Russian Reloading

Foxyboy43

Well-Known Member
Not strictly a deer-related topic more an extreme reloading example. Being a keen rifle shooter and interested in older military rifles I once bought an 1944 M48 Mosin Nagant carbine in 7.62x54R for use at our club range. It was a real old timer with a pretty rough bore whoch had been counterbored for about an inch reflecting its heavy use and leaving a very short barrel indeed. Anyway clutching my new rifle and 2 boxes of PPU ammo off I set to the range. As it only had battle sights I set up a white card at 15 metres to see how it went. It very quickly became apparent why the americans call the M44 the "Russian Boomstick" as every time it "detonated" a 3ft ball of flame emerged from the barrel. This of course caused great merriment which was heightened by the initial, and I use it cautiously, 5 shot "grouping" - see photo - 1 miss and 4 sideways!
!image.webp

Not bad for 15 yds! At 50 I couldn't be sure of hitting the range backstop so after much discussion and merriment I retired gracefully from the field - straight back to the dealer I had bought it from with my ears ringing (in both senses) to comments like "so that's why it has an underslung bayonet".
To cut a very long story short he phoned a Mosin shooter and was given the legendary advice "they don't like PPU"! One week later and back to the range clutching a box of S&B and a dozen reloads in Sierra Prohunter .311 calibre . In short the new ammo transformed what was basically a "club" into a rifle which was grouping 2 inches at 50 yds - probably all that the model was ever expected to do at Stalingrad or anywhere else on the Eastern Front!! The homeloads also went very well and I was a happy bunny. What's more there was a sudden interest in Mosins. Since then I have perfected a round which will regularly group 3 inches at 100yds and still retain the visual and sonic wow factor.
So why am I telling you this - for me it was a perfect lesson in how with a little research and experimentation even a "dog" might be tweaked to deliver results better than you ever hoped for. I was so pleased with the outcome I bought the M44's big brother - 91/30 which had a mirror bore and with a long eye relief pistol scope attached will shoot MOA all day long. See photo as an illustration.
image.webp
 
my experience with PPU is it’s very much like Marmite. Your rifle either loves it or hates it.
I have found both sides, a 243 that did around half MOA with 90’s and a 6.5x55 that was inconsistent to say the least.
 
I have a few dozen of the Nagants -mostly Finn reworks from Tikka, SAKO, Hammerli, etc. They shoot very well when fed the right ammo. When I had younger eyes I won a 100 yard military bench rest shoot using cast bullets and a Model 39 SAKO Nagant. Aggregate was exactly MOA (3, five-shot groups) but I fired one group that was 5/16" CTC. Hung in my shop for years. If you really want to experience accuracy in the Nagants, look up a Finn.

By the way, I raise the issue to the statement that Nagants don't like PPU. Back in the early eighties, PPU (sold by Century Arms in the State of Vermont) or Norma was the only boxer primed game in town. I shot hundreds of rounds of PPU. Not great, but 2-3 MOA with open sights. Still have 200 or so of these rounds left from back then. ~Muir
 
For the more academic out there - how can a bullet turn through 90 degrees (at least) in only 15 yards yet another round of the same .311 calibre shoot straight out to 100? I do not get it. Thoughts welcome plz.
 
Interesting Muir - never tried slugging my M44 to determine true bore because it was pretty ragged to the eye. I was really happy to get it to perform at all and many at the range thought it fascinating! I know about the Finns - super rifles and fetch a premium if you can find them - if you watch Life Below Zero the Inuit lady regularly knocks over running reindeer with one. Best bit is when she has it over her shoulder on a sling - it is longer than she is!
As an aside pals in the US not that long ago were buying a crate of 20 91/30s with slings, bayonets, cleaning kits, oil bottles and 2x400 tins of soviet ammo for less than a grand US. One guy known as Mosin Tom had well over 100 in his basement - from memory at least one of every manufacturer. From what I hear they are now in short supply so worth a few quid! Same guy in my presence bought a WW1 lee enfield with grenade launcher attachment and a box of blanks. We proceeded to the golf driving range and spent a happy hour launching tennis balls out of the lee enfield and no-one gave it a thought. Only in america!!
 
I've got a couple Mosins , a 91/30 and a 91/30 sniper and recently traded off a Polish made ( factory 11 stamp ) M44 that was still in the cosmoline . I sold the M44 because I would've cleaned it and fired it , like the previous one lol . A friend of mine offered me a silly amount of money for it and threatened to desecrate my remains if I shot this one . I ended up trading him for a Minty H&R Model 340 in 06 for it .
I've always liked the MN's , they will surprise you with their accuracy when fed ammo they like . My wife put five rounds into a sub MOA group last fall with my sniper 91/30 and some Barnaul FMJ's I had . The Finn made rifles are even more accurate , but are creeping up in price . I picked up my M39 for $350 CDN not that long ago . If you can find one for sale these days , they go for well north of a thousand northern pesos now . The polish M44's are right up there with the Finn rifles for fit and finish and all the ones I've shot were very accurate ............ the nuclear facial they provide is just a bonus lol .

AB
 
I found a Model 91/59 (?) Nagant in my stuff. It's like a shortened 91/30. Looks unfired. ~Muir
 
You have some pretty scarce Mosin variants brother . I've always thought that they've been unfairly berated over the years . They always worked , were reasonably accurate and very inexpensive , that's a lot to most people , including me .

AB
 
Scarce? Never gave that one a second thought.
The coolest Russians I have purchased lately were early-dated Hex Receiver arsenal rebuilds. $135 each with full kit. I bought five of them and gave most away to my kids. I did buy a 1899 dated 1891at was all original but for the [SA] stamp on the right side of the receiver. Nice bore on that one. Had the old Imperial Crest. Very nice. At the same show I found a Finn capture 1891 that had the finish stripped off and no bolt head. Being a Nagant-o-phile I had a small pile of bolt heads so I took it home. I finished the stock with pine tar dissolved in acetone (iirc) and put a coat of lacquer over the result. Doesn't look 100% original but tosses 180 grain, .314" diameter Lee RN cast bullets into little holes. I bought that one for $45. And that was not all that long ago, either....~Muir
 
Interesting stuff thanks chaps.
91/30s start at £350 upwards in UK! Call me a heretic but as my old peepers can no longer see the sights and target together I mounted long-eye relief pistol scopes on each using Brass Stacker mounts on the M44 and simply removing the back sight on the 91/30 which reveals a fairly standard 11(?) Mil dovetail - transformed them and more importantly my shooting/enjoyment at the range out to 300. Worked so well and for the same reason I did the same to my M48 Mauser - brilliant result and really shows just how accurate these old girls can be!! Now I wonder if the NI police would let me have them for deer? Some chance!!
 
Interesting stuff thanks chaps.
91/30s start at £350 upwards in UK! Call me a heretic but as my old peepers can no longer see the sights and target together I mounted long-eye relief pistol scopes on each using Brass Stacker mounts on the M44 and simply removing the back sight on the 91/30 which reveals a fairly standard 11(?) Mil dovetail - transformed them and more importantly my shooting/enjoyment at the range out to 300. Worked so well and for the same reason I did the same to my M48 Mauser - brilliant result and really shows just how accurate these old girls can be!! Now I wonder if the NI police would let me have them for deer? Some chance!!
I'm in the same boat as you , my eyes aren't getting any younger either . I have a intermediate eye relief scope on my Swedish M38 , it works great , and it doesn't effect the originality of the rifle .

AB
 
Not strictly a deer-related topic more an extreme reloading example. Being a keen rifle shooter and interested in older military rifles I once bought an 1944 M48 Mosin Nagant carbine in 7.62x54R for use at our club range. It was a real old timer with a pretty rough bore whoch had been counterbored for about an inch reflecting its heavy use and leaving a very short barrel indeed. Anyway clutching my new rifle and 2 boxes of PPU ammo off I set to the range. As it only had battle sights I set up a white card at 15 metres to see how it went. It very quickly became apparent why the americans call the M44 the "Russian Boomstick" as every time it "detonated" a 3ft ball of flame emerged from the barrel. This of course caused great merriment which was heightened by the initial, and I use it cautiously, 5 shot "grouping" - see photo - 1 miss and 4 sideways!
!View attachment 180423

Not bad for 15 yds! At 50 I couldn't be sure of hitting the range backstop so after much discussion and merriment I retired gracefully from the field - straight back to the dealer I had bought it from with my ears ringing (in both senses) to comments like "so that's why it has an underslung bayonet".
To cut a very long story short he phoned a Mosin shooter and was given the legendary advice "they don't like PPU"! One week later and back to the range clutching a box of S&B and a dozen reloads in Sierra Prohunter .311 calibre . In short the new ammo transformed what was basically a "club" into a rifle which was grouping 2 inches at 50 yds - probably all that the model was ever expected to do at Stalingrad or anywhere else on the Eastern Front!! The homeloads also went very well and I was a happy bunny. What's more there was a sudden interest in Mosins. Since then I have perfected a round which will regularly group 3 inches at 100yds and still retain the visual and sonic wow factor.
So why am I telling you this - for me it was a perfect lesson in how with a little research and experimentation even a "dog" might be tweaked to deliver results better than you ever hoped for. I was so pleased with the outcome I bought the M44's big brother - 91/30 which had a mirror bore and with a long eye relief pistol scope attached will shoot MOA all day long. See photo as an illustration.
View attachment 180422
Had one for a short while, great fun and as you said got a lot of attention on the firing line.

Great fun but I couldn’t put up with the grouping which was around 4 moa. Replaced it with a Schmidt Rubin K31 which is an awesome piece of engineering.

My K31 is conditioned for deer, not that I’ve manage and to shoot one yet with it as 50 yards is my limit with irons
 
Mosins are great fun, a bolt action you have to beat the crap out of to cycle the bolt! 😂😂

very fun to shoot and very accurate in the right hands!

I would have wanted to wield one in anger at Stalingrad! Although it’s better than just carrying a strip of rounds and waiting for your
buddy to be shot!

edit - attached in me shooting the last one I had a shot of, not sure what type of mowing it was but it was pretty accurate for irons (and considering it was me shooting it! 😂)

regards,
Gixer
 

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Had one for a short while, great fun and as you said got a lot of attention on the firing line.

Great fun but I couldn’t put up with the grouping which was around 4 moa. Replaced it with a Schmidt Rubin K31 which is an awesome piece of engineering.

My K31 is conditioned for deer, not that I’ve manage and to shoot one yet with it as 50 yards is my limit with irons
Yep a great gun. Can you not scope it - even with a pistol scope - it really transformed all my old girls!IMG_20201108_2051224_rewind.webp
 
I enjoy using my 91/30 as is myself . For some reason , I always end up carrying it in cold snowy weather I think the rifle prefers it that way lol .

AB
 
I'm pretty sure PPU is .310". Or is was...~Muir
Out of interest I just measured PPU - .311 for the 174g bullets I have for reloading which shoot not v well out of the Boomstick. The PPU ammo which I first used might be different of course - for obvious reasons (see earlier foto) I never bought them again. Still can't figure how they tumbled at 15yds though.
 
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