FAC air rifle or .177 HMR

[Andy seatrout]

I’m normally fairly certain about what decision to make regarding shotguns or firearms…. But I’m in a bit of a quandry…. As context I have 6.5 x55, .243, .223, .22LR rimfire and a 12ftlb Weirach rifle (and about eight shotguns from 28 bore to 12, but they’re less relevant).

So squirrels…. I may be taking on a new shoot where the owner is keen to hit them hard, I have traps which are massively successful, and whilst my .22LR is really accurate I’m torn between a HMR for longer range ‘sniping’ ( I have my eye on a 2nd hand CZ455 for which I have an adjustable Boyd’s stock - I’m a bit unit and I find it a rifle fits it’s better for me) and / or a Theoben eliminator which has had a new gas ram fitted with thin hole stock 25ftlb…

The HMR is £400 the Theoben £500

It’s a little illogical because they do different things- I can knock over a squirrel at 50 yards with the rimfire, but as I get closer if they run up the tree the air rifle could be used…. I’d not want to use the 12ftlb as tbh I find squirrels tough buggers …if your shot placement isn’t perfect - bear in mind this is usually freehand shooting…

Thoughts? Which would be more versatile ?

 

[merlin]

I'd opt for FAC air (full disclosure: I shot squirrels with air rifles, both sub-12 & FAC), and get some feeders going to draw them in. Then wallop them. With the FAC air, you can still clobber them off branches etc in the vicinity of the feeder, with a .22lr you'll be more restricted as you'll need a trunk behind them as a backstop.

Rimfire has to place - I have a 17hmr in the cabinet - but for squirrels it is always an air rifle I take.

 

[B&W FOX]

HMR gives you the extra range

 

[Bowland blades]

I’m normally fairly certain about what decision to make regarding shotguns or firearms…. But I’m in a bit of a quandry…. As context I have 6.5 x55, .243, .223, .22LR rimfire and a 12ftlb Weirach rifle (and about eight shotguns from 28 bore to 12, but they’re less relevant).

So squirrels…. I may be taking on a new shoot where the owner is keen to hit them hard, I have traps which are massively successful, and whilst my .22LR is really accurate I’m torn between a HMR for longer range ‘sniping’ ( I have my eye on a 2nd hand CZ455 for which I have an adjustable Boyd’s stock - I’m a bit unit and I find it a rifle fits it’s better for me) and / or a Theoben eliminator which has had a new gas ram fitted with thin hole stock 25ftlb…

The HMR is £400 the Theoben £500

It’s a little illogical because they do different things- I can knock over a squirrel at 50 yards with the rimfire, but as I get closer if they run up the tree the air rifle could be used…. I’d not want to use the 12ftlb as tbh I find squirrels tough buggers …if your shot placement isn’t perfect - bear in mind this is usually freehand shooting…

Thoughts? Which would be more versatile ?

Forget the gas ram thoben , seriously a good spring gun beats them , anything over 15 ftlb is a difficult gun to shoot accurately . Yeah i have had a few ! A good air arms springer ( the system developed by the Pope familly ) well ? fantastic and low maintainance .
Theobens are horrid unreliable beasts compared to many PCP airguns.
HMR is rubbish in my experience can shoot well but inferior to the hornets 22lr is still the Boss of the RF . lower powder or HV .22 ammo can answer a lot of needs without another gun but we dont have to tell your feo eh ? If thats what you want

 

[Bowland blades]

I'd opt for FAC air (full disclosure: I shot squirrels with air rifles, both sub-12 & FAC), and get some feeders going to draw them in. Then wallop them. With the FAC air, you can still clobber them off branches etc in the vicinity of the feeder, with a .22lr you'll be more restricted as you'll need a trunk behind them as a backstop.

Rimfire has to place - I have a 17hmr in the cabinet - but for squirrels it is always an air rifle I take.

Depends on location and the ammo your putting into the .22 lr

 

[Smellydog]

HMR.

 

[eggy74]

Eliminator weighs a bloody ton, I would say fac air but get a pcp

 

[Tazz]

HMR much longer range than 22rf but with squirrels you still need to consider backdrops when taking tree/branch shots. Upside of FAC rated air rifles is they lose a lot of money second hand a 30-50flb rated one would be ideal in 22 or 25 in woodland, look beyond the Theobann and get a multi shot

 

[Pedro]

Well effectively you can't shoot up into trees with the HMR, but otherwise it stretches the range you can knock those pesky squirrels over. Really only you can say which one will get the better use. Of course the air rifle will be cheaper to feed. There's pros and cons to both, with only one real solution. Get one of each!

 

[Zetter]

It depends on how you plan to hit the squirrels really.

If you really plan to go to town on them then set up feeders and wallop them as they come in. They will take no notice of their dead mates on the deck and will wander over them to get to the grub. I do all my squirreling this way on a couple of permissions as its easy to have a good day every time by checking you feeders regularly and see which are going down bait wise so you can set up on the busy ones.
In this case FAC air all day long as it delivers more than enough energy to smack them hard on the feeders (which are generally attached to a tree off the ground to stop other larger animals getting at it i.e. badgers) and gives you the flexibility to take elevated shots if they wont fully commit to the feeder. also they are quiet so you dont cause loads of disturbance.
I would though if you have £500 to spare not to even consider the Theoben and get an FAC PCP air rifle which should be easily achievable for that budget which will then give you mulit shot capacity as well.

If you are planning on ranging around and taking opportunity shots on the ground then the HMR is very flexible on numerous quarry and does give a lot of range but for squirrels however I cant see it being the most efficient option. If I am off for a wander and fancy a change a pace especially now when the leaves are down I generally just take out the shotgun to take them in the trees or if I spot them put dreys through with a heavy cartridge and shoot them as they come out. This can be especially effective if there are a couple of you.

 

[Kevgun]

Theoben Rapid 7 was built for that very Job, I use mine a .20 30ft lb model on the Tree Rats with good effect. the bonus is FAC models are cheaper than sub 12 models and there plenty on Guntrader easy to repair with £5 worth of o rings and off you go again.

 

[Andy seatrout]

Depends on location and the ammo your putting into the .22 lr

I’m not easy with firing a .22LR into a tree of any description….. the odd ricochet I’ve had on dry ground while rabbiting has made me think ‘soft backstop’ every time…..

It’ll do the job but my thoughts are HMR- I can shoot them in the ground ( off sticks if necessary ) at 70-90 yards… and the bullet will fragment- so a bit safer

The air rifle- still good at 50 yards like the .22 rimfire, but if the bugger runs up a tree then if he presents a shot I can shoot in the air ( travel for a .22 pellet being hit that far and fairly harmless falling to earth…..

My younger brother ( who died in 2009) had a Theoben eliminator FAC - and whilst it was an effort to cock it was accurate ….. I regret not buying it off him when he sold it …. But I didn’t have an FAC at the time…. Got one in 2012

 

[Andy seatrout]

I’ll have a look at the precharged market thanks for your responses so far and experiences…. As an aside it’ll be in the wood with my release pen so I’d not want to make a terrible racket with a shotgun or rifle …. Whilst no problem now- August to Jan I’ll want to be quiet

 

[Zetter]

I’ll have a look at the precharged market thanks for your responses so far and experiences…. As an aside it’ll be in the wood with my release pen so I’d not want to make a terrible racket with a shotgun or rifle …. Whilst no problem now- August to Jan I’ll want to be quiet

Sounds like FAC air is just the ticket get one, stick up a few feeders and go to town

 

[Bowland blades]

I’m not easy with firing a .22LR into a tree of any description….. the odd ricochet I’ve had on dry ground while rabbiting has made me think ‘soft backstop’ every time…..

It’ll do the job but my thoughts are HMR- I can shoot them in the ground ( off sticks if necessary ) at 70-90 yards… and the bullet will fragment- so a bit safer

The air rifle- still good at 50 yards like the .22 rimfire, but if the bugger runs up a tree then if he presents a shot I can shoot in the air ( travel for a .22 pellet being hit that far and fairly harmless falling to earth…..

My younger brother ( who died in 2009) had a Theoben eliminator FAC - and whilst it was an effort to cock it was accurate ….. I regret not buying it off him when he sold it …. But I didn’t have an FAC at the time…. Got one in 2012

ITs fine with cci quiets ! Just so long as your shooting at a steep enough angle with a background that is known clear . Check them out and do the ballistics
Let me qualify ( even a 12 ft lb airgun should not be fired skywards without a safe back drop) the quiet is sub 700 fps with a 40 grain bullet , do the calculation at 70 degrees say and thats without tumbling ( which will occur )

 

[Bowland blades]

I’m not easy with firing a .22LR into a tree of any description….. the odd ricochet I’ve had on dry ground while rabbiting has made me think ‘soft backstop’ every time…..

It’ll do the job but my thoughts are HMR- I can shoot them in the ground ( off sticks if necessary ) at 70-90 yards… and the bullet will fragment- so a bit safer

The air rifle- still good at 50 yards like the .22 rimfire, but if the bugger runs up a tree then if he presents a shot I can shoot in the air ( travel for a .22 pellet being hit that far and fairly harmless falling to earth…..

My younger brother ( who died in 2009) had a Theoben eliminator FAC - and whilst it was an effort to cock it was accurate ….. I regret not buying it off him when he sold it …. But I didn’t have an FAC at the time…. Got one in 2012

Nope ! HMR ricochet just are not Audible , its the same with deer calibre rifles ( they are genrally still traveling supersonic )

 

[Andy seatrout]

Nope ! HMR ricochet just are not Audible , its the same with deer calibre rifles ( they are genrally still traveling supersonic )

Well that’s something I didn’t know, I thought the tiny fast bullet would be fragible

 

[ChrisJB]

Theobens are horrid unreliable beasts compared to many PCP airguns.

blasphemer

 

[Smellydog]

Well that’s something I didn’t know, I thought the tiny fast bullet would be fragible

They are but can bounce, like anything but....with a heck of a lot less weight than a 22. The CCI 20g fmj will zing a bit.
I don't worry about it. The zinging is from a severely mangled bullet and it is losing energy fast. Over hyped usually by the doom doctors.

 

[Bowland blades]

Well that’s something I didn’t know, I thought the tiny fast bullet would be fragible

Its not actually very fast at all especially if it impacts when its actually gone past 100 yards . Frangible bullets even in CF at 4000 fps cannot be trusted to not ricochet . Ricochet potential is always kinetic energy and never based on a claim of frangiblity .
Personally speaking i found HMR amazing little pills , right up to the point i hah shot it a lot . I got a lot of over frangiblity at short range , had a particulary gruesome injury on a hare at around 50 yards when a bullet broke up - on the scull ( i didnt expect that ) . Also a longer range ricochet sending a bullet a fair way and of course silent like all supersonic ricochets are ( you only know about them when they hit something you didnt want to put a hole in. Not as scary as a 140 grain gameking that did once, but still something i would never wish to repeate