19 please advise?

 

[jcampbellsmith]

A couple of things to note - it's Reloder 19. Secondly, in the page prior to the actual data it says as follows -

REDUCE RIFLE AND HANDGUN CHARGE WEIGHTS BY 10% TO ESTABLISH A STARTING LOAD.

DO NOT EXCEED THE LOADS DISPLAYED ON THE SITE OR ALLIANT'S RELOADERS GUIDE.

Alliant Powder - Reloader's Guide

Merry Christmas.

JCS

 

[FrenchieBoy]

Thank you for pointing that out to me, you have been very helpful JCS!
So looking at that I ought to be starting the load at somewhere around 39 grains and working up from there ensuring that I do not exceed the 43.5 grains - Basically the load weight that they give of 43.5 grains is the MAXIMUM LOAD.

 

[JTO]

Load some of your once-fired cases with the Lee Loader and try them in your rifle. I recently did this for a friend and none of them would go back in the same rifle(243 Remington 700), I had to full-length resize them. Loaded them again at what was supposed to be low charges and had horrendous pressure signs with many blown primers.

 

[geoffrey]

This might help

Cartridge : .243 Win.
Bullet : .243, 100, Norma SSP 66003
Useable Case Capaci: 49.766 grain H2O = 3.231 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.698 inch = 68.53 mm
Barrel Length : 23.0 inch = 584.2 mm
Powder : Alliant Reloder-19


Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 2.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !


Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms


-20.0 78 36.00 2415 1294 30629 9343 88.7 1.523
-18.0 80 36.90 2474 1359 32665 9650 90.0 1.483
-16.0 82 37.80 2533 1425 34832 9948 91.3 1.445
-14.0 84 38.70 2592 1492 37143 10236 92.5 1.408
-12.0 86 39.60 2652 1561 39606 10513 93.6 1.366
-10.0 88 40.50 2711 1632 42234 10779 94.7 1.326
-08.0 90 41.40 2771 1704 45037 11031 95.6 1.287
-06.0 92 42.30 2830 1778 48028 11269 96.5 1.250
-04.0 94 43.20 2889 1853 51191 11491 97.3 1.214 ! Near Maximum !
-02.0 96 44.10 2948 1929 54547 11697 97.9 1.179 ! Near Maximum !
+00.0 98 45.00 3006 2007 58122 11886 98.5 1.146 ! Near Maximum !
+02.0 100 45.90 3065 2085 61934 12056 99.0 1.113 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0 102 46.80 3122 2165 66000 12206 99.4 1.082 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+06.0 104 47.70 3180 2246 70340 12336 99.7 1.052 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+08.0 106 48.60 3237 2327 74978 12445 99.9 1.023 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+10.0 108 49.50 3294 2409 79938 12531 100.0 0.995 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!


Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 98 45.00 3142 2192 69011 11655 100.0 1.063 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 98 45.00 2822 1769 47501 11513 92.8 1.253

 

[FrenchieBoy]

Load some of your once-fired cases with the Lee Loader and try them in your rifle. I recently did this for a friend and none of them would go back in the same rifle(243 Remington 700), I had to full-length resize them. Loaded them again at what was supposed to be low charges and had horrendous pressure signs with many blown primers.

Was this with Reloder 19 please JTO?

Edit: I ought to add that I have used a Lee Loader for both .222 and .303 in the past and have not experienced any problems that needed F/L Resizing for each reload and nor did I experience any signs of pressure stress on any cases or primers. This was however using Hodgdons Powder in both cases.

 

[JTO]

Was this with Reloder 19 please JTO?

Edit: I ought to add that I have used a Lee Loader for both .222 and .303 in the past and have not experienced any problems that needed F/L Resizing for each reload and nor did I experience any signs of pressure stress on any cases or primers. This was however using Hodgdons Powder in both cases.

No, it was N165.
I have previously used Lee Loaders for 284W and 223rem with no problems.

 

[Muir]

This might help

Cartridge : .243 Win.
Bullet : .243, 100, Norma SSP 66003
Useable Case Capaci: 49.766 grain H2O = 3.231 cm³
Cartridge O.A.L. L6: 2.698 inch = 68.53 mm
Barrel Length : 23.0 inch = 584.2 mm
Powder : Alliant Reloder-19


Predicted data by increasing and decreasing the given charge,
incremented in steps of 2.0% of nominal charge.
CAUTION: Figures exceed maximum and minimum recommended loads !


Step Fill. Charge Vel. Energy Pmax Pmuz Prop.Burnt B_Time
% % Grains fps ft.lbs psi psi % ms


-20.0 78 36.00 2415 1294 30629 9343 88.7 1.523
-18.0 80 36.90 2474 1359 32665 9650 90.0 1.483
-16.0 82 37.80 2533 1425 34832 9948 91.3 1.445
-14.0 84 38.70 2592 1492 37143 10236 92.5 1.408
-12.0 86 39.60 2652 1561 39606 10513 93.6 1.366
-10.0 88 40.50 2711 1632 42234 10779 94.7 1.326
-08.0 90 41.40 2771 1704 45037 11031 95.6 1.287
-06.0 92 42.30 2830 1778 48028 11269 96.5 1.250
-04.0 94 43.20 2889 1853 51191 11491 97.3 1.214 ! Near Maximum !
-02.0 96 44.10 2948 1929 54547 11697 97.9 1.179 ! Near Maximum !
+00.0 98 45.00 3006 2007 58122 11886 98.5 1.146 ! Near Maximum !
+02.0 100 45.90 3065 2085 61934 12056 99.0 1.113 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+04.0 102 46.80 3122 2165 66000 12206 99.4 1.082 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+06.0 104 47.70 3180 2246 70340 12336 99.7 1.052 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+08.0 106 48.60 3237 2327 74978 12445 99.9 1.023 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
+10.0 108 49.50 3294 2409 79938 12531 100.0 0.995 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!


Results caused by ± 10% powder lot-to-lot burning rate variation using nominal charge
Data for burning rate increased by 10% relative to nominal value:
+Ba 98 45.00 3142 2192 69011 11655 100.0 1.063 !DANGEROUS LOAD-DO NOT USE!
Data for burning rate decreased by 10% relative to nominal value:
-Ba 98 45.00 2822 1769 47501 11513 92.8 1.253

I think the OP wanted to clear up confusion, not add to it. ~Muir

 

[geoffrey]

I think the OP wanted to clear up confusion, not add to it. ~Muir

I don't think it will add to confusion,it states quiet clearly that 43.20 grains in near maximum, if anybody finds this too confusing maybe they should not be reloading. ??

 

[FrenchieBoy]

I don't think it will add to confusion,it states quiet clearly that 43.20 grains in near maximum, if anybody finds this too confusing maybe they should not be reloading. ??

Spot on. There is nothing confusing about it saying that 42.3 grains is near the maximum safe load just as it is clear as day that anything from 45.9 grains is a Dangerous Load and should not be used!

 

[Muir]

I don't think it will add to confusion,it states quiet clearly that 43.20 grains in near maximum, if anybody finds this too confusing maybe they should not be reloading. ??

A page full of numerical jiberish compared to simply answering the OP's question doesn't add to the confusion? He didn't ask for the maximum load. He asked for clarity as to whether ALLIANT was stating that this number was minimum or maximum. Simple question requiring a simple answer -which he got. ~Muir

 

[FrenchieBoy]

A page full of numerical jiberish compared to simply answering the OP's question doesn't add to the confusion? He didn't ask for the maximum load. He asked for clarity as to whether ALLIANT was stating that this number was minimum or maximum. Simple question requiring a simple answer -which he got. ~Muir

Guys, I got the answer I was looking for plus some extra information that I hadn't asked for so really speaking this thread is a winner all round.
Thanks all for your help!

 

[Harry mac]

I don't think it will add to confusion,it states quiet clearly that 43.20 grains in near maximum, if anybody finds this too confusing maybe they should not be reloading. ??

Or maybe the format in which you laid out the data is not the best?
The soup of numbers you provided meant nothing to me at first because the column headings are out of sync, which makes the meanings of the abbreviations unclear.
So maybe I shouldn't be reloading. I'll pack it in straight away.
If it had looked something like this, I would have found it clear as a bell, rather than a coded message which needed deciphering.
[TABLE="width: 200"]
[TR]
[TD]Step %[/TD]
[TD]Fill %[/TD]
[TD]Charge grn.[/TD]
[TD]Vel. fps[/TD]
[TD]M.E. ft/lb[/TD]
[TD]p Max p.s.i.[/TD]
[TD]p Muz p.s.i.[/TD]
[TD]Prop burnt B[/TD]
[TD]Time ms[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]-20.0[/TD]
[TD]78[/TD]
[TD]36[/TD]
[TD]2415[/TD]
[TD]1294[/TD]
[TD]30629[/TD]
[TD]9343[/TD]
[TD]88.7[/TD]
[TD]1.523[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

But maybe that's because I'm used to reading a reloading manual, rather than a computer load programme.

 

[Muir]

Or maybe the format in which you laid out the data is not the best?
The soup of numbers you provided meant nothing to me at first because the column headings are out of sync, which makes the meanings of the abbreviations unclear.
So maybe I shouldn't be reloading. I'll pack it in straight away.
If it had looked something like this, I would have found it clear as a bell, rather than a coded message which needed deciphering.
[TABLE="width: 200"]
[TR]
[TD]Step %[/TD]
[TD]Fill %[/TD]
[TD]Charge grn.[/TD]
[TD]Vel. fps[/TD]
[TD]M.E. ft/lb[/TD]
[TD]p Max p.s.i.[/TD]
[TD]p Muz p.s.i.[/TD]
[TD]Prop burnt B[/TD]
[TD]Time ms[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]-20.0[/TD]
[TD]78[/TD]
[TD]36[/TD]
[TD]2415[/TD]
[TD]1294[/TD]
[TD]30629[/TD]
[TD]9343[/TD]
[TD]88.7[/TD]
[TD]1.523[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

But maybe that's because I'm used to reading a reloading manual, rather than a computer load programme.

Sensible man.~Muir