duff primer?

New Avon Arms
andychas

andychas

Well-Known Member
Supporter
anyone seen this happen before?
its a misfire on the cartridge on the right, Im thinking its just a duff (or contaminated?) primer but would welcome any other thoughts from the mass of experience here.

Rifle
Blaser professional 6.5x55

Load
Norma once fired but FLR brass, primer pocket cleaned and flash hole uniformed.
IMR4350 45.5gn
Fed 210 primer
Sierra Gameking 130gn BTHP
not chronographed

this load was the most accurate developed in half grain increments (42gns to 46gn) and all others fired so far at that load (about 30) have been fine, as were the 20 development rounds. no pressure signs on any of the loads btw.

Its a mates rifle, new to him, shot 200 norma factory through it, (he's an experienced hand loader in 22-250 himself but due to recent house move, not got gear set up). We did the data research and loading together and were careful to check measurements of the FLR cases against factory and book having read some headspacing stories re Blaser. Priming was done by hand using a sinclair hand primer set correctly, all primers looked and felt correct as they went in.

There was no sound of primer ignition on this, just a click when he was doing some range practice, bullet is still in the case btw but I've not measured OAL against load data to see if there was any partial ignition and bullet movement (safety protocols of course followed, 30 sec wait before cartridge ejected etc) and yes there was (still is) powder in the case.

Would welcome any thoughts, observations etc always keen to learn and see if we did anything wrong for next time! If it is just a duff primer, what are peoples experience of how often that happens?

many thanks in advance
Andy



IMG_6166.webpIMG_6167.webp
 
Andy,

Friend of mine had a similar issue with a Blaser in .300WM....the dreaded "Blaser click".

I would suggest you look at the two most likely factors:-

1/ Duff primer. Possible but if it happens again in the same or next batch then is there another issue
2/ Headspace. Have you "over sized" the case? If the shoulder has been bumped back too far then there may be a headspace issue and the travel of the firing pin will push the cartridge forward but fail to ignite the primer by failing to push the cap against the anvil. Get a headspace gauge.. Check the length off the shoulder of the cartridge that didn't fire. Then check the length of a fired case and set up the full length resizer to bump the shoulder back just a couple of thou.
3/ If its a repeating problem then check the firing pin.

Mind you ...that looks like a serious indentation in the primer!

I'd pull that round and carefully remove the primer....reseat the primer in another sized case......don't add powder or bullet ....load it and fire it! If it goes bang...it wasn't the primer!
 
thanks Dorsetstaff thats interesting and very helpful,
I read about the "Blaser Click" and we were careful to check the headspacing was correct. Its always possible that a mistake has been made of course, so I will check that particular case as you suggest (Ive got a headspace comparator gauge). re removing the primer, safest/easiest to do that as per normal with the decapping pin on the sizing die?
That rifle has had about 250 rounds through it from new, its the only time thats happened so hopefully not a firing pin issue! Personally I've not had a duff primer, interesting to hear of anyone who has?
 
Looks like a good strike on the primer. Probably just a duff primer (could be one of several different reasons). Shoot enough rounds and you will experience the odd duff primer every once in a while with both factory ammo and reloaded ammo.
 
I've had several similar instances recently with CCI400 primers. Three misfires in one outing with brass that was once fired, fire-formed and neck sized only, so no headspace issues. Followed the same protocol, waited 30 seconds and removed/inspected cases to find a what appeared to be a decent strike mark. Re-loaded the cartridges and on the next strike, they fired fine with no issues. Never had this issue previously so I'll strip and clean the bolt as it doesn't take much crud build up behind the pin shoulder to affect striking force. In your shoes, as a matter of ruling things out, it might also be useful to strip/inspect and clean the bolt/firing pin assembly.
 
Excessive force seating primers is another failure mode - you know that grit the teeth and break the lee priming tool mode...
 
Would it be one in a thousand misfire? It happens just rarely

I once had some boxes of magtec ammunition which liked to hang fire 4-5 seconds that was not nice. Nothing as loud as the clang of the firing pin.
 
thanks Chester, these were fed210 but sounds like a plan to have a look at the firing pin.
misfires are one of those things that I guess Ive been lucky to avoid with rifles, Ive seen it happen relatively often with shotguns both at clays and in the field, but then you might be seeing a few thousand shots per day at clays or on a pheasant day versus just a couple on a stalking outing. I guess percentage misfires must be around the same in both cases?
 
I had an identical experience, perfectly normal strike indentation but no bang. CCI large rifle primer.

When I dismantled the round I found that the primer had at least partially fired and there were sort of stalactites of burnt powder/ carbon projecting out of it...I saved it and will see if I can photograph it.

When I read up about it I came to the conclusion that I had seated the primer to deep...crushed it slightly as Sauer90 suggests. I prime using the Lee Safety Primer Feed and the press ram so I do have a lot of leverage to play with. This also means you have a lot of travel and therefore feel...but I reckon I overdid it that time.

Alan
 
interest Alantoo, I'll check that next week when I dismantle the round. I use a Sinclair hand feed and have got pretty used to the right "feel", always possible to make a mistake though. be interesting to see the pic of the part fired primer.
 
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andychas said:
interest Alantoo, I'll check that next week when I dismantle the round. I use a Forster hand feed and have got pretty used to the right "feel", always possible to make a mistake though. be interesting to see the pic of the part fired primer.
Click to expand...

Will try this evening when I get back. Tried with the phone at the time but it was too small.

Alan
 
had it more than a few times with CCI 450's and once with fed 210 gold only the other week (new box)
 
looks to me as though the primer was not fully seated ie the anvil had not bottomed out in the primer pocket
 
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Hi African Jack, I know what you mean from the pics but it was def fully seated, I'm sure of that and my mate checked them all too. Theres a sort of mushrooming backwards towards the firing pin, I'll try and get some more pics and dismantle the round to see if there was partial ignition as per Alantoo post above but thanks to you and everyone else for all the thoughts and advice, very useful and informative as always!
 
It looks to me like a perfectly good 'strike' on the primer. The difference between the look on the 2 bases is more likely due to the second round being fired, so the primer on the successfully fired round has flattened out in the pocket.
I'd be interested to see what it looks like once dismantled.
 
the strike is good but if the anvil has not bottomed out it can cause a misfire yes the second one has flattening because its been fired dismantling the round will not show if the anvil was bottomed out as the pin strike will have moved the primer forward. in my opinion it was a duff primer or not seated correctly
 
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Photos not too brilliant I am afraid and the prominent pillars of stuff I saw in December seem to have wilted and flopped onto the outer face of the anvil.

What it looks more like now is a fabric has been pushed forwards and wrapped around the anvil. There is a curious ovoid shiny thing behind the rear anvil leg.

You can see it is part blackened but still much shinier and less tarnished than a normal fired primer.

The other photo shows the primer still in its case...front right...next to its batch mates after I had removed the bullet and powder. It shows the same soft edged but full depth crater as yours.

Alan

_DSC8361.webp_DSC8364.webpIMG_3101.webp
 
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