Got arrested this morning

[SimpleSimon]

I disagree
Going out shooting is a perfectly normal thing to do.
The fact that the press have folk terrified of their own shadow should not reflect on us, basically what you are saying is that we are all criminals and terrorists until the police say otherwise.

It’s that kind of thinking that’s part of the problem

I agree with you to an extent, but that's not the fault of the Police. There'll be an awful lot of people in our towns and cities who don't even realise you can legally own firearms in this country.

The police response has to be based on the information available to them, and the less info they have the higher risk the situation has to be. Two older men in wax jackets and flat caps leaving a car that's registered to a FAC holder might not get the same response as two youths in hoodies and balaclavas leaving a car recently reported stolen, but if neither description has been given they can't just hope for the best...

Going back to the first paragraph, the more we as individuals can do to promote shooting, and the more BASC, etc. can do to educate and inform, the better. People don't need to panic when they see a firearm, but they don't know that until they know it.

 

[charlie222]

I disagree
Going out shooting is a perfectly normal thing to do.
The fact that the press have folk terrified of their own shadow should not reflect on us, basically what you are saying is that we are all criminals and terrorists until the police say otherwise.

It’s that kind of thinking that’s part of the problem

So if the police don't treat a situation like this as though there is a potential threat to public safety, as a default postion, what would be your set of criteria to make an alternative decision? How would public safety when there is an actual threat be affected?

 

[finnbear270]

Sorry Sir, We'll have to nip back to the station, These leg irons won't go on your Muckboots.

 

[Jeff8861]

Yes you can make a complaint. However it will go nowhere. The actions of the officers are from what you say are in line with sop across England and Wales. If possible and you're constabulary has it text in and let them know you're out shooting. Especially if you're perm has boundaries close to where members of the public have access.
In these circumstances the call taker will conduct a THRIVE assessment. This initial discussion with thr caller and police is vital to ensue the appropriate and reasonable action is taken. If the call handler is weak or the call is vague this ultimately leaves the control room Imspector not much room so will go with sending an arv.

 

[bigtone]

It's about £30 for a body cam from Amazon,won't stop you getting arrested but you can make the coppers "famous" on social media.Also if your approached by antis it'll stop any accusations.

 

[Greenmist]

Were you near something that could be of interest or considered sensitive? For example a wood next to a former prime minister’s home is likely to trigger a robust response. A wood near nothing of interest should not.

An interesting story I heard which happened near chequers, not sure of the PM at the time as it was during the musical chairs phase of the conservative party, in a nutshell, some hare coursers decided to try some new land, it was deemed a poor choice after being face down in the mud with a HK pointed at the back of their heads

 

[Greenmist]

I disagree
Going out shooting is a perfectly normal thing to do.
The fact that the press have folk terrified of their own shadow should not reflect on us, basically what you are saying is that we are all criminals and terrorists until the police say otherwise.

It’s that kind of thinking that’s part of the problem

Perfectly normal to us, this is the reaction of an uneducated public, some of which think only the police and army have guns in this country (overheard the conversation myself)

 

[Hazlett]

I agree with you to an extent, but that's not the fault of the Police. There'll be an awful lot of people in our towns and cities who don't even realise you can legally own firearms in this country.

<snip>

the more we as individuals can do to promote shooting, and the more BASC, etc. can do to educate and inform, the better. People don't need to panic when they see a firearm, but they don't know that until they know it.

️

 

[Lateral]

I disagree
Going out shooting is a perfectly normal thing to do.
The fact that the press have folk terrified of their own shadow should not reflect on us, basically what you are saying is that we are all criminals and terrorists until the police say otherwise.

It’s that kind of thinking that’s part of the problem

I neither said, or implied any such thing. It's the attitude of entitlement, and the lack of understanding of the publics perception of firearms, of some FAC holders, that will be the cause of tougher regulations, NOT the empathy of most who understand the concerns of the public !

 

[Smellydog]

Instead of bothering over the police. Visit any suspected whistle blowers home and tell them you going to legally what ever over there. Record it on your phone and save it.

 

[kenbro]

I can tell you what’s next - after the implementations of a “call in system” it will be geo-tagging, whereby if you want to carry a firearm you will need to have some sort of GPS tracking to show where you are - it’s all part of the “death by one thousand cuts” system that seems to be being implemented and many shooters are happily waltzing along the path.

I remember looking at the US NRA spokespersons and thinking they were extreme and off-putting, I now understand exactly why they do not give one inch.

So far in my short time with firearms we have -

Lost the right to use pistols.

Lost the right to use large chamberings semi-autos.

Lost the right to use snares.

Had medical forms made compulsory (even though doctors have no obligation to complete them)

Having powders restricted through reach.

On the way to having ammunition materials restricted.

On the way to having licence costs elevated by 400%.

Can anyone think of any ground we have gained? The only small thing would be the ability to use less than 100gr bullets on red deer and use electronic scopes to shoot deer A why?…well, because for now it suits the governments environmental tree planting narrative.

When the deer numbers are down (and that will happen eventually in many areas) we will have those things taken again….

We need to vote in politicians who are not blind or liking to line their own pockets.

Don’t give ‘em ideas

 

[Budgie Smuggler]

's

 

[Miki]

This morning my friend and I had loaded weapons pointed at us, were told to walk with our hands in the air, were handcuffed, were told "you are both under arrest under suspicion of possession of a firearm", our clothes were searched searched and my car was briefly examined visually inside before "Thank you for your cooperation, sorry for the trouble but you will understand we have to investigate reports" This is not on and I would like advice as to how to stop this happening to others.
<snip>

Sounds like you were a training excercise .... things must be quiet with the ARP division.

 

[Rake Aboot]

I neither said, or implied any such thing. It's the attitude of entitlement, and the lack of understanding of the publics perception of firearms, of some FAC holders, that will be the cause of tougher regulations, NOT the empathy of most who understand the concerns of the public !

Attitude of entitlement??

We are entitled ffs !! We are entitled to own guns and shoot !

 

[Silvius]

Following up on advice I have been given I can see that this arrest does not satisfy Article 5 of the human rights act or PACE

Legal grounds for claiming this was an illegal arrest



2. Elements of Arrest under section 24 PACE

2.1 A lawful arrest requires two elements:

A person’s involvement or suspected involvement or attempted involvement in the commission of a criminal offence;

AND

Reasonable grounds for believing that the person’s arrest is necessary.

both elements must be satisfied, and

it can never be necessary to arrest a person unless there are reasonable grounds to suspect them of committing an offence.





Article 5 of the human rights act

Everyone has the right to liberty and security of person. No one shall be deprived of his liberty save in the following cases and in accordance with a procedure prescribed by law:

(a)the lawful detention of a person after conviction by a competent court;

(b)the lawful arrest or detention of a person for non-compliance with the lawful order of a court or in order to secure the fulfilment of any obligation prescribed by law;

(c)the lawful arrest or detention of a person effected for the purpose of bringing him before the competent legal authority on reasonable suspicion of having committed an offence or when it is reasonably considered necessary to prevent his committing an offence or fleeing after having done so;

(d)the detention of a minor by lawful order for the purpose of educational supervision or his lawful detention for the purpose of bringing him before the competent legal authority;

(e)the lawful detention of persons for the prevention of the spreading of infectious diseases, of persons of unsound mind, alcoholics or drug addicts or vagrants;

(f)the lawful arrest or detention of a person to prevent his effecting an unauthorised entry into the country or of a person against whom action is being taken with a view to deportation or extradition.

 

[Greenmist]

I think the response will be
They suspected you of an illegal act
They detained you until your ID was confirmed and as a firearm was involved, for their safety
And I also think they will say option C was satisfied

However, I wasn't there, if you feel your rights have been violated, I wish you well with the case

 

[Silvius]

I think the response will be
They suspected you of an illegal act
They detained you until your ID was confirmed and as a firearm was involved, for their safety
And I also think they will say option C was satisfied

However, I wasn't there, if you feel your rights have been violated, I wish you well with the case

Very likely the response but what reason do they have apart from "has rifle and had rifle"

I am not feeling violated. I just think this is an opportunity to stand up for our rights as a group and that I should do something, even if just to raise awareness. If we all just accept things, things will get worse and in the end every FAC holder has been very law abiding all their life or they would not have a FAC. We are not a bad lot.

Thanks for your good wishes.

 

[Greenmist]

Very likely the response but what reason do they have apart from "has rifle and had rifle"

I am not feeling violated. I just think this is an opportunity to stand up for our rights as a group and that I should do something, even if just to raise awareness. If we all just accept things, things will get worse and in the end every FAC holder has been very law abiding all their life or they would not have a FAC. We are not a bad lot.

Thanks for your good wishes.

I completely agree, perhaps a polite and factual letter to both the chief constable and crime commissioner even your MP should be the first step, if you are a member of a shooting organisation perhaps seek their advice (but don't expect any action)

 

[Rutland lad]

It's about £30 for a body cam from Amazon,won't stop you getting arrested but you can make the coppers "famous" on social media.Also if your approached by antis it'll stop any accusations.

Why would you want to do that ?

The officers are only doing their job. And they DO get death threats made against them - the recent murder charge against one Met officer shows that’s a real issue.
I’m not sorry to step up here - I’ve been in similar situation with the blue suit on and we do take our own security quite seriously.
I am sorry someone thinks that to ‘make them famous’ is a good idea.
The above post is in reality a threat to the officers homelife, wife, partner, children.

For just doing his job.

Ask yourself a question - if you were sent to a job with minimal info but you knew someone had a weapon (possibly shotgun possibly rifle) would you be polite but firm ? Would you put them in handcuffs until you were satisfied there wasn’t a threat ?

Or would you let them dictate what was going on and end up on the wrong end of violence (think Manchester Airport recently)

In the US someone would probably have been shot.

How lucky we are in the UK that Police still deal with things with a ‘light touch’ and I read the OP and think it still was lightly handled overall.

 

[Bavarianbrit]

I had two 9mm MP5s pointed at my head after 911 by Federal cops doing a traffic stop outside a US Rangers barracks, they had been drafted in from Hamburg in north Germany and did not know the area in Stuttgart south Germany where it happened, it is very unsettling to say the least.