The Guardian on deer numbers and the re-introduction of wolves.

[Malxwal]

Trained as a zoologist at Oxford and has been an investigative journalist on environmental matters all over the world.

George Monbiot - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

And yet still an idiot. Well, not an idiot, but massively misguided.
As for land ownership in the UK, it's all a reminder of what a tiny wee bit of land we all live on. There's too many humans, not enough land, let alone enough for wolves.

 

[User00047]

Trained as a zoologist at Oxford and has been an investigative journalist on environmental matters all over the world.

George Monbiot - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Also his main skill set seems to include spouting absolute shite and convincing other people to agree with him, whilst getting paid to do so.
That article heavily criticises the status quo but offers absolutely no details of how any wolf reintroduction could possibly happen in the UK. Just very poor journalism.

 

[Malxwal]

Also his main skill set seems to include spouting absolute shite and convincing other people to agree with him, whilst getting paid to do so.
That article heavily criticises the status quo but offers absolutely no details of how any wolf reintroduction could possibly happen in the UK. Just very poor journalism.

There's always good money to be had in heavily criticising the status quo. He's an arse, but he's not daft.

 

[tozzybum]

Like prickham sorry Packham makes a very good living forcing his opinions on people's way of life .

 

[NP435]

Trained as a zoologist at Oxford and has been an investigative journalist on environmental matters all over the world.

George Monbiot - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

Education and being sensible are not the same, we have the same problem over here with educated idiots who ignore science/law ect. Does he think wolves on your island wont run amok killing livestock and pets? The deer will be reduced sure but what happens when wolves are well fed? Reproduction happens and expanding range. How will people respond when cats and dogs become food? Or as has happened in Idaho dogs being killed when encountering a wolf pack. I'm sure it has happened in other places and either I missed the reporting or nothing was in the press.

 

[Malxwal]

Education and being sensible are not the same, we have the same problem over here with educated idiots who ignore science/law ect. Does he think wolves on your island wont run amok killing livestock and pets? The deer will be reduced sure but what happens when wolves are well fed? Reproduction happens and expanding range. How will people respond when cats and dogs become food? Or as has happened in Idaho dogs being killed when encountering a wolf pack. I'm sure it has happened in other places and either I missed the reporting or nothing was in the press.

Simple thing is here, they'll never have to bother a deer, livestock will always be within easy reach.

 

[David Barker]

Thick as ! Why the heck do these people make comment or offer up advice about stuff they have no actual experience in ? Actually , what the heck is his actual skill set / knowledge in ?

He gets paid for his talks and advice.Very similar to those heading our Venison sector.

 

[moonstone gsp]

I find it strange how the rewilding argument is used for the control of deer yet the same people who spout this don’t seem to take the view that badgers should be culled to reduce bovine TB. Maybe they consider that the damage to trees and grassland is a greater problem than the cost we bear for the slaughter of cattle affected by TB and the trauma to hardworking farmers when they lose a herd they have spent years managing and building up.

 

[308rws]

Be under no illusion, beaver, wolf, bear are only the prelude species.

These Jurassic Park generationals won't be satisfied until dinosaurs are reintroduced! It's all a huge conspiracy to reintroduce alpha predators for the purpose of global population control by turning the human race into prey.

If you haven't done so, you need to read the recent thread on big game rifles:
An excellent article on big game rifles

Think about it, the lead rifle ammunition ban combined with only one .500 NE falling block rifle available for sale on guntrader - that's no coincidence.

PS. Does anyone know the HO recommended minimum calibre for Dromaeosaurids?

 

[Heym SR20]

Plenty of livestock systems around the world work alongside predators. It’s called having shepherds or cowherds along with big dogs who look after the animals, live alongside them, corral them at night and keep predators and thieves away.

Sheep on most farming systems in the UK are only there because of subsidies. Wool no longer even covers the cost of shearing and lambs don’t make a lot of money.

Indeed with the price of land these days about the only profitable crop is windfarms, solar farms or housing. No way can the margins on most arable cover the interest let alone any capital repayments on land.

Contractors to shoot deer cost upwards of £100 a beast. For a full time employee to manage deer you are probably spending best part of £100,000 by the time you have added in vehicles, overhead cost and housing (especially if you take the opportunity cost of a house that rented out for a lot more).

And there are plenty of very wealthy individuals that are buying up large tracts of the UK’s land. And there are plenty of large corporations that will spend good money on carbon credits so they can greenwash their corporate image, and sell this dream to pension funds etc.

Add a few wolves to the situation, in the same way that former ranchland in Southern Africa now has cheetahs and lion all getting fat on impala, kudu etc, and you get even more green points with the green washers.

Buy a big chunk of land, stick on windmills and wolves and you are the big swinging blue eyed wonder of the corporate world. And then charge tourists to see the wolves.

It makes bugger all sense to most on SD, but this is the reality of modern UK.

 

[Bowland blades]

He gets paid for his talks and advice.Very similar to those heading our Venison sector.

I suppose we need to call these idiots out directly whenever the chance comes up !

 

[Bowland blades]

Trained as a zoologist at Oxford and has been an investigative journalist on environmental matters all over the world.

George Monbiot - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

A well qualified Wally taught by those with about the same level of qualified stupidity . I feel ! Number 1 is the wolves will do all the stupid and distinctly un-athletic sheep etc and such and then starve or get run over .

 

[Heym SR20]

A well qualified Wally taught by those with about the same level of qualified stupidity . I feel ! Number 1 is the wolves will do all the stupid and distinctly un-athletic sheep etc and such and then starve or get run over .

And that pretty much makes up for most of the British Government and senior civil servants. I also studied at Oxford and had to mix with many of this sort - they all live and work in a self reinforcing bubble. It made no sense to me until I realised it was nothing more or less than typical tribal or herd animal behaviour. Then it makes sense.

 

[Heym SR20]

I must admit I do think if the likes of Packham, Monbiot et al would turn their attention to the state of our rivers which in turn pollute our seas they would have a very very much greater benefit for all.

And the target of the pollution is easily identified- the various private water companies, property developers and large industrial farming like the US owned chicken industry

‘An utter disgrace’: 90% of England’s most precious river habitats blighted by raw sewage and farming pollution

Observer investigation reveals the shocking state of the country’s protected freshwater sites of special scientific interest

www.theguardian.com

 

[Bowland blades]

And that pretty much makes up for most of the British Government and senior civil servants. I also studied at Oxford and had to mix with many of this sort - they all live and work in a self reinforcing bubble. It made no sense to me until I realised it was nothing more or less than typical tribal or herd animal behaviour. Then it makes sense.

That reminds me about the film of the development of radar when the GPO fella told the guy to dunk his phone in a bowl of water to cure a static issue

 

[Freeforester]

A cyclist in Belgium recently posted a vid of him being tracked and paced by a wolf when on his mtb in a forest over there… another group did for Von der Lying’s pet pony, another group were spotted watching a kids playgroup from a nearby ‘grassy knoll’. The Gruinaud may not have covered these newsworthy items, due to their informative nature…(the items, not the paper)

 

[AGR]

And the target of the pollution is easily identified- the various private water companies, property developers and large industrial farming like the US owned chicken industry

‘An utter disgrace’: 90% of England’s most precious river habitats blighted by raw sewage and farming pollution

Observer investigation reveals the shocking state of the country’s protected freshwater sites of special scientific interest

www.theguardian.com

To be fair, I think you will find that there are thousands of small farms all leaching pollution into water courses. I recently wrote to the minister about it, then found a (ahem) Guardian article regarding farmers having a negotiated get out of jail card for pollution.
Farm pollution is almost un policeable, so the water companies are easier targets.
Going back to the original post, is there not somewhere near Dover to release wolves?

 

[Rasputin]

Beggars belief they could even countenance it but these academic types are devoid of common sense.

Let’s introduce wolves but got forbid we clear the dykes and drainage that’s been neglected for years and causing flooding on account of the all the new houses all because some water voles or crap live there. Just moronic.

 

[AGR]

Beggars belief they could even countenance it but these academic types are devoid of common sense.

Let’s introduce wolves but got forbid we clear the dykes and drainage that’s been neglected for years and causing flooding on account of the all the new houses all because some water voles or crap live there. Just moronic.

Newts. You forgot newts!

 

[Lloyd90]

Is the issue that there are massive amounts of land containing deer in the hands of a select few who just want to charge people big sums to shoot animals and aren’t actually managing the population?

They should open more land up to people on a tag based system, where people can take 1-2 deer for the pot imo.

Also they banned deer being taken by other means (such as deer hound and lurcher etc).

It’s alright for a Wolf to drag down a dear and kill it but it’s cruel and banned for it to be done with dogs?

They should repeal the ban and let the lurcher boys have “one for the pot” every few weeks.

Be more effective on numbers and also be safer than letting the general public loose with guns on others land.

I imagine I will get bashed for this reply lol!