How do you not get fed up

Midlandstalker2024

Well-Known Member
I’ve been trying to manage the ground I have the best I can. How do you guys not get annoyed or just fed up when you see stags you want to leave to breed just get hammered by someone else once they leave your grounds ? Not me crying or complaining, fully on board with once someone shoots an animal on ground they’ve permission it’s fair game, just saying it can still be frustrating.
 
Just the same as folk that put gamebird feeders down on their boundaries to encourage a neighbouring shoot's birds onto their ground where they don't put down as many head of game. The answer? Either get a formal or informal agreement in place or if not shoot those beats that neighbour on the offender's ground hard. Which may include the deer stalking equivalent of walking your boundaries in.
 
The only way is communication and working with your neighbours. When all your interests are aligned and you can agree to work to the collective benefit you can do things properly and allow the good stags to breed, and the cull is on the old and poor quality.

But these days when many who buying into land are doing it for very different reasons you have great difficulties.

Here in Scotland we have the biggest land owner - Forestry and Land Scotland hell bent it seems on eradicating deer from Scotland, supported by SNH and these rewilding companies and corporates raising a lot of money to buy into Scottish land for carbon credits and milking grants to plant trees - all of which involve killing all the deer.

Many of the old custodians of the land - the rangers, the stalkers, the farmers etc many of whom have been there for generations have lost their jobs and associated housing. Their houses are now Air BnBs and any deer killing is now contracted out to contractors being paid on per deer basis hung in the larder. Contractors have no loyalty to the land - just shoot as many deer as quickly as possible with absolutely no regard to long term welfare, genetics etc.

It is utter rape and pillage in the name of …….. well I don’t know.

I have recently been listening to “this is Africa pod casts”- PHs talking with each other. Conservation, habitat management and quality and ethics are all very high on the list.

It makes me equally sad abd frustrated that the 3 bits of ground i manage have all massively affected by FLS activities. By now we normally have taken 10 to 12 bucks of those between myself and stalking friends. So far we have seen 1 buck. Not shot, but just seen. We could have shot it, but decided not to. I don’t abide by you may as well shoot it because somebody else will approach as it just doesn’t sit right.

And I expect the usual “too many deer” will be shouted by some one. There may be, in certain localities. But basing cull targets on seeing 20 deer feeding on the one patch of decent food in the district in middle of winter, or on larder returns with little control over where exactly the deer come from is not good sustainable management.

We ****ed up our fishing industry through over fishing and pollution (salmon farms etc). We are doing a damn good job with our wildlife as well. Look especially at the likes of the RSPB etc and how well their lands are doing.

Stalkers should know deer. And we should educate the landowners on proper deer management for the long term. And if all they want is eradication- advise against. If we all took this approach then we might still have stalking in a few years time - along with all the associated benefits to local economies etc etc.
 
I’ve been trying to manage the ground I have the best I can. How do you guys not get annoyed or just fed up when you see stags you want to leave to breed just get hammered by someone else once they leave your grounds ? Not me crying or complaining, fully on board with once someone shoots an animal on ground they’ve permission it’s fair game, just saying it can still be frustrating.
I love it when someone shoots the really big ones.

Means I don’t have to extract them…

It’s nice to be on ground where you have the luxury to decide you can leave some. Think of it that way. And also remember that one of the strongest influences on body and antler size is simply population density. The two biggest roe heads I’ve ever shot have come off ground where I was shooting everything I saw with no attempt to be selective. By the third year of doing this, body size was up 15% and the heads were enormous.
 
I’ve been trying to manage the ground I have the best I can. How do you guys not get annoyed or just fed up when you see stags you want to leave to breed just get hammered by someone else once they leave your grounds ? Not me crying or complaining, fully on board with once someone shoots an animal on ground they’ve permission it’s fair game, just saying it can still be frustrating.
What do you want them to breed into? As the meat in the younger deer tastes the same, you get the same rate from the dealer (so long as it is presented well) So it leaves the heads, also you have to be honest you can't pinpoint which offspring is from any number of stags as you simply don't know.

£ wise as a return then wonky head stag made the same as a 14 point at the dealer
Trophy wise the difference would have been vast, and the hinds made the same at the dealer

It all sound like Jurassic Park syndrome to me.
 
It's a tough one, not just in the deer stalking world - how do we put up with stuff we can't change? The way I deal with it comes from some Zen Buddhism I stumbled across. The modern version is, Jets may fly above you, but you don't have to build a runway for them to land. I guess it is a version of "don't let them live in your brain rent free".
 
I’ve been trying to manage the ground I have the best I can. How do you guys not get annoyed or just fed up when you see stags you want to leave to breed just get hammered by someone else once they leave your grounds ? Not me crying or complaining, fully on board with once someone shoots an animal on ground they’ve permission it’s fair game, just saying it can still be frustrating.
I stopped worrying about it and just shot them myself!

I see a red deer now and in season I roll it over big headed or not!
 
I’ve been trying to manage the ground I have the best I can. How do you guys not get annoyed or just fed up when you see stags you want to leave to breed just get hammered by someone else once they leave your grounds ? Not me crying or complaining, fully on board with once someone shoots an animal on ground they’ve permission it’s fair game, just saying it can still be frustrating.
Something I learnt many years ago, there is a lot to be said for shooing the humble muntjac and roe and even fallow!

Smaller, easier to handle and better eating 😬

Bollocks to shooting reds, now I only shooting them if I really, really and I mean really have to!

Fortunately I have 2 friends that are much keener than me to shoot the bloody things, I let them get on with it.
 
I stopped worrying about it and just shot them myself!

I see a red deer now and in season I roll it over big headed or not!
I was just about to comment that. If I leave them for next year, next door will shoot them. Nowadays if I see a nice stag, it gets shot providing I can be arsed dragging it out 😂

I rather target things with funny/wonky heads. Better stories
 
unfortunately we cannot control what happens outside the grounds we are meant to look after. I try to follow my cull plan and not worry about what others do. You are right though, it is extremely frustrating.
 
unfortunately we cannot control what happens outside the grounds we are meant to look after. I try to follow my cull plan and not worry about what others do. You are right though, it is extremely frustrating.
You have to stop getting all stressed about it , their wild animals, once they cross the fence there is nothing you can do about it!
 
I love it when someone shoots the really big ones.

Means I don’t have to extract them…

It’s nice to be on ground where you have the luxury to decide you can leave some. Think of it that way. And also remember that one of the strongest influences on body and antler size is simply population density. The two biggest roe heads I’ve ever shot have come off ground where I was shooting everything I saw with no attempt to be selective. By the third year of doing this, body size was up 15% and the heads were enormous.
So you cleared the ground and pulled into the vacuum, your neighbours prime bucks he’s been avoiding shooting prematurely 😂

- I’m having a fun poke here by the way 😉
 
I gave up years ago being selective, if its on my ground, and legal, it gets shot, you cannot trust the neighbouring stalker no matter what they say, iv'e seen it all.
I prefer a spiker compared to a big stag if there are a group, easier extraction.
My landowners find out I've not shot a stag because of the tree on its head I will get kicked off.
So stop stressing and shoot them all, nothing to worry about then is there?
 
So we are starting to disregard the principles of good deer management on the basis of fellow stalker competition and not having the balls to educate landowners on what is best to leave and best to shoot…and laziness due to extraction.

Quality
 
So we are starting to disregard the principles of good deer management on the basis of fellow stalker competition and not having the balls to educate landowners on what is best to leave and best to shoot…and laziness due to extraction.

Quality
What a load of tosh, educate landowners! I can just see you running along beside the tractor with your "plan" as he is dropping the tine's in the ground ready to burn a 1000lts "We need to keep these Stags" :rofl:
 
Some species you cant really do much with, like reds who very easily will roam 15+ miles in a single night not to mention red fallow and sika all usually have dedicated rut spots that may not be on your property.
Only species that I've dealt with that you can truly leave to grow Is roe.

There's a buck I've been after now that's actually gotten up and moved from that core area he's been in for the better part of 4 months, but Its all down to the fact the doe he resides with (well around, since she has kids now) If he followed the wood down he walked an additional 500m in the open too go too that new area about a kilometre actually traveled from his core area.

Its surprising how much even the highly territorial species move especially when you watch and watch for months with that deer being in the same 150x150m area.

I suspect we'll see him exactly in the same spot after the rut ends (If I dont get him)
 
So we are starting to disregard the principles of good deer management on the basis of fellow stalker competition and not having the balls to educate landowners on what is best to leave and best to shoot…and laziness due to extraction.

Quality
Unfortunately, the "principles of good deer management" that you refer to seem largely based on preserving animals with "good heads", which is actually not particularly good deer management at all.
 
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