Move To France

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rab19

Well-Known Member
Hi All,

Has anyone here ever moved to France to stay semi/permanently? Escape To The Chateau and all that.

How easy or hard was it, Are the French only after Professionals or certain trades, any problems with Planning Permission etc? About to start reading Renovating and Maintaining Your French Home by Joe Laredo.

Have been seriously toying with the idea for a while, Missus still not too sure yet though, (even though coming from Kent so almost half French already :D )

Already run a Guest House in the UK for 20+ years and thinking of something similar in France but in a rural setting, maybe a French equivalent of a smallholding/small farm in the N/E of France, Lille, Arras down to Reims maybe but open to other options where I could get guests to stay.

Looking at the prices compared to the UK you are definitely getting a lot more for your money, in some areas of the UK £500K to £600K will get you a house and 10 acres, 20 acres tops. In France you can get the house, steel barn, outbuildings, 30+ acres and change in the bank. I have to wonder if I am missing something.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated as missus needs a bit of a nudge.

Thanks
 
French bureaucracy is what your missing from the dream idyll it will slowly drive you mad that’s if the lassiez faire attitudes of them don’t get you first. 3rd party costs for services in the uk can sometimes be eyewatering and social charges if you’re an employer can be high.

Other than that France is great 👍.
 
rab19 said:
Hi All,

Has anyone here ever moved to France to stay semi/permanently? Escape To The Chateau and all that.

How easy or hard was it, Are the French only after Professionals or certain trades, any problems with Planning Permission etc? About to start reading Renovating and Maintaining Your French Home by Joe Laredo.

Have been seriously toying with the idea for a while, Missus still not too sure yet though, (even though coming from Kent so almost half French already :D )

Already run a Guest House in the UK for 20+ years and thinking of something similar in France but in a rural setting, maybe a French equivalent of a smallholding/small farm in the N/E of France, Lille, Arras down to Reims maybe but open to other options where I could get guests to stay.

Looking at the prices compared to the UK you are definitely getting a lot more for your money, in some areas of the UK £500K to £600K will get you a house and 10 acres, 20 acres tops. In France you can get the house, steel barn, outbuildings, 30+ acres and change in the bank. I have to wonder if I am missing something.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated as missus needs a bit of a nudge.

Thanks
Click to expand...
This reply assumes you have only British nationality.

I lived in Paris from 2002 until 2006 and in Saint Ouen sur Seine on the outskirts from 2015 until 2019. Both times rented as I did look to buy but bet wrongly that the Euro would fall against the Pound and in 2015 decided that I'd rent, only, anyway.

Pre-Brexit of course if you had UK nationality you had an absolute right to live there and to work or involve yourself in business. There now is no longer that right either to live permanently or to work in many many professions or trades. Nor AFAIK to involve yourself on business thanks to that master of negotiation Lord Frost and Rees-Mogg. One was the "Leave" negotiator and the other the Minister for Brexit.

So to be truthful it is now not going to be as it was before Brexit.

And you will now also likely have to pay tax in France rather than take advantage of the Anglo-French Tax Treaty which existed before and still exists, again AFAIK, post-Brexit as likely you can't have a business in France unless you are now treated as domiciled there. There are thirteen exceptions where you can still lawfully work or do business there which fortunately I am one of those thirteen so I still work there. Musicians as the news keeps reporting for example, NOT being on that list. Ditto your UK Driving Licence will, I think, cease to be valid if you are officially a French resident.

There is a very useful UK GOV website that still sends me updates. Search GOV UK LIVING AND WORKING IN FRANCE and you'll likely find it.

Last and rightly so French officialdom makes no allowance for not speaking French and all documents and forms will be on French and any papers that you need to submit (except for passports) will have to be translated by an official certified translator. Some are good, some are bad but they will have to be from a list provided by your local to where you are Prefecture.

The residency card was, for my Nigerian wife issued under EU Rules as the spouse of a (then pre-2016) EU Citizen under Directive 2004/38. I of course as a British national pre-Brexit didn't need any of that. Neither will now no longer apply to you if you are British and French immigration rules will now apply so you will need proof of means of support, proof of health insurance and all manner of other paperwork and, yes, where needed, translated by an official translator into French.

Residency will AFAIK be for one year but you'll get a succession of ninety day "recipisse" while it is being processed and when the one year one expires I think it gets renewed for five years and then every ten years. Again for my wife it was one year, the five years then if we had stayed permanent. You will be photographed and fingerprinted on application.

For my wife under EU Rules these residency cards were free. Now post-Brexit for you they won't be. If you hold Irish nationality...even if just one of you...the British national will sit in their pocket as did my wife and so France must apply EU Rules and not its own immigration rules (see earlier paragraph)...so here's the thing. Their rules, the French rules, are a bastard.
 
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It'd really, truly, be a lot lot easier in Ireland as the Anglo-Irish Treaty and those rights give you an absolute right to live and work and reside in Ireland. Do that and eventually get Irish nationality and just like our dear friend Tommy Robinson (yes that one) as a Irish passport holder you can then can re-enjoy the rights that attach to an EU Citizen. Heck you might even like it so much in Ireland you'll decide to stay there anyway.
 
I do suspect that a lot of people up sticks and go to live in France, then find it's not really the same as all those times they went on carefree holidays there and end up moving back to Blighty. Not all, but a fair percentage. The Devil you know and all that.

Perhaps it's something you can do whilst still relatively young and it'll work better. Speaking the lingo, or learning it PDQ helps immensely. However, all this is from other people's experiences. So what do I know? As for being Irish, my mother was from Wexford, so I'm entitled to an Irish/EU passport should I wish to get one. Possibly I should, if only to make travel easier.
 
enfieldspares said:
This reply assumes you have only British nationality.

I lived in Paris from 2002 until 2006 and in Saint Ouen sur Seine on the outskirts from 2015 until 2019. Both times rented as I did look to buy but bet wrongly that the Euro would fall against the Pound and in 2015 decided that I'd rent, only, anyway.

Pre-Brexit of course if you had UK nationality you had an absolute right to live there and to work or involve yourself in business. There now is no longer that right either to live permanently or to work in many many professions or trades. Nor AFAIK to involve yourself on business thanks to that master of negotiation Lord Frost and Rees-Mogg. One was the "Leave" negotiator and the other the Minister for Brexit.

So to be truthful it is now not going to be as it was before Brexit.

And you will now also likely have to pay tax in France rather than take advantage of the Anglo-French Tax Treaty which existed before and still exists, again AFAIK, post-Brexit as likely you can't have a business in France unless you are now treated as domiciled there. There are thirteen exceptions where you can still lawfully work or do business there which fortunately I am one of those thirteen so I still work there. Musicians as the news keeps reporting for example, NOT being on that list. Ditto your UK Driving Licence will, I think, cease to be valid if you are officially a French resident.

There is a very useful UK GOV website that still sends me updates. Search GOV UK LIVING AND WORKING IN FRANCE and you'll likely find it.

Last and rightly so French officialdom makes no allowance for not speaking French and all documents and forms will be on French and any papers that you need to submit (except for passports) will have to be translated by an official certified translator. Some are good, some are bad but they will have to be from a list provided by your local to where you are Prefecture.

The residency card was, for my Nigerian wife issued under EU Rules as the spouse of a (then pre-2016) EU Citizen under Directive 2004/38. I of course as a British national pre-Brexit didn't need any of that. Neither will now no longer apply to you if you are British and French immigration rules will now apply so you will need proof of means of support, proof of health insurance and all manner of other paperwork and, yes, where needed, translated by an official translator into French.

Residency will AFAIK be for one year but you'll get a succession of ninety day "recipisse" while it is being processed and when the one year one expires I think it gets renewed for five years and then every ten years. Again for my wife it was one year, the five years then if we had stayed permanent. You will be photographed and fingerprinted on application.

For my wife under EU Rules these residency cards were free. Now post-Brexit for you they won't be. If you hold Irish nationality...even if just one of you...the British national will sit in their pocket as did my wife and so France must apply EU Rules and not its own immigration rules (see earlier paragraph)...so here's the thing. Their rules are a bastard.
Click to expand...
Hooked up to a couple of expat websites for some info and have started brushing up on my schoolboy French and looking for some french language courses/CD's, have also been practising on some of the French and Belgian guests.

The government website is pretty good and have gone through it a couple of times, good to see that it takes you to some French government sites for more info, and checking on residency cards at the moment.

Will have cash in the bank to buy a property (or small mortgage), live on etc, but do we have to prove earnings immediately which may be a bit tight if we go in the closed season, or will cash in the bank be counted to tide us over till we hit the 1700 Euros a month?
 
You may also need a French bank account. But that aside you will need to provide bank statements and they will need to be originals and not print offs from an internet banking app...or if they are then your bank will have to certify them as authentic..usually with some sort of official rubber stamp. The French lover official rubber stamps. You'll learn soon enough that a tampon isn't a woman's sanitary item it's a think possessed of God like mystery.

I don't know now how banks apply their own policies to non-French residents holding bank accounts. I don't know but suspect that you may now need to have a minimum ingoing to an account? HSBC used at one time to have a branch in Versailles and one in Paris on Avenue Victor Hugo in the 16me Arrondisment. I don't know if they still do?

French banks are, as mengtioned, BNP Paribas which has an international clients office near the Bourse, other banks are Credit Lyonnais aka LCL, Credit Agricole, Societe Generale, Banque Populaire, Caisse d'Epargne, Credit Mutuel and a couple of others. Also the post office's Banque Postale but heck the queues in French post offices are murder so best avoided if you want to remain sane.

www.french-property.com

Which French Bank? Choosing a bank in France

French-Property.com is the leading portal for property in France. Find homes, houses and properties of all styles for sale by private sellers, immobilier and estate agents throughout France.
www.french-property.com www.french-property.com
 
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enfieldspares said:
It'd really, truly, be a lot lot easier in Ireland as the Anglo-Irish Treaty and those rights give you an absolute right to live and work and reside in Ireland. Do that and eventually get Irish nationality and just like our dear friend Tommy Robinson (yes that one) as a Irish passport holder you can then can re-enjoy the rights that attach to an EU Citizen. Heck you might even like it so much in Ireland you'll decide to stay there an
Click to expand...
.
 
sikamalc said:
Is there anywhere in the UK you can purchase a house and 10 to 20 acres of land for 500k to 600k
Click to expand...

I had a junior colleague who moved his family to France, when he had about five years left to serve.

His two children went to school there, and quickly became proficient in French. He would commute for those years.

He showed me his 'house'. It was a Chateau with two turrets and came with substantial grounds. I seem to recall he paid something like £250,000 (about fifteen years ago).

I must say, I was rather envious.
 
I have two good friends who moved to France with their wives and loved every minute of it.
Both couples were financially stable and didn't need to work over there. Both were in the building/construction trade and purchased property & land for peanuts and enjoyed the whole experience of renovating a French property, although Tony got exasperated with the local tradesmen and ended up bribing English tradies to go and do the plumbing & electrics, he has since sold up and moved back to his house in England.
Barney & Donna are still living the dream in the converted Mill House.......

Go for it sir....
 
A mechanic friend "Big Al" moved to France 20 plus years ago, Jo his wife took French at school then lessons later in life, Al still only speaks only a few words of French where Jo is Fluent speaking also writing/reading.

I asked him why he never found the need to learn French when he called in on a flying visit...
He said my language is "this" pointing to my mig welder Snap on Tool box lathe....
Their first week they stopped for a chap in a broken down car and towed him back, it was the Mayor's car!
Simple fix according to Al, he know spends his time finding and buying "barn find" and shipping parts around the world.
 
VSS said:
My brother has been living there for the past 30 years or so, and shows no inclination to ever return to the UK to live, so I guess it can't all be bad!
Click to expand...

Ironically my ( a builder by trade) neighbour moved over there many years ago, to buy a little cottage and set up family life, all on a very very very short purse string build as you go, new start sort of thing

Many years later he is fully entrenched in france and the french way of life, and his two lads have now taken over the family home restoration / building business and they are always fully booked 90% of his work is for english people looking to do the same as he started out

The most prolific destroyer out there is woodworm/ termite type wood boring insects a big part of the work they do

I would never envisage his return to these shores, he is by all accounts a frenchman and loving every minute with-all his family around him he's done good 👍and immensely happy, from what was a pretty daunting start because it wasn’t easy
 
I have some friends who moved to the south of France, prebrexit. They sold their terraced in Abingdon and bought a 15th century house with 4 or 5 acres. They have done a massive amount of work to it.

Some things I took from conversations with them,
French community spirit is very important. Looking after the neighbours etc. If there is a funeral, turn up. If there is a village event, turn up. You will get noticed and integrate easier.
Learn the language, you don’t have to be good, but the fact you are making an effort and not S P E A K I N G I N G L O U D L Y A N D S L O W L Y is a help.
Bureaucracy drives even the French mad.
Go meet the local mayor to introduce yourself.
Be careful of the house you buy, some very old houses don’t have foundations. They live in the countryside and with the weather they have had subsidence issues and need a lot of money and the services of a local Massion. (Spelt wrong ) to underpin it.
They love it, they are not planning to come home. In fact the idea is that when they get too old they will buy a smaller place in a town over there.
 
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