PDS to DSC conversion.

[Dickie]

A lantra accredited qualification is very much worth the paper its Written on!!... and PDS 1 is a lantra accredited qualification....
The Dsc is and always will only be a benchmark qualification and while ever they (dmq) keep moving the goalposts with what they require to pass their certificates ie 1 deer for level two instead of three, they will become less relevant.... infact I've already noticed some adverts are asking for dsc1 or equivalent in their person specifications....
Remember where DMQ came from.... someone in BASC who came up with an idea and then through his position and Contacts was able to convince fc to get on board to 'recognise' it.... and at the time there was nothing else of its kind and so it got more recognition to the point that it became the industry standard and adopted by the police (fc already had their fingers in the pie).....
LANTRA training is much more recognised by industry and I for one would take on someone with a PDS certificate.... as it shows they've trained to, and achieved a standard that is accredited by an outside body as opposed to internal body who actually created the qualification (dmq ltd) .

The very fact that Dmq won't recognise a lantra accreditation and allow that person to do their dsc2 just shows that there's a money making undertone there.....

The deer industry needs a good shake up and there needs to be more acceptance for whatever training/qualification provider the person chooses....

Wasn’t there a BDS stalking course/qualification before DMQ but as stalking became more popular someone saw the cash cow of a course then with various police licensing departments insisting on it for a deer calibre rifle then ££££ partly shown by the low take up for lvl2

 

[JH83]

A lantra accredited qualification is very much worth the paper its Written on!!... and PDS 1 is a lantra accredited qualification....
The Dsc is and always will only be a benchmark qualification and while ever they (dmq) keep moving the goalposts with what they require to pass their certificates ie 1 deer for level two instead of three, they will become less relevant.... infact I've already noticed some adverts are asking for dsc1 or equivalent in their person specifications....
Remember where DMQ came from.... someone in BASC who came up with an idea and then through his position and Contacts was able to convince fc to get on board to 'recognise' it.... and at the time there was nothing else of its kind and so it got more recognition to the point that it became the industry standard and adopted by the police (fc already had their fingers in the pie).....
LANTRA training is much more recognised by industry and I for one would take on someone with a PDS certificate.... as it shows they've trained to, and achieved a standard that is accredited by an outside body as opposed to internal body who actually created the qualification (dmq ltd) .

The very fact that Dmq won't recognise a lantra accreditation and allow that person to do their dsc2 just shows that there's a money making undertone there.....

The deer industry needs a good shake up and there needs to be more acceptance for whatever training/qualification provider the

I find the origins of the PDS questionable to say the least. The whole operation appears to be a device for fleecing newbies. Quite clearly there are multiple folks either misled, or not corrected, that attaining the qualification carries weight-which is disingenuous.

I’ll leave it at that.

 

[Puds]

I only did the assessment day, not the 3 days prior.

I’ve just done that (and passed) as I can’t get weekdays off work to attend non-work courses. I made sure I studied using the BDS ‘Deer Data’ quizzes and other bits of relevant revision for a couple of months beforehand, then booked on for the assessment day.

 

[VSS]

I notice that Jelen deer management, a long time provider of DSC courses, have jumped ship. They're now offering the PDS courses instead.

 

[Dickie]

I notice that Jelen deer management, a long time provider of DSC courses, have jumped ship. They're now offering the PDS courses instead.

More lucrative by the looks there’s 4 courses pre 1, lvl1, pre2 lvl 2.

 

[cookingfat]

A lantra accredited qualification is very much worth the paper its Written on!!... and PDS 1 is a lantra accredited qualification....
The Dsc is and always will only be a benchmark qualification and while ever they (dmq) keep moving the goalposts with what they require to pass their certificates ie 1 deer for level two instead of three, they will become less relevant.... infact I've already noticed some adverts are asking for dsc1 or equivalent in their person specifications....
Remember where DMQ came from.... someone in BASC who came up with an idea and then through his position and Contacts was able to convince fc to get on board to 'recognise' it.... and at the time there was nothing else of its kind and so it got more recognition to the point that it became the industry standard and adopted by the police (fc already had their fingers in the pie).....
LANTRA training is much more recognised by industry and I for one would take on someone with a PDS certificate.... as it shows they've trained to, and achieved a standard that is accredited by an outside body as opposed to internal body who actually created the qualification (dmq ltd) .

The very fact that Dmq won't recognise a lantra accreditation and allow that person to do their dsc2 just shows that there's a money making undertone there.....

The deer industry needs a good shake up and there needs to be more acceptance for whatever training/qualification provider the person chooses....

I think this is the best explanation of the difference between DMQ and Lantra( well done )
Lantra is recognised by Ofqual and DMQ is not and they have been turned down for recognition twice to my knowledge but who is doing the quality control on Lantra!
DMQ are a deer industry qualification recognised by the industry we work in.
Lantra are recognised by the government through Ofqual.
so where does that leave us?

 

[teyhan1]

I personally have been a long term BDS disliker since they stuffed all of the NSCC (National stalkers competence certificate) holders by introducing DSC.
I distinctly remember sitting the Advanced NSCC which was a 5 day course with COMPULSORY accommodation as extra, only to be told that DSC was coming and we’d only qualify for DSC1.
FWIW NSCC and Adv. NSCC had all of DSC1 DSC2 and the BDS Deer Management Course.
Easy maths. They turned 2 courses in to 3 and since that day their commercial wing have never had my support.
And yes, I have DSC1 & 2 too.

 

[RF76]

In response perhaps, this has just been released.

 

[8x57]

I think this is the best explanation of the difference between DMQ and Lantra( well done )
Lantra is recognised by Ofqual and DMQ is not and they have been turned down for recognition twice to my knowledge but who is doing the quality control on Lantra!
DMQ are a deer industry qualification recognised by the industry we work in.
Lantra are recognised by the government through Ofqual.
so where does that leave us?

The fact that DMQ has been turned down twice is something that I was unaware off.
That certainly puts a new perspective on it and would certainly make things very interesting if ever a mandatory qualifications requirement were introduced such as by the FC with regard to their stalking leases. It looks like county stalking has a strong case for their qualification to be given equal recognition, perhaps an even stronger case than DMQ?

 

[Cris]

The fact that DMQ has been turned down twice is something that I was unaware off.
That certainly puts a new perspective on it and would certainly make things very interesting if ever a mandatory qualifications requirement were introduced such as by the FC with regard to their stalking leases. It looks like county stalking has a strong case for their qualification to be given equal recognition, perhaps an even stronger case than DMQ?

And theres the rub, we will all end up having to do PDS, even Jellen PWS have seen the light and jumped.

 

[Ratel]

Wasn’t there a BDS stalking course/qualification before DMQ but as stalking became more popular someone saw the cash cow of a course then with various police licensing departments insisting on it for a deer calibre rifle then ££££ partly shown by the low take up for lvl2

Yes there was indeed. I did this as a laugh when it first came out. It was based loosely on the St Hubert club training but the SHC was over a minimum training of a day twice a year for a minimum of three years with practical stalking in between. I well remember the BDS attending a couple of St HC training sessions in Thetford forest. Then lo and behold out came the Woodland stalkers cert. Definitely a cash cow right through to today. As said before I did DSC1,2 and AW until DSC announce that it would cost to stay an AW. I don't think it did in the end.

 

[Dickie]

Yes there was indeed. I did this as a laugh when it first came out. It was based loosely on the St Hubert club training but the SHC was over a minimum training of a day twice a year for a minimum of three years with practical stalking in between. I well remember the BDS attending a couple of St HC training sessions in Thetford forest. Then lo and behold out came the Woodland stalkers cert. Definitely a cash cow right through to today. As said before I did DSC1,2 and AW until DSC announce that it would cost to stay an AW. I don't think it did in the end.

That was it woodland stalkers cert I couldn't remember the name. I might be wrong on this but didn't they have 2 shooting tests 1 for lowland and 1 for hill stalking?

 

[Ratel]

That was it woodland stalkers cert I couldn't remember the name. I might be wrong on this but didn't they have 2 shooting tests 1 for lowland and 1 for hill stalking?

I only did the one.

 

[8x57]

I don't know about DSC/DMQ being a cash cow but they seem to have made some ill judged decisions in recent times resulting in them possibly being overtaken or even disregarded as being the go too qualifications in the future if they don't reappraise the situation.

 

[Dickie]

I only did the one.

I might be wrong then but thought it was either a choice or location thing. There's bound to be one of the ancients on here will come along with the answer once they have woken up and remembered their login.

 

[Dickie]

I don't know about DSC/DMQ being a cash cow but they seem to have made some ill judged decisions in recent times resulting in them possibly being overtaken or even disregarded as being the go too qualifications in the future if they don't reappraise the situation.

Yep looks like the ship has sailed and a new one is already on the berth.

 

[Ratel]

I might be wrong then but thought it was either a choice or location thing. There's bound to be one of the ancients on here will come along with the answer once they have woken up and remembered their login.

I am that Ancient.

 

[Dickie]

I am that Ancient.

Then well-done for getting up and remembering your login

 

[JH83]

Too many folks seem to think that fieldsports owes them a living. Driven shooting becoming an ‘industry’ is currently its downfall. Random folks appearing out of nowhere declaring themselves the second coming of stalking Jesus, and in the process inventing a load of courses is a dire path-in my opinion.

 

[Dickie]

Too many folks seem to think that fieldsports owes them a living. Driven shooting becoming an ‘industry’ is currently its downfall. Random folks appearing out of nowhere declaring themselves the second coming of stalking Jesus, and in the process inventing a load of courses is a dire path-in my opinion.

I think we are lucky that we don't have loads of courses just 2 and 2 levels currently DSC and PDS. What we are missing are organisations that sing off the same hymn sheet and can use science to oppose or question govt quango when they make things up as they go along. Slightly off topic.