Rifle shot out?

[spannulman]

I’m hoping for some advice from anyone who has been in this position before please.
I have a Zastava 308 Stutzen which I think has reached the end of its life. I bought it three yrs ago and had the devil of a job getting it zeroed well enough to hunt with. I sorted the stock problem ( it lacks end cap so never fully floating OR securely clamped)

last time I zeroed it was 2-3 in groups at 100yd which was just about ok. I’ve taken several deer with it but sometimes shot placement was not as I expected and I had my doubts so I just used it for running deer targets at the h4h days.

a nice sunny day today so took it with me to test and do some gong shooting between stalks and found poi a foot low and had six rounds widely spread apart. Some pairs went 4” apart. The next or an inch and the third or a few inches again. I think that’s it for me. I definitely can’t shoot deer with it like this, and I’ve spent far more on cartridges trying to get it right than it cost me. (£100) it is about 40 yrs old or more and belonged to a retired forestry ranger: it has had a lot
Of use.
In the photo I have numbered each pair of shots. Ignore the holes nr the mark, they are from last time I used the target with the 243.

it was a ‘starter stutzen’. I’d always wanted one and nearly swapped/sold my silver pigeon for a lovely männlicher Stutzen but thought I’d try a cheap one and if I love having one get something better later.


to get to the point, does my experience above suggest a worn barrel?
And, if so, how does one dispose of a rifle. The Mauser action is lovely and smooth and it closes like a safe. I don’t know anything about customs but it might be that scrapping it it a waste and someone could use it as a base for a new rifle. But I don’t know enough about that.

I’m sure I could go to a gun shop and ask them to scrap it. That would be my first option, I imagine they write it off your ticket and I notify the police. But can I then go and buy another 308? It seems logical that scrapping a rifle opens up a slot in that calibre.

i no longer enjoy the noise of 18” barrelled unmoderated rifles so may look at Bergara single shot or a short bolt action. I’ve loved using a short, light 308 and would like that again but in something with a mod but still some character.

Sorry for the jackanory, in summary, is a wandering poi a sign of a worn out rifle? And does anyone know the process for getting rid of one before buying another of the same calibre.
Thank you chaps.

 

[kennyc]

looks like the action is loose in the stock (or the barrel is coming loose )

 

[old keeper]

I've never personally experienced a "shot out" barrel but would guess that a worn-out barrel would show a degree of consistency albeit accuracy would be compromised. By the look of the target, other factors are in play, pressure on the barrel from the woodwork or as Kennyc says barrel or action problems

 

[jcampbellsmith]

Sell it.
Regards
JCS

 

[8x57]

Spannulman there's clearly something quite wrong with your rifle, so take it to a riflesmith or get someone who really knows rifles to have a look at it. It may be something relatively easy to fix or a way of resolving the problem without needing to scrap it.

If you do decide to dispose of it it's not a simple matter of the RFD striking it off your FAC and informing the police, then you being able to go out and buy a replacement. You will need to inform the police of its disposal and then apply for a variation of your FAC in order to obtain a replacement slot on your certificate. Don't forget that if you do scrap it the action alone may well have some value.

 

[Rhodesianjess]

Have had this happen to me,in my case the scope was the reason. Personally, take advice from a good riflesmith/ builder. Worth whatever he'll charge you. Best regards Jess

 

[spannulman]

Thanks for that, I hadn’t realised. I assumed when you scrap or sell a rifle it is written off your ticket, and you Then have a slot for another of that calibre. It seems bonkers to have to go through variations process and £20 just to be allowed to buy another of the same.
So if I sold a rifle to someone, sent the transfer form to the police, I would not be able to buy another and have the Rfd add it to my cert?
When you have a vacant slot the rfd writes it in the cert and you send the form off. But you don’t send the fac in as well. The s/n of the new rifle won’t be printed in the very u tip the neXt version is issued.
Just seems very odd. To need a variation for something you already possess but are just swapping like for like. There must be a logical rationale for this but I can’t see one.

but thanks for the advice all the same.

 

[spannulman]

Have had this happen to me,in my case the scope was the reason. Personally, take advice from a good riflesmith/ builder. Worth whatever he'll charge you. Best regards Jess

Thanks, but the rifle only cost me £100. It isn’t worth spending more trying to sort it i don’t. A few boxes of ammo to zero or sort any changes made would be more than it was worth.

 

[Rhodesianjess]

If you suspect the scope I can pm a contact number for the guy that did mine. Very reasonable rates, superb job, scope back to work! ATB.

 

[Utectok]

So this happened to me although not so badly and everyone on the forum was of the opinion you can’t shoot out a .308 well nearly everyone. Turns out my barrel was gubbed! So I found a rifle at a dealers and then asked them to put my old rifle on their ticket and try and sell it as a donor action. Then it was a simple one for one variation which is free. Of course I did have to pay rfd to rfd fees to send my rifle and get the new one.

 

[Utectok]

Thanks for that, I hadn’t realised. I assumed when you scrap or sell a rifle it is written off your ticket, and you Then have a slot for another of that calibre. It seems bonkers to have to go through variations process and £20 just to be allowed to buy another of the same.
So if I sold a rifle to someone, sent the transfer form to the police, I would not be able to buy another and have the Rfd add it to my cert?
When you have a vacant slot the rfd writes it in the cert and you send the form off. But you don’t send the fac in as well. The s/n of the new rifle won’t be printed in the very u tip the neXt version is issued.
Just seems very odd. To need a variation for something you already possess but are just swapping like for like. There must be a logical rationale for this but I can’t see one.

but thanks for the advice all the same.

One for one variation is free

 

[1894]

I seriously doubt anyone could shoot out a 308 stutzen. Would they honestly put up with 3000+ ear ringing, shoulder hurting fireball blasts...

Stutzens are infamous for wandering zeros.

If you're concerned about value vs work I think its indicative you have no special love for it and as such I'd get rid. If you like it spend as you wish. I took a serviceable ZG47 and over 14years have spent a fortune getting it exactly as I want. I doubt I'd get what I spent on the trigger alone but its special to me

 

[Lateral]

Sell it.
Regards
JCS

To who ??? Telling them what ????

 

[Border]

It's a classic

 

[spannulman]

To who ??? Telling them what ????

you’re right. I wouldn’t sell it knowing it doesn’t hold zero. But as a donor action if that is a thing, fine.

i think it is the lack of Metal end cap. I’ve tried all sorts. The business cards u der the barrel got it grouping at 2”. I shot a red with it near home and a few roe up north but it has been in the cabinet for 12-18 months And the next time I use it the poi has moved a foot and the group is 8 inches.

they can’t all be like this or no one would use them in Europe like they do. I don’t think Stutzens a flawed fundamentally but this one has a problem. I’m not emotionally attached to it and can’t use it on game so will replace.
Now have the faff with variation for the same calibre which I hadn’t realised.

 

[Greenmist]

Is everything tight that should be? have you tried giving it a good clean?

 

[BEAR1]

One thing for certain though is if you don't sort it out it's not going to do your confidence much good.

 

[victormeldrew]

A friend had a similar experience with a .243. It went from good accuracy to hardly able to stay on an A4 sheet very quickly apparently.
He had the barrel bore scoped which confirmed that the barrel was finished, so he replaced it with a new rifle.

Appreciate that you don't want to spend much money on it, but having it bore scoped shouldn't cost very much I'd have thought. The results would then dictate how to proceed.

Should the barrel be shot out & you decide to replace it, it may be worth considering a new barrel as an alternative option. As far as I'm aware, re-barrelling wouldn't involve any variation. However, if there is no emotional attachment, this will influence your decision.

v

 

[Lateral]

you’re right. I wouldn’t sell it knowing it doesn’t hold zero. But as a donor action if that is a thing, fine.

i think it is the lack of Metal end cap. I’ve tried all sorts. The business cards u der the barrel got it grouping at 2”. I shot a red with it near home and a few roe up north but it has been in the cabinet for 12-18 months And the next time I use it the poi has moved a foot and the group is 8 inches.

they can’t all be like this or no one would use them in Europe like they do. I don’t think Stutzens a flawed fundamentally but this one has a problem. I’m not emotionally attached to it and can’t use it on game so will replace.
Now have the faff with variation for the same calibre which I hadn’t realised.

I'm struggling to believe your results are due to a "shot out barrel", even badly matched ammunition doesn't tend to shoot like that.

 

[Sonicdmb73]

Thanks for that, I hadn’t realised. I assumed when you scrap or sell a rifle it is written off your ticket, and you Then have a slot for another of that calibre. It seems bonkers to have to go through variations process and £20 just to be allowed to buy another of the same.
So if I sold a rifle to someone, sent the transfer form to the police, I would not be able to buy another and have the Rfd add it to my cert?
When you have a vacant slot the rfd writes it in the cert and you send the form off. But you don’t send the fac in as well. The s/n of the new rifle won’t be printed in the very u tip the neXt version is issued.
Just seems very odd. To need a variation for something you already possess but are just swapping like for like. There must be a logical rationale for this but I can’t see one.

but thanks for the advice all the same.

First things first get the rifle to a decent ‘smith and see if they can find a fault. You could have anything from loose action screws to the barrel being pitted that badly it’s damaging the bullets as they’re fired. Hard to say simply from a description and your photo.

The second thing is that even “shot out” the rifle might have some value to someone or as a base for your own semi custom.
I will mention that it doesn’t need a stutzen stock either Mauser actions will fit in other Mauser stocks. In the same calibre you don’t have to worry about disposal or variations it is a case of gunsmith fits new barrel and off to the proof house.
There’s a good choice of barrels around some ‘smith’s might even have a “take off” barrel kicking around that will bring your rifle back to life for minimal cost. It still involves some fitting work but not the full cost of starting from a blank.
There’s a good choice of new barrels at various price ranges available too. Possibly cheaper and less hassle than buying a new rifle.