New FAC application - Met Police

[CPShines]

I'm preparing to submit my first FAC/shotgun application in the next few months so I thought it would be useful to get some thoughts on whether I am going down the right path or if there's other things I should or need to be doing. I live in London, so it's the Met. So far I have submitted an application to join the NRA at Bisley as a probationary member - I will do their 5x 1-day courses to become a full member so I can use the ranges at Bisley for zeroing and practice.

I am planning to buy a breakdown cabinet for rifle and shotgun (lack of space/permission from wife precludes anything bigger). I have been keeping a log of deer observation outings for the last few months and have now been on two paid stalking outings and a one-day training course, all of which are written up in the log. The guy that I did the training day with has said he's happy to chat with the FEO or write a letter if requested.

I was going to apply for a .308 but I've decided that as 95% of my stalking is going to be UK deer I would rather have a lighter gun so I am going for 6.5x55. I am planning on getting a Schultz & Larsen, so if I decide to go after tougher game in future I will get a variation for a bigger calibre barrel.

My good reason is going to be that I am paying to go on stalking outings.

Does this sound similar to what other members in the Met area have done? When my Dad renewed his shotgun licence last year he mentioned I might be applying this year and the Met FEO said no prob, it would probably be him that saw me. He's based in Fulham I think. So I'm not anticipating any issues but that was for shotgun, so I just want to make sure I get off on the right foot with the FAC application.

 

[stubear]

Sounds to me like you have everything in place - Your good reason is the paid outings and you're also showing willing by doing the various training courses and getting range membership.

You've asked for a "sensible" first caliber as well so there shouldn't be too much objection there either.

Its funny you say about larger calibers - I was on a driven boar hunting trip recently and I took my .308, but one of the other guys had a 6.5x55 and bowled the pigs over easily with it. Bullet placement makes a massive impact!

Also - Schultz and Larsen. Great choice!

 

[Apthorpe]

Are you going to be able to fit a rifle in a breakdown cabinet?
Everything else sounds very sensible. Good luck

 

[Ray7756]

You are doing everything the right way, keeping a record of training and paid stalks, why not put in for the .308 as well as 6.5 x 55 saves paying for a variation in the future
Cheers
Ray

 

[CPShines]

Sounds to me like you have everything in place - Your good reason is the paid outings and you're also showing willing by doing the various training courses and getting range membership.

You've asked for a "sensible" first caliber as well so there shouldn't be too much objection there either.

Its funny you say about larger calibers - I was on a driven boar hunting trip recently and I took my .308, but one of the other guys had a 6.5x55 and bowled the pigs over easily with it. Bullet placement makes a massive impact!

Also - Schultz and Larsen. Great choice!

I was having a look at/drooling over them in William Evans the other day . TBH that was when I changed my mind about the .308. They had a 6.5x55 and a 30-06, and the weight difference between them was pretty big, to me (being the unfit middle-aged office worker that I am). Interesting to hear about the boar and the guys using 6.5x55 -perhaps it will be the only calibre I need. Cheers for that.

I think you have a S&L Victory, is that right? I'm not yet sure which model I might go for - I've yet to see a Classic DL which are the lightest of the bunch so that might suit me best. I had thought to go to the Shooting Showin Feb to compare them all, but Alan Rhone isn't going to be there.

Are you going to be able to fit a rifle in a breakdown cabinet?
Everything else sounds very sensible. Good luck

Cheers Apthorpe. That's one of the reasons for choosing a S&L - it's only a matter of two screws to remove the barrel+action+scope from the stock so I will store it broken down. It sounds like it should have v.little affect on the zero, and TBH having grown up with shotguns I am used to taking a gun apart after using it. I like the idea of knowing there's no moisture left between the stock and the barrel.

You are doing everything the right way, keeping a record of training and paid stalks, why not put in for the .308 as well as 6.5 x 55 saves paying for a variation in the future
Cheers
Ray

If I need something bigger than a 6.5x55 in future, I am thinking I might put in for something considerably bigger at that time Thanks Ray, good to know I am on the right track.

 

[stubear]

I was having a look at/drooling over them in William Evans the other day . TBH that was when I changed my mind about the .308. They had a 6.5x55 and a 30-06, and the weight difference between them was pretty big, to me (being the unfit middle-aged office worker that I am). Interesting to hear about the boar and the guys using 6.5x55 -perhaps it will be the only calibre I need. Cheers for that.

I think you have a S&L Victory, is that right? I'm not yet sure which model I might go for - I've yet to see a Classic DL which are the lightest of the bunch so that might suit me best. I had thought to go to the Shooting Showin Feb to compare them all, but Alan Rhone isn't going to be there.

Yes - I have an S&L Victory and would highly recommend them. Excellent rifles! If you want to cut a bit more weight off then you can get the barrel fluted and get a lightweight mod.

If you can make the trip out to Ivythorn Sporting in Street, Somerset it would be well worth the journey. Steve Beaty stocks S&L rifles and has a wide range available to have a look at, plus he has a range on site where you can try before you buy.

 

[CPShines]

Yes - I have an S&L Victory and would highly recommend them. Excellent rifles! If you want to cut a bit more weight off then you can get the barrel fluted and get a lightweight mod.

If you can make the trip out to Ivythorn Sporting in Street, Somerset it would be well worth the journey. Steve Beaty stocks S&L rifles and has a wide range available to have a look at, plus he has a range on site where you can try before you buy.

Thanks Stubear, that's good to know. If I can't sort out a way to see them locally I might make a weekend of it down to Somerset.

 

[Rasputin]

I had a breakdown cabinet for years with my shotgun. Wouldn’t like to try put a rifle and shotgun even broken down into one. Just my two cents. Good luck with your application.

 

[CPShines]

I had a breakdown cabinet for years with my shotgun. Wouldn’t like to try put a rifle and shotgun even broken down into one. Just my two cents. Good luck with your application.

Cheers Rasputin. Yes, it's a bit of a PITA. According to S&L if you use their mounts the scope can be removed for storage and re-attached without affecting zero, so I might store the scope elsewhere. I'll make it work somehow.

 

[Pedro]

Before you go down the breakdown cabinet route, I'd seriously consider it for a number of reasons. I've just tried to put my Tikka T3 in a breakdown cabinet and it don't fit! So you would have to remove the barrel every time you put it away and obviously, put it back on every time you want to use it. I use mine for a couple of rarely used shotguns, but it's still a PITA putting them together. Just one more job to do before you even get out the door. Too much faffing about can have a detrimental effect on enthusiasm and might mean less stalking/shooting trips.

The other thing is that, ask most people on here, there's a distinctly high probability that, sooner or later, you will want more room! Without going into details, before long, you will find a use for another rifle. You'll end up doing some vermin control on your permission. There may be also any number of reasons you want another shotgun too. A semi for pigeon control, a double barrelled one for game, I could go on. It might take a while, but believe me, if you get the bug, you will want more.

I do appreciate space is limited, but Christmas is just around the corner. Spoil the wife and explain your predicament. Explain the benefits of buying once and get a cabinet with room to expand. You can tell her initially it's good to keep your shotgun cartridges in, much safer, much tidier.

 

[CPShines]

Before you go down the breakdown cabinet route, I'd seriously consider it for a number of reasons. I've just tried to put my Tikka T3 in a breakdown cabinet and it don't fit! So you would have to remove the barrel every time you put it away and obviously, put it back on every time you want to use it. I use mine for a couple of rarely used shotguns, but it's still a PITA putting them together. Just one more job to do before you even get out the door. Too much faffing about can have a detrimental effect on enthusiasm and might mean less stalking/shooting trips.

The other thing is that, ask most people on here, there's a distinctly high probability that, sooner or later, you will want more room! Without going into details, before long, you will find a use for another rifle. You'll end up doing some vermin control on your permission. There may be also any number of reasons you want another shotgun too. A semi for pigeon control, a double barrelled one for game, I could go on. It might take a while, but believe me, if you get the bug, you will want more.

I do appreciate space is limited, but Christmas is just around the corner. Spoil the wife and explain your predicament. Explain the benefits of buying once and get a cabinet with room to expand. You can tell her initially it's good to keep your shotgun cartridges in, much safer, much tidier.

Cheers Pedro, I appreciate what you're saying but TBH the breakdown route is probably the best for me at the moment. I am only planning on going stalking 5-6 times a year and I’m not interested in gathering a collection of guns. I think a breakdown rifle with interchangeable barrels will suit me best, I just need to make sure it will fit.

 

[Shootgun]

I am only planning on going stalking 5-6 times a year and I’m not interested in gathering a collection of guns. I think a breakdown rifle with interchangeable barrels will suit me best, I just need to make sure it will fit.

I said exactly the same thing few years ago, now i'm going stalking 5-6 times a month minimmum and need a bigger cabinet.

If you want to go down the breakdown rifle route, then the Blaser R8 is the best bet for you, tried and tested, goes back to zero all the time.

If you want to have a look before you buy, i'm more than happy to assist, i'm based in South London.

 

[CPShines]

I said exactly the same thing few years ago, now i'm going stalking 5-6 times a month minimmum and need a bigger cabinet.

If you want to go down the breakdown rifle route, then the Blaser R8 is the best bet for you, tried and tested, goes back to zero all the time.

If you want to have a look before you buy, i'm more than happy to assist, i'm based in South London.

Thanks Shootgun that's very good of you. Blaser guns are outside my budget at the moment but if that changes I may take you up on that. Have a great Christmas and New Year.

 

[Whitebeard]

CPShines, i just want to make you aware that not all licensing authorities accept just proof of paid for stalks as a good enough reason to grant a FAC some will only accept permission on a nominated piece of land before granting others are happy with evidence of paid for stalks. This should not be happening anymore due to the Police and crime bill stating that as of the 1st May chief constables are obliged to follow HO guidance but not all constabularies are taking notice of this yet.

Ian.

 

[Sam64]

I'd put in for both calibres. They can only say no. I found the Met were ok on my first application.

 

[CPShines]

CPShines, i just want to make you aware that not all licensing authorities accept just proof of paid for stalks as a good enough reason to grant a FAC some will only accept permission on a nominated piece of land before granting others are happy with evidence of paid for stalks. This should not be happening anymore due to the Police and crime bill stating that as of the 1st May chief constables are obliged to follow HO guidance but not all constabularies are taking notice of this yet.

Ian.

Thanks Ian. Hopefully the MET will be ok with proof of paid stalks. I've had a couple of messages from others in that area who said the Met were ok in that regard. TBH, the chances of someone living in Londond and working fulltime getting their own grounds are slim, so it sounds like they may be pragmatic about that.

I'd put in for both calibres. They can only say no. I found the Met were ok on my first application.

True, I could go for 6.5x55 and something bigger for boar/elk etc. Cheers.

 

[CPShines]

Update

So the FEO came round a few weeks back - no problems at all. I had put down 6.5x55 SE but when I mentioned that I was umm-ing and ahh-ing between that and a .308 he just wrote .308 on the next line and said this way I can take my pick or get both.

One interesting thing is that I said I wasn't sure exactly what size mod I was going to get, so he amended the lines to say 6.5x55+mod, and .308 +mod. He said that way so long as I buy the rifle and mod together, it counts as one firearm and I can get whatever mod I want that fits the gun.

The FLO Sergeant called me this morning to let me know that they're happy with my proofs of paid deer stalking outings so the licence will be in the post. I forgot to ask what conditions are on it but I guess I'll see in a few days. Almost time to go shopping

 

[sy247]

Congratulations

 

[CPShines]

My FAC arrived yesterday The conditions say I can shoot on any ground deemed suitable by the local police chief and that I have permission to shoot on - is this essentially an 'open' licence then?

Just want to say thanks to everyone who advised me that I didn't need my own land permission to get my application through - that advice was bang on the money for the Met at least. You saved me a lot of money as I was being urged to join an expensive club just to get their land permissions.

 

[Turkish]

Hi CPShines,

Firstly, congratulations ! This will be the start of many happy hours spent "Wasting your time chasing deer," as my partner would put it.

Secondly, the condition on your licence is at the moment classed as closed. That means you can only shoot on land that has been deemed safe to shoot on by the police. Open status - when you can self assess a piece of ground - has different wording.

I am also interested in the FEO in the following:

One interesting thing is that I said I wasn't sure exactly what size mod I was going to get, so he amended the lines to say 6.5x55+mod, and .308 +mod. He said that way so long as I buy the rifle and mod together, it counts as one firearm and I can get whatever mod I want that fits the gun.

Unless the moderator is fixed permanently to the rifle - in the form of a shrouded, fully moderated barrel - I'm not sure that statement is right.

Has something changed that I am not aware of?