Is the sun setting on expensive glass?

[Roonster]

In your opinion, are the days of spending huge amounts on glass, over?

I've spoken to a few shop owners that say they can't keep products like the Alpex in stock, whilst their Swarovski display cabinet is just gathering dust.

Seems like there is a brisk trade in high-end Schmidt & Benders and Swarovskis being sold off in the Classifieds section.

Are stalkers moving en masse to the digital scopes?

 

[homer]

I personally, have a trust issue with anything digital, so won't be moving away from quality scopes any time soon.
Having said that, I had a look through a set of habrocks (I know it's not a scope but same tech), and the way it makes 1 hour after dark, look like 3 o'clock in the afternoon, was extremely impressive. I can see why stalkers would move over.
For me, the day time digital picture, is just not as good as a quality glass scope (yet!).

 

[Bavarianbrit]

Electronics seem to die after say 5 years high end glass from the 70s is still working on many rifles and is more bombproof.
Plus digital thermal scopes are still forbidden here in Germany unless they are just an add on to the front of a normal scope (German war weapons law) and it is a much larger market than the UKs.

 

[Tim.243]

In your opinion, are the days of spending huge amounts on glass, over?

I've spoken to a few shop owners that say they can't keep products like the Alpex in stock, whilst their Swarovski display cabinet is just gathering dust.

Seems like there is a brisk trade in high-end Schmidt & Benders and Swarovskis being sold off in the Classifieds section.

Are stalkers moving en masse to the digital scopes?

I went with my friend the other day to drop some Fallow off at the game dealers and were were chatting about this, we both shoot deer with digital scopes, both have swro's with the conclusion that they would not work in the times the deer come out.
Good glass will never be replaced in the situations it works best in but I have put my Z6 2.5-15x56 next to my digital scope looking at a muntjac 120 yds away next to a dark back ground the digital scope went 35 mins past the Z6 which in results is a long time. Yes you can guess but guessing the road to a lost badly shot deer.
The difference is like driving home with out your lights off.

 

[sauer]

cost of living .... what's a high end scope now? £2500 plus ?
vs
a digi scope say like Alpex at £800 new or Zulu new £ 600 ... never mind availability of 2nd hand and lower cost again

ok you never fully 100% gain on something ... there is almost always a trade off....

its cheaper , does dark /NV etc but isnt same as a true glass picture quality .. but many accept that trade off

even mid range glass is close to high end glass now ... not the gap used to be .... i think always be a place for glass

or as many do already ..use both


Paul

 

[old keeper]

Glass quality is excellent and has been for some time. I'm still using Hawke scopes I got from Deben years ago and they are still doing the job. I've had some of the top-quality scopes, Swaro's, Zeiss, etc. but in truth, I've never really found that they have made that much difference to the sort of shooting I do. I also have a Leupold that I must have had for forty years that seems to hold zero forever!
I rather doubt any of the digital gear will last that long!

 

[Tim.243]

Glass quality is excellent and has been for some time. I'm still using Hawke scopes I got from Deben years ago and they are still doing the job. I've had some of the top-quality scopes, Swaro's, Zeiss, etc. but in truth, I've never really found that they have made that much difference to the sort of shooting I do. I also have a Leupold that I must have had for forty years that seems to hold zero forever!
I rather doubt any of the digital gear will last that long!

Things change (not always for the good) a couple of things are you still using the car you had 40 years ago?
12 out of the 14 deer since Jan and all of the 8 foxes I would not have been able to see with a glass scope.
so that would leave 20 still left.
I would like to rock up with the .270 and glass scope in the day time and shoot them but the fact is I can't also the late evenings does not affect the day time work.

 

[Ronin]

Digital has its place

As does decent quality glass

For the person who visits the range or odd comp nothing replaces glass

 

[Foxyboy43]

Glass quality is excellent and has been for some time. I'm still using Hawke scopes I got from Deben years ago and they are still doing the job. I've had some of the top-quality scopes, Swaro's, Zeiss, etc. but in truth, I've never really found that they have made that much difference to the sort of shooting I do. I also have a Leupold that I must have had for forty years that seems to hold zero forever!
I rather doubt any of the digital gear will last that long!

I agree and my experiences mirror yours for durability but a year into ownership the light gathering of a Zulus has to be seen to be believed.
Someone really should do a video comparing a top end glass scope to a couple of digital ones. A few old hands might just get a surprise!

 

[TringSaint]

I don’t see me ditching glass altogether but I will move one rifle over to NV soon.
As others have said, anything digital will have a much shorter lifespan and a component failure out of warranty will likely result in the unit being binned
That being said, the rare of development in digital will mean that a scope today will be a poor relation to the one in 5 years time, so as long as you embrace that then you won’t be disappointed.

 

[Malxwal]

Leisure stalker, range shooter. I'd have to be forced into a specific situation before buying a digital scope. Every year I kind of get to the point where I consider it, then manage to catch up with stuff.
I have no doubt that many leisure stalkers are pushing the limits of what was lawful, and convince themselves it's necessary. As for professional users, the leaps and bounds forward in affordable tech must be a joy.

 

[BLUEROLL]

I may be wrong and the future technology could prove that to be the case, but I can`t see how digi day/night ( I have Zulus, Pard and had Alpex) units will replace the detail needed for the thick woodland stalking that I get from my Z8i.
At the moment I am testing the HIK Thunder 3/Smartclip adapter on the front of my Z8i and I think it could be the all round answer to the day stalking and night fox.

 

[Moaky]

In the US, Arken scopes seem to be taking over. Even competition guys are using these over higher end European glass. The processes and QA at SOME of these Chinese facilities seem to be getting really good and consistent. Is a £2500 Swaro or nightforce or Kales scope better? Maybe. But the margins are getting smaller and smaller and in my opinion dont justify the massive price difference. Unless you are a professional military sniper I struggle to see the justification on spending that much extra.

 

[Tim.243]

Leisure stalker, range shooter. I'd have to be forced into a specific situation before buying a digital scope. Every year I kind of get to the point where I consider it, then manage to catch up with stuff.
I have no doubt that many leisure stalkers are pushing the limits of what was lawful, and convince themselves it's necessary. As for professional users, the leaps and bounds forward in affordable tech must be a joy.

They have a duel purpose with foxing so coupled with a TI spotter then you have a second option for a few hours out, It also can create openings as I have shot foxes for farms then the deer door opened wide. From my side of the fence farmers around here like venison but love to see a picture of dead foxes from when I get them, there will be a time when all of us will pack up but I like the thought of what I did on the way.

 

[old keeper]

I agree and my experiences mirror yours for durability but a year into ownership the light gathering of a Zulus has to be seen to be believed.
Someone really should do a video comparing a top end glass scope to a couple of digital ones. A few old hands might just get a surprise!

I totally agree FB, some of the digital/thermal gear is quite remarkable and I certainly wouldn't be without my Habroks. However, being one of the (very) old hands I tend to hang on to what I know and have used with some success for very many years. I've been very privileged to have been able to use all sorts of gear over the years, some of it like thermal have been revolutionary others not so impressive.
I think a great deal of what equipment we choose depends on such factors as what quarry we pursue and the sort of land we shoot over. My main quarry throughout my life has been the fox and without a doubt, for spotting them, thermal has been a game-changer. However, for shooting, whilst I have a thermal scope I still tend to use a normal scope with either a NV add-on or a torch and it's true to say I get pretty much the same results as have done over the years.
Age too, plays a part. Except for when I am under pressure to remove a certain fox or foxes it no longer bothers me if I have a successful night or not. I enjoy every moment of being out at night with the thermal binos watching what goes on and realising how little I knew about fox behaviour when I started out all those years ago.

 

[Foxyboy43]

I totally agree FB, some of the digital/thermal gear is quite remarkable and I certainly wouldn't be without my Habroks. However, being one of the (very) old hands I tend to hang on to what I know and have used with some success for very many years. I've been very privileged to have been able to use all sorts of gear over the years, some of it like thermal have been revolutionary others not so impressive.
I think a great deal of what equipment we choose depends on such factors as what quarry we pursue and the sort of land we shoot over. My main quarry throughout my life has been the fox and without a doubt, for spotting them, thermal has been a game-changer. However, for shooting, whilst I have a thermal scope I still tend to use a normal scope with either a NV add-on or a torch and it's true to say I get pretty much the same results as have done over the years.
Age too, plays a part. Except for when I am under pressure to remove a certain fox or foxes it no longer bothers me if I have a successful night or not. I enjoy every moment of being out at night with the thermal binos watching what goes on and realising how little I knew about fox behaviour when I started out all those years ago.

Couldn’t have put it better myself sir!
The rate of change in technology is astounding and I do wonder where it will end.
Saying all that I would just love to see and hear the response of one of the new lads when asked to carry a car battery to the top of a far-off hill….

 

[Tazz]

In your opinion, are the days of spending huge amounts on glass, over?

I've spoken to a few shop owners that say they can't keep products like the Alpex in stock, whilst their Swarovski display cabinet is just gathering dust.

Seems like there is a brisk trade in high-end Schmidt & Benders and Swarovskis being sold off in the Classifieds section.

Are stalkers moving en masse to the digital scopes?

No

 

[Tazz]

I may be wrong and the future technology could prove that to be the case, but I can`t see how digi day/night ( I have Zulus, Pard and had Alpex) units will replace the detail needed for the thick woodland stalking that I get from my Z8i.
At the moment I am testing the HIK Thunder 3/Smartclip adapter on the front of my Z8i and I think it could be the all round answer to the day stalking and night fox.

I have a Z8 on my most regularly used stalking rifle with a Pulsar Krypton front thermal add on using a Smartclip adaptor, best of both worlds IMHO

 

[spanj]

In the US, Arken scopes seem to be taking over. Even competition guys are using these over higher end European glass. The processes and QA at SOME of these Chinese facilities seem to be getting really good and consistent. Is a £2500 Swaro or nightforce or Kales scope better? Maybe. But the margins are getting smaller and smaller and in my opinion dont justify the massive price difference. Unless you are a professional military sniper I struggle to see the justification on spending that much extra.

Love my arken, great scope

 

[Keith Edmunds]

Glass quality is excellent and has been for some time. I'm still using Hawke scopes I got from Deben years ago and they are still doing the job. I've had some of the top-quality scopes, Swaro's, Zeiss, etc. but in truth, I've never really found that they have made that much difference to the sort of shooting I do. I also have a Leupold that I must have had for forty years that seems to hold zero forever!
I rather doubt any of the digital gear will last that long!

As above, the 'top-drawer' scope market is under pressure from two different angles.

1.) Digital and thermal options.
2.) 'Quality' glass scopes in the £500 to £1000 bracket that really give the high end stuff a run for its money.

I use an Alpex a lot but also just bought a brand new Leica Amplus 6 2.5-15 x 56 for under £800 - what a bargain!!