Right to roam

[308rws]

Reading this thread, all I can say is that the UK seems to have some strange notions about property rights. Maybe that is because you have less public land(?). Maybe because the Monarchy used to own all of it(?). Regardless, strange.

As to an easy solution for the 1,000's of dog walkers and other idiots tearing up the forests and woods...introduce some actual predators. Wolves, bears, mountain lions/cougars, etc.

People tend to respect what they fear. Especially when they're not at the top of the food chain.

After a few get mauled, they'll be a bit more observant and respectful. If they die, then Darwinism wins in the end. You're just weeding out the dumb ones. Problem solved.

Leave the path and enter the foodchain!

 

[Heym SR20]

I managed public land for a large part of my working life and believe me we got more than our share of non responsible access takers.

I managed farmland belonging to a Edinburgh City Council that was slap bang between two housing estates and if it wasn't by drug couriers on motorbikes it was a travellers encampment. We had to drive in front of the combine to stop neds throwing stuff into the header and bales had to be lifted as soon as they hit the ground or they were troched.

I then spent 12 years with Forestry and Land Scotland. The level of public expectation was off the scale and if you sneezed in the wrong direction there were vexatious formal complaints to both FKS and politicians.

Many have the view that because its public land they have even more right to use and abuse it. 4x4's and cross bikes going where they want and demanding that areas are provided for them to play are just one aspect. Commercial dog walkers by the thousand. If there perhaps a parallel with the section of the deer stalking world that think they should be provided with access for their pastime??

Public access -laws or no laws its going to happen more and more - wether you agree with ot or not your just going to have to learn to live with it.

What really irritates is that Edinburgh City Council and the Holyrood Government absolutely has the powers to enforce such breaches and to fund the police properly so that they have resources and inclination to deal with this.

Yet they don’t. We have an absolute menace with kids on Scrambler bikes - both electric and petrol, no livence plates no helmets going all around the city streets. There were three last week doing wheelies straight through all the tourists on Carlton hill. I had to walk past them and they gunned their bikes and threatened to run me over. I went straight to Gayfield square police station to report and gave a witness statement. Nothing more has happened. They were at it again today.

The legislation to deal with all the mess, damage to crops and property is in the legislation, threatening behaviour and endangering life is prosecutable offences with jail time. But there is feck all done about it.

 

[WW.]

Reading this thread, all I can say is that the UK seems to have some strange notions about property rights. Maybe that is because you have less public land(?). Maybe because the Monarchy used to own all of it(?). Regardless, strange.

As to an easy solution for the 1,000's of dog walkers and other idiots tearing up the forests and woods...introduce some actual predators. Wolves, bears, mountain lions/cougars, etc.

People tend to respect what they fear. Especially when they're not at the top of the food chain.

After a few get mauled, they'll be a bit more observant and respectful. If they die, then Darwinism wins in the end. You're just weeding out the dumb ones. Problem solved.

Which is why I tend to wryly remark that I won't object to rewilders releasing apex predators as long as they start in the home counties.

 

[Bo Diddley]

What you describe is the "Eunochification of the Police Force."
It's happening all around the country. @Heym SR20

 

[NullMac]

Just looking at the local forestry commission open access land and anywhere near parking is basically a dog toilet.

You don’t have to be that remote. These ****s in their campervans seem to think that anything green is remote countryside so it’s ok for their dog to **** on it.

 

[Caberfeidh]

You don’t have to be that remote. These ****s in their campervans seem to think that anything green is remote countryside so it’s ok for their dog to **** on it.

Not just their dogs unfortunately……but themselves as well. Human excrement on the NC500, known as the WC500 to some locals, is a very regular and almost daily occurrence. Disgusting individuals with a freeloading outlook and they need reigned in to accommodate the fragile environment and eco structure up here.

 

[308rws]

So, the consensus appears to be that in the modern information age the British public don’t know their rights and responsibilities when it comes to the countryside. They don’t abide by the law nor respect the natural environment. Whilst those in authority appear to do little or nothing to regulate this sort of anti-social behaviour.

 

[Mike1979]

So, the consensus appears to be that in the modern information age the British public don’t know their rights and responsibilities when it comes to the countryside. They don’t abide by the law nor respect the natural environment. Whilst those in authority appear to do little or nothing to regulate this sort of anti-social behaviour.

That about sums it up

 

[slider]

So, the consensus appears to be that in the modern information age the British public don’t know their rights and responsibilities when it comes to the countryside. They don’t abide by the law nor respect the natural environment. Whilst those in authority appear to do little or nothing to regulate this sort of anti-social behaviour.

Pretty much, but would amend to say that whole some don't others fully aware of their rights and responsibilities but choose to ignore them.

 

[muddy42]

hot off the press

Dog owners face unlimited fines for farm livestock attacks

Police will have new powers to seize and detain dogs that have attacked or chased farm animals.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[Heym SR20]

hot off the press

Dog owners face unlimited fines for farm livestock attacks

Police will have new powers to seize and detain dogs that have attacked or chased farm animals.

www.bbc.co.uk

Fine - there has been legislation similar for many years - as in liability rests with the of the dog owner.

But its never enforced.

Go elsewhere in the world, countryside / wildlife rangers or similar have power of arrest. If you leave litter, damage crops or livestock you likely to face a fine or other penalty.

North Coast 500 and Edinburgh.

Thanks to the SNP both have become like Disney World, but without any of the infrastructure. When I first moved to Edinburgh at the turn of the century, it was a city of finance, commerce and research. City centre restaurants were full at lunchtime of people doing business. There was huge amounts of optomism. In terms of technology Edinburgh was destined to be the next Oxford and Cambridge tech spin out hot house. We have lost all that. All the offices closed and being turned into budget hotels and busloads of mostly Chinese and Indian tourists crammed on the streets eating take away food of poor quality. The City Council has forced out business with high paid professionals for tourists on a budget.

The NW500 could have been a huge opportunity. The councils should have allowed farmers etc to set up lots of little one / two plot of camper van sites. Composting toilet and a shower. And local producers selling local produce getting money going into local economy, or indeed local restaurants etc.

Instead there is lots of promotion of the NW500, and lots want to do it. But there are not enough facilities for anything like the number of visitors. And those that are there are bloody expensive, meaning that every fills up at Tescos in Inverness rather than buying local.

Most visitors have a pretty poor experience, do it once and go elsewhere.

 

[sauer]

Been said above ....

Rules rules rules . We have plenty
But not worth a f*king thing if no enforcement ....
Goes for sooo manu of our laws

Paul

 

[slider]

That about sums it up

 

[slider]

hot off the press

Dog owners face unlimited fines for farm livestock attacks

Police will have new powers to seize and detain dogs that have attacked or chased farm animals.

www.bbc.co.uk

applies to England and Wales only. Similar penalties have been in place in Scotland for years but don't make any difference and large fines are rarely imposed

 

[muddy42]

applies to England and Wales only. Similar penalties have been in place in Scotland for years but don't make any difference and large fines are rarely imposed

Totally agree! Here is the waffly copy and past letter I received after our incident. This was after a dog chassed a flock of sheep round and round a field and then one died of its injuries. The owner was caught red handed, loads of witnesses and iphone evidence, no prosecution. Our costs were limited to the dead sheep, which is another hidden issue, there is no account for the distress caused to the rest of the flock, potentially loss of weight or fertility (it was November so just after the tup visited them). The police issued a Dog Control Notice, but I have no clue what it says because of GDPR!

 

[HonestJohn]

This should deter anyone not respecting the natural environment or countryside yeah, they’ll be shivering in their seats as they read this!!

Fly tippers face punishment of clearing up rubbish

Fly tippers could face up to 20 hours of community service removing rubbish they have illegally dumped.

www.bbc.co.uk