not my battleUK vs US deer stalking attitudes
- Thread starter Tom C
- Start date
not my battle
Rake Aboot
Well-Known Member
I know , it’s mind blowing isn’t it?
I’ve heard the same thing about motorcycles
What kind of man allows himself to be dictated to like that ?
My heart is bleeding for my British brothers in arms. Here in Norway sport shooting ( competitive shooting ) is the next biggest sport, only beaten by football. The big events, like our landsskytterstevne ( national shooting assembly) are broadcasted live on national tv in prime time with huge rating. And no one frowns upon them. Well, there might be some odd persons who argue against shooting sport, but even the media doesn't give them much attention. And hunting , what you call stalking and shooting, also has a large public acceptance. Every 10th Norwegian , adult, male, female, old person in care center, child and baby is a hunter. If you try to figure the percentage of hunters that are actually voters, you will understand why no political party in Norway dare to make hunters their enemy. And even if you aren't a hunter, you are likely to have a dad, uncle or aunt that hunts.
timbrayford
Well-Known Member
I'm afraid that we are rather allowing the antis tail to wag the dog. We have been browbeaten in believing that the default position of the public is unsympathetic but I don't believe that they are. One of the things that has led me to believe this is that I have been socialising my young spaniels by taking them to the pub and what I frequently get asked is if they are working dogs...even by Packhams mother in law!
Hard to compare the two countries due to the size of the place and the very varied cultures across thevstatesm
States are bigger than the UK, so you are comparing the UK to 50 mini countries. New York or Cali celebs would likely get a similar outrage reponse compared to somewhere like Texas or Montana where they wouldn't.
It is also a young country where the frontier history is not that long ago.
There is nothing to shoot in Cyprus, you've killed and eaten all years agoJust different cultures, my family is Greek Cypriots and they are fascinated that me and my mentor stalk deer (especially as they only have them in zoo’s lol), hunt ducks, pheasants and rabbits. There’s nothing in Cyprus you can hunt really and can only own section 2 shotguns no rifles. Most of them have to travel to Greece or Bulgaria to have decent game
I have found though a lot of my friends actually enjoy game meat I give them and show a lot of interest in hunting. However many of their wife’s won’t allow them to have a SGC or FAC even though they eat the food I give out. So if your wife’s don’t moan at you for having firearms consider yourself lucky
Second that, when I was a kid Dad showed me piles of blackbird/thrush feathers on the other side of the hedge boundary,There is nothing to shoot in Cyprus, you've killed and eaten all years ago
Long autos pointers and small game carriers was the order of the day also a Mercedes estate
Maybe I'm stretching a bit, but if one person converts to appreciating hunting or fishing, they might convert another or two in their friend/family group, then another and another. Even if I'm stretching, it can't hurt to provide a positive view of what we all do.
The MeatEater show is somewhat controversial in the US, not sure why. They focus on the hunt, time outdoors, the meat and cooking it a bit more than the redneck/trophy rack themed shows and has (supposedly, I can't prove it) brought more people into hunting.
billy_boyle_2010
Well-Known Member
I think even if you're right- and opening up shooting though word of mouth works- and more pick up the hobby- I don't see how it makes a massive difference in general. But no harm in a positive attitude as you say!
As to MeatEater- its increasing popularity on a hobby that already has highly limited resources. Perhaps the private land has an abundance of animals. But most of the public land is scarce. The more people who compete for a finite resource- the worse it gets.
It's often the way with any finite resource. And those with a financial incentive usually happen to have beliefs which align.
Steve Rinella loves hunting and wants everyone to go hunting. And his business relies on the popularity of hunting. He can shoot (mostly) on private land for 100s of days a year and do very well out of it. Whilst those who can only get a few days a year on public land struggle with the increased competition.
I'm reminded of the incentives around tourism actually. Tourists ruin most places. Those who run businesses tolerate tourists. Those who live in those areas/enjoy the local resources - but who don't get any financial benefit from the tourists- dislike them.
Rafter
Well-Known Member
If my Lady said that my reply would be "you sound like my ex wife".
Only been married once......
Understood agree on how MeatEater markets, but many of his hunts are on public land. Not all certainly. Wealthy people and others who make it their priority hunt plenty of private land. I have several friends in Texas who are far from rich, but lease access and kill several deer, as many quail as they want and a few pigs every year.
Speaking only from a Western US hunter's perspective:
Public land in the Western US is not scarce, it's insanely abundant. In Montana there is certainly more competition on easy-access public land close to population centers. However, there are over 30,000,000 acres of public land across the state, a vast majority of it publicly accessible. Then there are 7,000,000 more acres available in the Block Management Program, and many more in upland bird reserves. Public land elk hunting is very challenging without a doubt. But upland game, waterfowl, bear, deer, coyotes/predators and antelope though not 'easy' are certainly possible with a little effort, sometimes very little. You could bird hunt for months in the mountains and prairies and hardly see another human being. A dedicated hunter could only hunt a small percentage of this land in their entire life, hunting every single day a season is open.
Other states such as Wyoming, Idaho, Colorado, New Mexico, Oregon, Arizona, California, etc. have massive amounts of public land. Texas and other states have very few acres available.
My town is somewhat 'ruined', just exactly as you typed, and MeatEater moved here! The only ones with financial benefit are builders and real estate developers. But it's been a ski and Yellowstone Park destination for a very long time. Nothing new, just more of them. Can't blame anyone for coming though, it's their choice. I do have to drive a bit farther, work a little harder but it's a very small price to pay.
If hunting/stalking is a priority, a person can likely make it happen. My 2 cents.
nun_hunter
Well-Known Member
From my limited understanding of US hunting based on various videos and podcasts it seems public land hunting can be fiercely competitive and not overly successful if you have very limited time or desire to venture more than a few hundred metres from a trailhead.
If the plan is to leave your truck and kill something within a mile or less than you're going to be up against a lot of other hunters with the same idea. If your plan is to hike 10-20 miles into terrain that can only be accessed on foot, then you're going to have a very different experience.
At least the US and other countries with public land and strong hunting cultures (like Australia and NZ) have these various options for going out and hunting by yourself dependent on your time, ability and desire.
RJD
Well-Known Member
Their wives don’t allow them? wTAF?… You need to have a chat with your friends, and it’s nothing to do with shooting..
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Bo Diddley
Well-Known Member
I have two sisters who live in the States. They both lived in South Carolina when I visited for the first time, near Sumter. It was a joy for an English country boy to watch the local folks enjoying the outdoors every weekend. Bass boats behind pickups heading to the waterways, pickups full of hunting hounds heading to the woods, teams of guns in Hi-viz lining the Highways with rifles in hand and not a honking car horn to be heard.
Enjoy your hunt in Kentucky sir.
I would read Devon Deer Stalker's reply to this thread about his experience in Montana. His and mine are first hand. There is no doubt that hunting public land has changed for the worse in the last 10 - 15 years. I hunted places for 15 years and didn't see human being. That's not the case at all now. Things have changed, but one can adapt and have wonderful experiences.
As you wrote, public land can be competitive, especially in two scenarios: early season elk country and near population centers. It can get depressing driving 5 hours and showing up to a bunch of campers and horse trailers in remote elk country. But some of these people are still successful.
However, there is other public land hours from airports/towns that have deer, antelope, upland game birds, predators (mainly coyotes, fox, badgers) and very few hunters. Finding a massive trophy vs. a representative head is challenging. At least in Montana wild game is managed for quantity, not quality. I think it may be the opposite in New Mexico or other states with limited draws.
You can't judge all public land the same. It depends where you go, when and what you're hunting for.
Also, I appreciate your comment about 1 mile vs. going 10 or 20 but honestly, outside of Forest Service/mountain ranges, it would be hard to find a place where you could go 10 miles, even 5, without hitting a border of private land or another road. I drove 6 hours and hiked 3.5 miles off the road to get my antelope this year, a mile farther than I have had to go in the last 30 years. BUT - when I got back to my truck exhausted, a husband and wife had just shot two nice bucks about a half mile off the road. The husband/wife showed up at the right time. BTW, antelope are relatively small and carrying a quartered or boned out antelope, along with the head, isn't 1/4 has hard as 3 or 4 trips hauling out an elk.
It's just different where you go across each state and within each particular state.
Regardless, there are 10s of millions of acres of land that aren't crowded and getting 2 - 4 miles off a road or trail will give a different experience for sure.
RJD
Well-Known Member
I’m a few years older than you, it’s not a generational thing it’s having self respect and standing up for yourself, if any one you think cares about you tells you what you can and can’t do then they don’t care, tel them to get ****ed, whatever gender you or they choose to identify as.I don’t like to get involved in people business
I also take it most folk on here are one generation older than me (I’m 37). My dad wouldn’t take being told what to do, but my generation and the one below me is a different story.
Rake Aboot
Well-Known Member
Control isn’t love or respect.
A Guy Out West
Well-Known Member
You need to understand that Country singers and hunting go hand in hand. Naturally the fans of Country music would give kudos to a picture of a nice buck. The only thing that goes better with Country music is beer.
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