Ivermectin, for the interested

[Buchan]

Just in case anyone is following this thread, the vaccines have been throughly tested, with many thousands of test people, far more than most medicines. All done in a short time, yes, which just shows what can happen when there is a need and money to acheive the goal. They work.
Not perfect, but few things are in medicine and biology, and the technology is a beautiful thing

 

[Freeforester]

I feel for those who have been severely impaired by the vaccine, where they were hitherto in good health. I know some of these individuals well, and know of several others similarly changed for ever, not for the better. I’m not even that sociable, so you may perhaps understand my reticence. When the ‘cure’ is at best partially effective, of waning efficacy and carries such risk, I’m personally inclined to stick with the proven safe, proven effective remedy, albeit not popular here in the UK, but I have absolutely no objection to any and all others reaching their own decision, I merely post the items covering pertinent and hopefully interesting aspects of the matter. I admire the ‘faith’ that the greater many have in the vaccines, in spite of their (to my reading) obvious shortcomings and risks.

 

[Buchan]

I feel for those who have been severely impaired by the vaccine, where they were hitherto in good health. I know some of these individuals well, and know of several others similarly changed for ever, not for the better. I’m not even that sociable, so you may perhaps understand my reticence. When the ‘cure’ is at best partially effective, of waning efficacy and carries such risk, I’m personally inclined to stick with the proven safe, proven effective remedy, albeit not popular here in the UK, but I have absolutely no objection to any and all others reaching their own decision, I merely post the items covering pertinent and hopefully interesting aspects of the matter. I admire the ‘faith’ that the greater many have in the vaccines, in spite of their (to my reading) obvious shortcomings and risks.

It's balance and proportion, because it is population health, not individualised. Some will be harmed by the vaccine, the cerebral clots, the myocarditis, but many more will have those problems from the virus itself. That's the balance. The serious side effects are tragic, so is the asymptomatic 20 year old with SARSCoV 2 related clots.

The only effective control of a viral disease is through immunity, induced or acquired.

 

[Freeforester]

Hi

It's balance and proportion, because it is population health, not individualised. Some will be harmed by the vaccine, the cerebral clots, the myocarditis, but many more will have those problems from the virus itself. That's the balance. The serious side effects are tragic, so is the asymptomatic 20 year old with SARSCoV 2 related clots.

The only effective control of a viral disease is through immunity, induced or acquired.

Quite so Buchan, but it must come as a real disappointment to those vaccinated when they succumb anyway.

It’s illustrative to my mind that the less virus abroad in the population there is, so the risk of infection (giving or receiving) is proportionally lessened; when North of 35% can and still do succumb despite being vaccinated, one has to consider the alternatives, ever mindful of these risks. In the absence of virus, there is no need for immunity.

I personally see the illnesses suffered by those I know as having essentially been preventable, which is why I prefer the preventative which does actually do something to address the viral load at large within the population as well as within the individual, as I have no doubt whatever that, were we to adopt the mass rollout of ivermectin as robustly as we have the vaccine programme, then, much like the states in India, Mexico etc we would see a dramatic driving down of the virus within the community.

 

[Freeforester]

A follow up on the recent BBC botched hatchet job on Ivermectin courtesy of the BIRD group:

Letter from Dr. Lawrie to baseless BBC attack - British Ivermectin Recommendation Development group

This letter reproduced from Trial Site News: The BBC recently did a complete hit job on ivermectin—not surprising given the money circulating to ensure such events occur as planned. Among the many inaccuracies the BBC proclaims up to a third of the ivermectin studies as probable frauds, yet...

bird-group.org

 

[J@son]

The BBC did a "complete hit job": Ivermectin: How false science created a Covid 'miracle' drug (Ivermectin: How false science created a Covid 'miracle' drug)

So did Nature: Flawed ivermectin preprint highlights challenges of COVID drug studies (Flawed ivermectin preprint highlights challenges of COVID drug studies)

As did the US Food and Drug Administration: Why You Should Not Use Ivermectin to Treat or Prevent COVID-19 (www.fda.gov/consumers/consumer-updates/why-you-should-not-use-ivermectin-treat-or-prevent-covid-19)

Along with The Independent: Husband of wife who sued to demand ivermectin treatment has died of Covid-19 (Husband of wife who sued to demand ivermectin has died of Covid-19)

And the Financial Times: Poisonings rise as Americans treat Covid with anti-parasitic drug (Subscribe to read | Financial Times)

Not to mention the Guardian: Desperation, misinformation: how the ivermectin craze spread across the world (Desperation, misinformation: how the ivermectin craze spread across the world)

And the British Medical Journal: Misleading clinical evidence and systematic reviews on ivermectin for COVID-19 (Misleading clinical evidence and systematic reviews on ivermectin for COVID-19 | BMJ Evidence-Based Medicine)

And the European Medicine's Agency: EMA advises against use of ivermectin for the prevention or treatment of COVID-19 outside randomised clinical trials (EMA advises against use of ivermectin for the prevention or treatment COVID-19 outside randomised clinical trials - European Medicines Agency)

...there's plenty more where these came from. But you get the idea.

No-one on this forum really knows what they are talking about. If we have established nothing else, I think we have established this. We are all dependent on information provided from other sources. So look at your sources. Do you normally seek medical advice from people posting from their bedrooms on the other side of the world? Or pressure groups that exist soley to make the case for a specific agenda, such as bird.org?

Perhaps you (Freeforester, Zambezi et al) do. But the fact is most people don't. And I think this gives you an enormous problem as you try to advance your argument. No credible or respected sources seem to share your perspective on this.

No doubt in response to this post you will trumpet the name of doctor that I have never heard of, writing in a journal I have never heard of, published on a website I have never heard of. And therein lies the problem that you seem almost willfully blind to. I have never heard of them. And I am willing to bet neither had you - until you discovered they happened to agree with your perspective on this issue. And that is why you suddenly regard them as a great authority on the subject.

You seem to think that Expert = Someone who agrees with me. But this is not the case. If you want to convince someone of something you have to do so using a source that they trust. That is why this thread isn't changing people's minds. You don't trust the BBC, The FT, The Guardian, The Independent, The British Medical Journal, Nature, the FDA or The European Medicine's Agency. And I don't trust the doctors posting from their bedrooms in Uttah Pradesh.

I suggest we all agree to differ on this point and come back in ten years' time to see who is still alive. At least we can all have confidence the cause of your death is unlikely to be parasitic worms.

 

[zambezi]

You seem to think that Expert = Someone who agrees with me

Wrong. Data, once verified, is king. It makes opinion redundant.

A significant number of preminent scientists and physicians have witnessed treatment efficacy apart from vaccines.

I understand and accept some reluctance to take Ivermectin RCT data at face value. But it cannot be ignored either. So where are the appropriate double-blind mass trials? Demand that.

name of doctor that I have never heard of

Are you including the following?

Dr Robert Malone
Dr Paul Marik
Dr Peter McCullough
Dr Trevor Marshall
Satoshi Omura
Dr Andrew Hill

 

[Rewulf]

Perhaps you (Freeforester, Zambezi et al) do. But the fact is most people don't. And I think this gives you an enormous problem as you try to advance your argument. No credible or respected sources seem to share your perspective on this.

No doubt in response to this post you will trumpet the name of doctor that I have never heard of, writing in a journal I have never heard of, published on a website I have never heard of. And therein lies the problem that you seem almost willfully blind to. I have never heard of them. And I am willing to bet neither had you - until you discovered they happened to agree with your perspective on this issue. And that is why you suddenly regard them as a great authority on the subject.

You seem to think that Expert = Someone who agrees with me. But this is not the case. If you want to convince someone of something you have to do so using a source that they trust. That is why this thread isn't changing people's minds. You don't trust the BBC, The FT, The Guardian, The Independent, The British Medical Journal, Nature, the FDA or The European Medicine's Agency. And I don't trust the doctors posting from their bedrooms in Uttah Pradesh.
venom in some of suggest we all agree to differ on this point and come back in ten years' time to see who is still alive. At least we can all have confidence the cause of your death is unlikely to be parasitic worms.

You seem to have a rather large bee in your bonnet because someone has a different opinion to yours , why is that ?

We are having a discussion among mature consenting adults, about a possible alternative therapy for covid, a casual observer would think that with the venom in some of the replies, that we were discussing eating babies in some kind of satanic ritual.
Get over yourself, if people want to take ivermectin , let them get on with it, its not like people dont stick god knows whatever drugs in their arms , noses and mouths on a daily basis !
Its not your job to crusade against the 'evils' of ivermectin use, or hydroquinine or any other treatment that isnt the state sanctioned vaccine.

You arent going to take ivermectin , and Im sure all your friends , family and aquaintances are far too clever to fall for the man on the street corner selling illicit 'dangerous' anti covid drugs, so what exactly is your problem ?
And as far as people believing stuff without a shread of evidence, more than half the populace of this planet believe to some extent in some kind of deity , without a single IOTA of evidence...
Or do you want to go and try and change their minds too ?

 

[User00053]

Pfizermectin perhaps could be next

 

[J@son]

Are you including the following?

Dr Robert Malone

I am. Never heard of Dr Robert Malone. So, being the the name on the list, I decided to Google him to find out more.

Here is something he tweated today:

"Taiwan death from COVID-19 vaccination exceeds death from COVID-19"
Vac deaths in Taiwan: 852
Deaths with COVID-19: 844
Prediction: Vaccinating low death rate countries (such as much of Africa) will elicit more deaths from the jab than from disease.

...and this is an example of a man you are holding up as an expert? Really?

 

[TomDeer]

I am. Never heard of Dr Robert Malone. So, being the the name on the list, I decided to Google him to find out more.

Here is something he tweated today:

"Taiwan death from COVID-19 vaccination exceeds death from COVID-19"
Vac deaths in Taiwan: 852
Deaths with COVID-19: 844
Prediction: Vaccinating low death rate countries (such as much of Africa) will elicit more deaths from the jab than from disease.

...and this is an example of a man you are holding up as an expert? Really?

Perhaps a slightly more detailed search by you will identify Dr Malone's considerably more impresisve credentials as one of the inventors of mRNA technology. He really is an expert.

 

[Rasputin]

I am. Never heard of Dr Robert Malone. So, being the the name on the list, I decided to Google him to find out more.

Here is something he tweated today:

"Taiwan death from COVID-19 vaccination exceeds death from COVID-19"
Vac deaths in Taiwan: 852
Deaths with COVID-19: 844
Prediction: Vaccinating low death rate countries (such as much of Africa) will elicit more deaths from the jab than from disease.

...and this is an example of a man you are holding up as an expert? Really?

Still a fair point though… low death rate countries like Africa don’t they use that imvermectin thingy… or is they are just bred tougher and don’t live long enough to over burden the nhs.

 

[palmer_mike]

Still a fair point though… low death rate countries like Africa don’t they use that imvermectin thingy… or is they are just bred tougher and don’t live long enough to over burden the nhs.

Africa’s low COVID-19 mortality rate: A paradox?

COVID-19 continues to spread worldwide, with high numbers of fatalities reported first in China, followed by even higher numbers in Italy, Spain, the …

www.sciencedirect.com

Basically, it seems that older people are generally the ones most at risk of dying. The lower average age in Africa due to people generally living shorter lives there means that there’s a lower rate of Covid deaths….

 

[zambezi]

low death rate countries like Africa don’t they use that imvermectin thingy

Africa is a continent, not a country.





Not all countries in Africa use Ivermectin

 

[palmer_mike]

Africa is a continent, not a country.


View attachment 225243


Not all countries in Africa use Ivermectin


View attachment 225244

Not meaning to poke holes in the accuracy of the map but it says there’s no COVID-19 in China?

Also Madagascar?

And Taiwan

 

[Rasputin]

Africa is a continent, not a country.


View attachment 225243


Not all countries in Africa use Ivermectin


View attachment 225244

Africa is a continent, not a country.


View attachment 225243


Not all countries in Africa use Ivermectin


View attachment 225244

Yeah I can’t edit it for some reason meant to say “like in” obviously.

 

[Rasputin]

Africa’s low COVID-19 mortality rate: A paradox?

COVID-19 continues to spread worldwide, with high numbers of fatalities reported first in China, followed by even higher numbers in Italy, Spain, the …

www.sciencedirect.com

Basically, it seems that older people are generally the ones most at risk of dying. The lower average age in Africa due to people generally living shorter lives there means that there’s a lower rate of Covid deaths….

You mean to tell me the older you get the more risk of dying you have shock horror .

 

[Rewulf]

Not meaning to poke holes in the accuracy of the map but it says there’s no COVID-19 in China?

Also Madagascar?

And Taiwan

Below a certain figure its counted as 'nothing'
Around 10 new cases in China, and around 5 in Taiwan per day on average.

Strange eh ?
Unless its all lies of course , but main stream news says its right , so it must be ?

 

[Freeforester]

Pfizermectin perhaps could be next

Pfizer Merck tin, I think!

 

[Foxyboy43]

Below a certain figure its counted as 'nothing'
Around 10 new cases in China, and around 5 in Taiwan per day on average.

Strange eh ?
Unless its all lies of course , but main stream news says its right , so it must be ?

“Lies” - surely not? Really, really low porkies figures from a junta government in a country which manipulates the press, puts millions of its population in concentration re-education camps centres and maybe even infected invented C19? Maybe even perhaps has most to lose if (they let the investigators back into their labs) C19 doesn’t go away! Gracious, you will be telling me Iraq really had nuclear arms next!