Lease advice

[Zeissman]

Hi all,

There is an opportunity for me to lease some of the stalking from a mate of mine who owns a farm locally here in Hampshire. It will be my first proper lease. Is there a set formula for an annual agreement? It would be predominantly fallow and roe stalking and I would have thought that about 300 acres would be about right for me (say heading out about once a week). Any advice on this also welcome.

I am really keen for neither of us to end up with a raw deal. This is very much for fun and not commercial from my perspective although it would be nice to be able to invite the odd person to stalk with me. He has no larder, etc. so he is literally just providing the land. I would also have to be ultra considerate for the shoot that is also run over the land (partly because I'm part of the syndicate)!

All best,

Z.

 

[nun_hunter]

If he is a genuine friend I would expect you could come to an amicable agreement whereby you split the sale of any venison or just split the venison depending on how much you shoot. That's what I'd be looking for if he was a friend of mine, just an aquiainence then maybe he'd want some money his way but if money changes hands then I'd want more of a say in what I could do if I was paying.

 

[SussexFallow]

Offer him 50/50 on any venison put through the game dealer

 

[Hereford]

My advice would be to draw it up properly and you yourself play a straight bat (especially when taking others out too).

Myself and the landowner recently found out that my permission that I share with the landowner was being (paid) sublet by a local gamekeeper - not impressed - there was a fair share there for me and another stalker and a shoot syndicate too - now it's just me and the landowner - although we are good friends our agreement was clear and on paper from the start

 

[slider]

PM sent

 

[sikamalc]

I would ensure everything is on paper so both parties know where they stand. I have three major leases and have dealt with many large estates over the years, so my strong advice is to put it on paper, even if its for free or sharing the venison.

 

[223]

^^^^^^^ what malc said

 

[Zeissman]

Thank you all, and Slider, thank you for the PM - much appreciated. Sounds like putting it down on paper is the best route to go and great that there is obviously a well trodden path with splitting the proceeds from the game dealer. No idea how much would be shot so that makes sense and also feeling pretty broke at the moment so the less up front, the better! Now to work out the larder arrangements...

All best,

Z.

 

[sh1kar]

Agree get it on paper and don't forget to cover situation re vermin Are you expected to shoot foxes?
on your second point re 300 acres it depends on what you expect to shoot. It's small if you are out every week depending on your trip to kill ratio. I have c 2300 acres across 3 places in Hampshire Its a mix of arable. Woodland. Shaws and borders part of a big FC woodland. A small group of us shoot 40-50 roe and muntjac a year and the population stays about the same. At least over last 5 years

also if you have fallow weekly trips will rattle them and may push them into being nocturnal or off the ground depending what's around you

Sh1kar

 

[Zeissman]

Guys, just to provide you all with an update after your kind advice. The stalking at my friend's farm has gone to the new keeper as part of the deal there which is fine with me as it keeps it all separate.

So I've been doing a bit more digging... I've now been offered a place on a syndicate which has shot about 35 fallow/roe a year for the last few years over 800 acres of mainly arable with some woodland. I would get to keep six carcasses a year before starting to pay extra for them and would be allowed to take the odd friend out. There are no larder facilities, etc. just the ground (which is in a beautiful spot) with well maintained high seats, etc. Does £1500 for that sort of package sound very expensive to you?! I have to say that I was quite surprised bearing in mind that it's a syndicate of six.

You'll be pleased to hear that it will all be put in writing! Best advice having looked into a few different bits of ground where the deal seemed to change on a minute-by-minute basis in some cases!

All best,

Z.

 

[sauer]

I've very little experience of syndicates but the couple times I've been involved I would say that's a tad expensive for six , but that's only going on limited experience , others I'm sure will advise better

Paul

 

[Archer]

Re Zieissman post #10

Perhaps the figure given is based on a"buy as you go" successful stalk of say £75 an outing plus £75/100 for the carcass + perhaps a kill fee (and all topped off with a tip).
If so, then for x 6 beasts a year, it would be a "good" (but not to everyone) deal

 

[stuartp]

I doesn't sound like a great deal to me, but if that is all that is on offer...
Only you can decide and justify it to yourself, you will see posts on here from people who shoot for nothing right up to those who have heard of £7/acre.
If I was sharing ground with 5 others the first thing I would want to know is how often they expect to be on the ground.

 

[Zeissman]

I have a knack for being able to justify shooting/stalking related expenses to myself! Archer has just helped me do the maths and you're right, it would be cheaper than pay-as-you-go. It is the best that's on offer for the moment and I think that it will be good ground. If nothing else, it will be the most lovely walking spot! I am told that the other members average about once a week or every two weeks between them so hopefully not overstalked. I'll let you know how it goes and whether it feels like good value for money in a few months!

All best,

Z.

 

[countrryboy]

The most important thing is it's value to you!
Is it handy, would u use it? But also has it a lot of public dog walkers on it, RoW over it, any game shoots on ground etc etc?

If my sums are right ur looking at 12 quid an acre or £257 a beast (considering u get £30-40 for a roe and possibly £80ish for a fallow at the dealer)

It does seem dear to me personally,but i don't know the area, it may even be cheap for area? But if its on ur door step and lets u get out easily on an evening after work might be worth it to u?

U will no doubt see offers further north cheaper, but remember u could easily have a 4+ hour drive, 50+ quid of desiel, B&B or sleep rough in ur truck etc, lots of other hidden costs, even the brownie points u have to save of ur mrs to get away for a whole wknd

When u add everything else up ur expensive local stalking may work out cheaper or at least better value for money as u use it more.
In theory if u are out 15ish times u've covered ur costs thou compared to paid stalks

 

[stuartp]

I have a knack for being able to justify shooting/stalking related expenses to myself!

"Because I'm worth it"

Good luck with it, I hope you enjoy it