Getting things right with the Lansky system

[oxfordshirestalker]

Hi folks,

I’ve got one of the Lansky sharpening systems (the one on the stand with the separate hones).

Despite following all of the instructions to the letter and stropping afterwards, I’m not entirely satisfied with the results.

I’ve just spent half an hour sharpening a mora £10 jobby. It’s gliding through copier paper but certainly isn’t shaving sharp.

Now I totally agree that you don’t need a shaving sharp knife to gralloch a deer, but I was hoping to get to that like the videos given the time spent!

Sharpening at 25 degrees - maybe that’s the issue? (But seemingly the correct angle for a working knife?)
Some might argue it’s the quality of the knife…?

 

[Utectok]

25 degree is the correct angle and shaving sharp should certainly be possible with knife and sharpener combo. What’s the finest grade you finish with? I find a few swipes with lansky mini ceramic sharper puts it into the shaving territory judging by my bare legs and arms lol

 

[Utectok]

This works way better than stropping for me Lansky The Mini Sharpener

 

[oxfordshirestalker]

Thanks - maybe I didn’t spend long enough which the coarser stones to iron things out (wasn’t in great condition having been abused). I did go down to the ultra fine stone.

I’ll give another knife a go and see where I get to

 

[Cottis]

Do not use something like the above sharpener if you ever want to have your Mora back to a proper Scandi ground knife.

The best bit of advice I can give is to start with understanding the basics of knife design and the different bevel geometry that different knives are designed with. That will help you choose the best sharpening method for your knife relative to the skill set you have.

Scandi ground knives (like Moras) are very easy to sharpen. Think of a house roof with both edges sloping upwards until they meet to perfectly apex and form the ridge. Now turn your Mora upside down so it is sitting on its spine with the cutting edge pointing at the sky. Think of it like a roof. Those two large bevels either side of the knife (which from memory on a Mora are going to be like nearly 10mm wide from belly to tip) need to be in full contact with the abrasive so that you are removing metal entirely from the whole surface area. When you have removed enough metal, the entire bevel will be in contact with the abrasive and you will begin to see/feel a burr being created on the opposite side of the knife that you are sharpening. When this burr is felt along the entire length of the opposite side of the knife, you switch sides and do the same thing until that burr is created on the opposite side. Then do single strokes alternatively on each side for a few strokes the knife will be like a razor. A burr is effectively the edge folding over slightly on itself because you have created such a thin, fine piece of metal on the edge with very little meat behind it. Then stay on top of it with frequent touchups which will be much less onerous and will help maintain a knife that is always sharp.

With edged tools, it is imperative to understand the geometry. Then you can make informed decisions on how to realise your goal.

If you want your Mora to be a true scandi grind, the Lansky is the least suitable knife sharpener I could imagine using. Firstly you are limited with angle choices and if you do manage to position the knife in the clamp perfectly to realise the somewhat correct angle of the abrasive, it will take yonks to remove enough material to apex the two bevels.

Use a flat stone and do it by hand. The large size of the bevels on a scandi make it very easy and intuitive to feel the bevel while in full contact with the stone. It is like a natural guide for you unlike a very fine flat or V ground blade (like an opinel or a chefs knife or similar) which needs a lot of touch and feel and memory when sharpening to retain the required angle on the abrasive to ensure consistent sharpening.

 

[Cottis]

Pictures always explain better.

First up is a very fine bevel. The shiniest piece of metal closest to the edge is on a v grind blade. I suspect you are trying to put an edge on your Scandi grind Mora similar to this. That is not how the knife is designed. The knife below needs to have just that tiny little shiny area in contact with the stone/abrasive to remove the necessary metal to apex the two edges.

Your knife is a Scandi like the knife below. Can you see how a very large area I have sharpened entirely. I have removed metal from both sides until they apex perfectly. This was a friend's knife and I sharpened it to a ridiculous mirror finish on 2500 wet n dry paper stuck to a piece of granite to show him how to sharpen scandis. You remove material from that entire surface area until the two bevels meet to form the perfect edge.

 

[teflon]

Ive been using the Lansky system for a few years now and every couple of months i set aside a couple of hours to sharpen every decent knife i own. Including, work knives, a Bokker EDC, kitchen cooks & filleting knives and my outdoor knives and it works perfectly well on all of them. It just takes a bit of getting used to. If you run a marker pen along the cutting edge of the blade you can tell where you're sharpening more as the ink gets ground off.

 

[Bowland blades]

Hi folks,

I’ve got one of the Lansky sharpening systems (the one on the stand with the separate hones).

Despite following all of the instructions to the letter and stropping afterwards, I’m not entirely satisfied with the results.

I’ve just spent half an hour sharpening a mora £10 jobby. It’s gliding through copier paper but certainly isn’t shaving sharp.

Now I totally agree that you don’t need a shaving sharp knife to gralloch a deer, but I was hoping to get to that like the videos given the time spent!

Sharpening at 25 degrees - maybe that’s the issue? (But seemingly the correct angle for a working knife?)
Some might argue it’s the quality of the knife…?

If you set up to change the origonal geometry on a knife with a sharpening system your pretty much doomed to fail . This task really needs a grinder to re-establish the new geometry and a user with experience. It can then finished with stones by hand and eye and then will benefit further a going over with the buffer wheel with compound or leather strop.

 

[Utectok]

I have an excellent understanding of knife geometry I have to disagree that scandi knives can’t be sharpened with a micro bevel at the edge. Whilst sharpening the whole bevel is fine equally a micro bevel works just as well on scandi grind and is somewhat quicker. The factors that I note affect edge attainable are quality of steel, consistency of sharpening angle and correct amount of time with the various grades of sharpening equipment. The whole “you must sharpen scandi this way” thing is total nonsense, you can, but it won’t necessarily be better than a micro bevel.

 

[Steff]

Resharpening a Skandi grind in its original angle is awfully tiresome and the result will look rotten unless you go down to polishing grade. This is hardly worth the effort for a Mora. They can well be perfectly sharpened with a 25 degree micro bevel. I do it all the time.

Getting tired of getting the clamping right on my Lansky I modified it a bit. It now used magnets to fix the blades into position.

 

[Mungo]

I have an excellent understanding of knife geometry I have to disagree that scandi knives can’t be sharpened with a micro bevel at the edge. Whilst sharpening the whole bevel is fine equally a micro bevel works just as well on scandi grind and is somewhat quicker. The factors that I note affect edge attainable are quality of steel, consistency of sharpening angle and correct amount of time with the various grades of sharpening equipment. The whole “you must sharpen scandi this way” thing is total nonsense, you can, but it won’t necessarily be better than a micro bevel.

I have 2 scandis with micro bevels and they’re extremely (dangerously) sharp and very easy to maintain.

I have enormous respect for @Cottis and his experience and knowledge, but I have to disagree here!

That said, the Lanskey is a nightmare to use with many thicker bladed knives, and I never managed to get it to work well with them.

 

[Mungo]

Resharpening a Skandi grind in its original angle is awfully tiresome and the result will look rotten unless you go down to polishing grade. This is hardly worth the effort for a Mora. They can well be perfectly sharpened with a 25 degree micro bevel. I do it all the time.

Getting tired of getting the clamping right on my Lansky I modified it a bit. It now used magnets to fix the blades into position.

View attachment 385384

Nice!

The clamping system in the lanskeys is deeply flawed! This looks like a very effective solution.

In fact the more I look at it, the more I think it should be a standard.

 

[Tim.243]

I have an excellent understanding of knife geometry I have to disagree that scandi knives can’t be sharpened with a micro bevel at the edge. Whilst sharpening the whole bevel is fine equally a micro bevel works just as well on scandi grind and is somewhat quicker. The factors that I note affect edge attainable are quality of steel, consistency of sharpening angle and correct amount of time with the various grades of sharpening equipment. The whole “you must sharpen scandi this way” thing is total nonsense, you can, but it won’t necessarily be better than a micro bevel.

I have a good understanding of sharpening tools from drawing out a worn out chisel to the tiniest lathe tool which doesn't take very long but the long drawn out affair of these systems is not for me so I go about it a different way.
If I sat down in a jobbing work shot for the amount of time people say they spend on a knife I would get my p45 lol

 

[Drum123]

Nice!

The clamping system in the lanskeys is deeply flawed! This looks like a very effective solution.

In fact the more I look at it, the more I think it should be a standard.

Yep , couldn't agree more. Definitely going to try this. I can't really see how the blade is fastened to the block to hold it in place though.

 

[Mungo]

Yep , couldn't agree more. Definitely going to try this. I can't really see how the blade is fastened to the block to hold it in place though.

Magnets.

It’s such a simple idea and so obvious once you see it.

 

[devon deer stalker]

I have several knives, for the Mora, oil stone, steel and then a leather strop, works for me.

 

[Cottis]

I have 2 scandis with micro bevels and they’re extremely (dangerously) sharp and very easy to maintain.

I have enormous respect for @Cottis and his experience and knowledge, but I have to disagree here!

That said, the Lanskey is a nightmare to use with many thicker bladed knives, and I never managed to get it to work well with them.

I think they can work well for short bladed knives like pocket knives that do not require huge amounts of work but yeah I agree, clamps are problematic unless the system in place for positioning the abrasive is infinite in its angle adjustment. Either the position of the knife or the position of the abrasive has to be fully adjustable or things just take too long.

I am not against micro bevels. I use them on some blades, they can help somewhat with certain tools for certain tasks where you want edge retention for a little longer.

I suppose I am coming from a position of wanting the sharpest knife possible with the least amount of time and effort and the OP asked about sharpening a Mora on a clamp system, which for me is not ideal. I think his life (and for most) would be made easier if he learned to do it by hand as it is so easy and very very quick (once the knife has become a true scandi) Like most, I am a sharpening dummy in that I find it difficult to maintain the angle required to repeatedly remove material in a consistent way to realise a truly apexed blade on certain knife designs. That is why you and I use stuff like the Edge Pro as we refuse to have dull knives and want something as versatile and consistent as possible. It is also a joy to use truly sharp edged tools.

With any edged tool, I look at it in terms of how can I have this as sharp as possible in as quick a time as possible whilst prolonging its working life. That includes set up time, cost of time to me and the finished article. Once a scandi grind is a true scandi grind, it takes literally less than a less minute to get out a diamond stone, spray some water on it and quickly move those two bevels across the stone to get it back to where it should be. And it is done. In seconds. You will never alter the geometry because the angle guide that we rely on with other systems, is obviously built in to the knife design. You also get a finer angle and a sharper knife. I couldn't do it faster on an Edge Pro and certainly not on any clamp system. There is too much checking to make sure everything is just so before removing material.

I guess it comes down to what people want. Easier initial solutions do not always equal easier long term maintenance. Back to the OP, if he wants to put a micro bevel on his Mora, at least in a consistent way, I would suggest using a Warthog or something like that. It would be quicker and easier than trying to position that knife in the same place every time in a clamp and then having so few angle options to repair or even introduce a different micro bevel. That seems like a really hard way to go about sharpening a knife.

Everyone will do it their way but that is how I do Moras or Scandis. For flats or v's i use systems for the reasons you know well.

 

[Jagged77]

I’ve sharpened micro bevels on scandi’s, very quick and razor sharp on Spyderco’s sharpening system (20 degrees). Also keep some with their original bevel. I always see Scandi’s as a bushcrafters edge and prefer a 20 degree bevel for general use. For finer I’ll use Shaptons and go 10/15 degrees for kitchen use. I equate knife sharpening to barrel cleaning, necessary for performance but time consuming and a bit of a faff. Love the Spyderco system for quick and excellent results.

If the OP is still having problems getting razor sharp then check for a burr (or wire). Sometimes this needs to come off with a slightly more abrasive stone but with very gentle pressure. Then finish with the strop. This way the edge will last a bit longer and you can swipe with a steel to bring it back quickly.

 

[Bavarianbrit]

I use magnets too on a home made jig.
On another point I was a draughtsman for many years until the mid 90s and we often used a drafting film called Ozalid (the maker) I picked up a roll at a knockdown price as CAD has totalled this product.
The film is ever so slightly abrasive to take the graphite from a pencil or ink better. I slice off 15mm wide strips of it and use it like you would emery cloth strips to polish off round objects and it seems to make blued barrels shine better "a deeper lustre".

 

[75]

I’ve just spent half an hour sharpening a mora £10 jobby. It’s gliding through copier paper but certainly isn’t shaving sharp.

As Cottis has said in some depth, don't bother with Mora and Lanksy. Chuck that Mora away, buy another and a simple diamond stone and strop. I tried for ages with Moras and Lanksy and they just don't go well together. IMO (as someone who can't sharpen a knife well!) Moras are the easiest of things to sharpen. You simply lay the knife on the large "scandi grind" and use that as your angle for sharpening. I don't remember the angle but it's much less than 25 degrees. A few strokes on a diamond stone or strop sticking to the factory angle and you'll be lovely and sharp.

But if it is "gliding through paper" than it's pretty darn sharp already!!