Log burner liner and fitting - costs?
- Thread starter kes
- Start date
Monkey Spanker
Well-Known Member
Did they test it and agree to supply a HETAS certificate? The qualification costs them money and they need to register the fitting It all takes time and money.
Works out at just over £42/hour without consideration for subsequent registration. Did they use consumables and specialist tools?
Sometimes jobs go well, but other times they don't. Quotes tend to include a slight 'buffer' to average these out. Your job may well have gone very well and it seems a lot. The next job may take him twice as long as expected.
If you were given the quote beforehand and were happy that it was reasonable and competitive, then there is no argument really.
If you don't like it, maybe train as a log burner fitter?
MS
Works out at just over £42/hour without consideration for subsequent registration. Did they use consumables and specialist tools?
Sometimes jobs go well, but other times they don't. Quotes tend to include a slight 'buffer' to average these out. Your job may well have gone very well and it seems a lot. The next job may take him twice as long as expected.
If you were given the quote beforehand and were happy that it was reasonable and competitive, then there is no argument really.
If you don't like it, maybe train as a log burner fitter?
MS
Wingy
Well-Known Member
Paid £350 that was 4 years ago, again 1/2 day job that was just checking the chimney (newly built so no problems) put the burner in position, connect it up, smoke test & issue HETAS certificate. All parts were bought before hand and were on site for when the engineer arrived.
Wingy
Wingy
McKenzie
Well-Known Member
If it makes you feel any better ours was almost £5000 & required lining an old chimney over 2 floors, scaffolding, adding chimney pot, opening up a nearly 300 year old range & rebuilding an appropriate-sized gap & lining with one piece cut stone on 2 sides, dressing inside of external wall, cutting & laying hearth stones, steel cover, oak mantle-piece, certification etc. I had them build wooden frames & polythene walls to try to contain the mess which was unimaginable from such an old chimney/range. It took about 5 days all up & we supplied the stove which isn't included in the above price.
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Chasey
Well-Known Member
I couldnt run my buisnes for £360 for two blokes, so id say it was dirt cheep and they make their real money from the sale of the fire
It would most likley be a day unless they had a small job for the afternoon within 30mins drive from your job.
Just signend off on this years Yell advertising at £8650 for two areas internet only one sub section Total advertising budget for 2017 £15,000 (about 10% of turnover)
Just baught a new van £15,000 +vat, should last four years
Today spent £500 replaceing a transformer and a hammer drill
Paid for my Profesional memebership of my trade association £2500
Sorting out workplace pensions now
Just paid the accountant £2275.00
A typical skilled employee will cost me £150 a day + allowance for holidays (six weeks and two weeks sic spread over 44 working weeks so anther £130 a week 26 a day so a typical employee will cost me £176.00 a day my fixed overheads are arround £90 a day a semi skilled assistant will be another £125 per day so AT COST to put two men on site for one day will cost me £391.00
Basicly we charge out labour for a two man team at £400 per day and we have a minimum charge for any job at £450.00 so if they did a one job day for £360 they are working for penuts.
I employ two people and turn over around 160K a year
We have to turn over £2500 a week £500 a day just to break even
ATB
Mine cost best part of £600 to fit, took 3 days as lintels had to come out of chimney breast, whole fire place had to be rebuilt, slate hearth etc fitted and HETAS certificate issued. I think with everything, ie liner, fire, reskimming whole chimey breast, and alike came in at £2k.
Money very well spent, gas C/H only on in am and 1 hr at night keeps my house toasty and burns minimal ammount of wood. (Burley Debdale stove).
D
Money very well spent, gas C/H only on in am and 1 hr at night keeps my house toasty and burns minimal ammount of wood. (Burley Debdale stove).
D
We had a stove installed a few years ago. The installer said he could not fit the stainless steel liner down the chimney and that he would have to chop into the stack in the loft. My 66 year old father in law who was a painter / decorator went up the ladder, dropped a spanner on a bit of rope down the chimney then we pulled the liner through. All done in 10 mins. The installer was not too happy when I told him an OAP had done what his 18 year old apprentice said could not. Cheek of it was he still wanted to charge the same price. Mrs dug her heels in, she's tougher than me and insited on a discount, he said he would not leave until he got all his money, Mrs said well you will have a long wait then. 10 mins later he took what he was offered and left.
Ian
Ian
shakey jake
Well-Known Member
If they quoted then over ran by a day would you pay extra?
DAVIDAIKEN
Well-Known Member
1/2 a day at your premises, did they collect the fire etc...
Thanks to all = I was advised the fitting would take a day, so it seemed ok, bit high, but it took half the time. Stove and bits separate agreement = pre-survey to establish any issues before cost given, so £360, knowing it was easy (stove replaced). I accept the points about certification etc but It took me 7 years to become professionally qualified and I didnt charge this hourly rate !
Special thanks to Monkeyspanker whose life must be straightforward because of his approach to it !
As a qualified civil engineer I admire the company which I complained to who simply said - "thank you for your feedback".
Whatever anyone says, this is opportunism and to those who cannot afford this cost, accepting it without question, is both uncaring and unrealisitic.
Special thanks to Monkeyspanker whose life must be straightforward because of his approach to it !
As a qualified civil engineer I admire the company which I complained to who simply said - "thank you for your feedback".
Whatever anyone says, this is opportunism and to those who cannot afford this cost, accepting it without question, is both uncaring and unrealisitic.
Figure in travel to job time, fuel costs fixed overheads ie insurance, van, tools. The hourly labour rate they get is no were near the £42 pounds Mark.
your paying for a job that you can't do yourself and if it was done professionally and within quote I think it's reasonably. Tradesmen train for a long time to get their skills and constantly have to up date them to meet current legislation.
your paying for a job that you can't do yourself and if it was done professionally and within quote I think it's reasonably. Tradesmen train for a long time to get their skills and constantly have to up date them to meet current legislation.
nun_hunter
Well-Known Member
Something to bear in mind too is that quite often certain tradesmen don't want certain jobs so quote high becausethey don't really want the job but will do it at the higher price if the quote is accepted. I don't like scrabbling g about in lofts full of insulation in the height of summer so those jobs will be quoted high as I dont mind not getting it as I'd rather be outside working, in the winter then it's the other way round.
My brother is a Chartered Civil Engineer working in London and gets £425 a day but the company he works for charges the client a whole lot more in order to cover their costs and still make a profit.
My brother is a Chartered Civil Engineer working in London and gets £425 a day but the company he works for charges the client a whole lot more in order to cover their costs and still make a profit.
Chasey
Well-Known Member
I have been in buisness over 25 years and the two things that make me laugh the most is people who seem to beleive the fee paid for a job goes streight in the pockets of the men on site and that surveys / estimates are free of charge.
When we do "free surveys" we get an average hit rate of one job in 3 estimates. Mainly due to time wasters, people who just get the cheepest quite no matter what and DIYrs who just want free advice.
In my game a qualified Timber and Damp proofing CSRT Surveyour earns about £30,000 a year + car expenses + mobile + office costs and can do 5-6 surveys in a day and spends another day writing them up and doing the job costing. So about £260.00 + expenses so around £350 at cost for 5 -6 surveys and we get 2 jobs out of it.
So how much do you think we add on the job cost to cover the cost of the "free estimate"?
Yep your free estimate cost you £ 175.00 minimum
The other way is to put the surveyours on "commision only" so now they provide their own car fuel expenses etc and get 15-25 % of contract price as a commision.
So you guessed it, A average £2000.00 contract has up to £500 commision added for the surveyour.
When people get three "free estimates" ALL three are adding on the cost so the client dosent notice it.
Its been a sucessfull model over the years and thats why the MD of Kenwood Damp Proofing used to drive a Roles Royce and i have never met a poor double glazing salesman
When we do "free surveys" we get an average hit rate of one job in 3 estimates. Mainly due to time wasters, people who just get the cheepest quite no matter what and DIYrs who just want free advice.
In my game a qualified Timber and Damp proofing CSRT Surveyour earns about £30,000 a year + car expenses + mobile + office costs and can do 5-6 surveys in a day and spends another day writing them up and doing the job costing. So about £260.00 + expenses so around £350 at cost for 5 -6 surveys and we get 2 jobs out of it.
So how much do you think we add on the job cost to cover the cost of the "free estimate"?
Yep your free estimate cost you £ 175.00 minimum
The other way is to put the surveyours on "commision only" so now they provide their own car fuel expenses etc and get 15-25 % of contract price as a commision.
So you guessed it, A average £2000.00 contract has up to £500 commision added for the surveyour.
When people get three "free estimates" ALL three are adding on the cost so the client dosent notice it.
Its been a sucessfull model over the years and thats why the MD of Kenwood Damp Proofing used to drive a Roles Royce and i have never met a poor double glazing salesman
I can't comment on prices for trades etc as I have no knowledge of it at all. However I fitted a stove last year and instead of the HETAS route I did mine via building control. There's a lot of advice on the web regarding the regulations etc, and my local building control department were brilliant, so to anyone who is contemplating a stove fit, it may be worth a look. I reckon it saved me over £1000, but that isn't costing my time.
You can double the rate the workman gets, to arrive at what it costs to employ him/her. Traveling, sick pay, holiday pay, pension contributions, National insurance(stamps), parental leave, employers' insurance, office admin,................. Who would want to be an employer?
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