Registering as a food business

[VSS]

Ok, but im still struggling to see the difference between a contractor and a private individual. Im not agreeing or disagreeing with you, i just don't see the difference. Heres the scenario:
There are 2 stalkers, both with dsc2, one is a contractor, one is a private individual, they both shoot a deer and both deer are going into the food chain through a game dealer. Only difference is, the private individual has to be registered and the contractor doesn't!
Why?

The contractor will be working for a company which is itself registered, and the contractor will have to comply with all of the necessary protocols as an employee of that company.
Same as me being registered as a food business, also allows my daughter and others (provided that they have "trained hunter" status, or are under the direct supervision of someone who has) who are culling deer on my behalf and under my jurisdiction, to put carcasses into a game dealers under the name of my business. My cull record will show who actually shot each animal, cross referenced to the individual carcass tag.

 

[mathieson]

Just a quick note to thank all those who posted advice above, particuarly @geoffw who kindly shared his HACCP plans.

At the start of lockdown I decided to get everything sorted and register, so that I could offer venison products for sale directly to local consumers. After some rearrangement and decorating of the small larder that I have at the bottom of the garden (a posh word for what is effectively a converted outside privy) this all culminated with a visit from the local EHO this morning and I was delighted to receive my 5* rating.

The advice in this thread has been really useful, not least because the type of food businesses we have as stalkers is somewhat of a niche area.

So now I am fully registered as a Food Business, as well as having Waste Carrier registration for the transport of Animal By-Products. This is apparently necessary if you go from butchering for personal consumption to becoming a food business - the good news is that it is free to register. I also did my Level 2 Food Hygiene certificate, which can be completed online. This proved to be a very useful course, and definitely relevant, as it helped answer a couple of the questions that I discussed with the EHO.

The EHO couldn't have been more helpful, and I would thoroughly recommend that anyone contemplating registering as a Food Business gives their local officer a call and has a chat.

Having completed the registration I can't help but question why it took me so long. I was somewhat daunted by what I read about the relevant legislation, and also seeing some very professional looking operations that gave me a bad case of larder envy. However the simple operation I have here met all the criteria, so don't be put off if you think it requires a huge investment in state-of-the-art kit.

It has been both an enjoyable and interesting journey, and I now have another outlet for excess venison. Happy Days!

Im going through the process at the moment but my local EHO seams to be very confused by the whole concept of registering as a primary producer as in their words have never heard of this before and are currently in their words “researching” as to relevant procedures and legislation

 

[VSS]

Im going through the process at the moment but my local EHO seams to be very confused by the whole concept of registering as a primary producer as in their words have never heard of this before and are currently in their words “researching” as to relevant procedures and legislation

Go to post #7 in this thread. Follow the link. Print off the document and give it to your local EHO inspector. That's all the guidance they need.

 

[Freeforester]

Do you know anybody with a camera that could take some photos of your set up for us to see?

Alan

You might be 'privvy' to that!

 

[willie_gunn]

Im going through the process at the moment but my local EHO seams to be very confused by the whole concept of registering as a primary producer as in their words have never heard of this before and are currently in their words “researching” as to relevant procedures and legislation

The EHO who visited yesterday said that this is something of a niche area, and that she was taking over from the local EHO who hadn't done this type of inspection before. She also told me that she had previously gone out into the field to see the entire process, from "hoof to fork" as it were. From your comments it's clear that this level of expertise is not universal.

From what was said I took the key differences as being that we are dealing pretty much exclusively with fresh meat and primary processing (from the field to the larder, and from the larder to the fridge/freezer), as opposed to most food businesses who are preparing "ready to eat".

As VSS has suggested, it would be worth sharing the Wild Game Guide info with your EHO, as these were the primary documents our local EHO recommended and emailed to me originally. The website (rather than just the PDF document) contains links to photos of good and bad practice, definitions of trained person registration, etc.

Wild game guidance

Hygiene regulations for supplying game for human consumption.

www.food.gov.uk

.

 

[mathieson]

The EHO who visited yesterday said that this is something of a niche area, and that she was taking over from the local EHO who hadn't done this type of inspection before. She also told me that she had previously gone out into the field to see the entire process, from "hoof to fork" as it were. From your comments it's clear that this level of expertise is not universal.

From what was said I took the key differences as being that we are dealing pretty much exclusively with fresh meat and primary processing (from the field to the larder, and from the larder to the fridge/freezer), as opposed to most food businesses who are preparing "ready to eat".

As VSS has suggested, it would be worth sharing the Wild Game Guide info with your EHO, as these were the primary documents our local EHO recommended and emailed to me originally. The website (rather than just the PDF document) contains links to photos of good and bad practice, definitions of trained person registration, etc.

Wild game guidance

Hygiene regulations for supplying game for human consumption.

www.food.gov.uk

.

I have shared the wild game guidance info with them last friday they have since emailed back thanking me for the web links but haven’t as yet decided how to proceed with the registration

 

[Freeforester]

Only had the iPhone, but hopefully this gives an idea.

The panoramic shot gives a distorted perspective, as the room is about 12x14 feet. I had the drain/floor and the I-beam installed about 12 years ago, but we sealed and painted the walls, and insulated, lined and painted the ceiling, at the start of lockdown. I also bought the secondhand packing table a couple of months ago. Prep tables are cheap enough to buy on eBay or Gumtree. In fact most of the kit is secondhand, other than the chiller - the vacuum sealer, the label printer, the hanging and electronic scales, etc.

View from the outside:

View attachment 168133

A panoramic view of the inside:

View attachment 168143

The packing side:

View attachment 168140

The prepping side:

View attachment 168141

The hanging beam:

View attachment 168142

At some point I’d like to replace the current water boiler with something bigger. I’ll also invest in a better mincer. There’s nothing wrong with the ones I have but, as I find I’m processing more venison than in the past, having higher output machines just makes life easier.

Things that they might pick you up on are cable management and supply provision in a damp/washable environment (IP67 compliant boxes preferable), positioning of fly killer (-above utensils etc a big no no, after 'the problems' in a butcher shop in the central belt of Scotland a few years back), and filling on a few of the crevices in the walls, where pests may be harboured.

If you're thinking about a larger heater you'll need a dedicated larger capacity cable with suitable isolator switch, but unless you're taking over the S of England game industry I'd look at nothing larger than the Redring Powestream Eco or equivalent, which will give on demand all you really need. A s/h dishwasher complies with cleaning of boards, knives and utensils etc., but you can always buy a basin and just take them into the house to do.

Good effort!

 

[slider]

Excellent set up @Willieand something we should aspire too. But just to be clear for other folk, Environmental Health doesnt that level of equipment or detail.

I manage to register as a food business with a carcass tray for the back of my SUV, 2nd hand larder fridge, piece of kitchen worktop that lies across the top of the washing machine and tumble drier in my garage, a couple of knives and a bottle of food safe sanitiser.

 

[willie_gunn]

Things that they might pick you up on are cable management and supply provision in a damp/washable environment (IP67 compliant boxes preferable), positioning of fly killer (-above utensils etc a big no no, after 'the problems' in a butcher shop in the central belt of Scotland a few years back), and filling on a few of the crevices in the walls, where pests may be harboured.

If you're thinking about a larger heater you'll need a dedicated larger capacity cable with suitable isolator switch, but unless you're taking over the S of England game industry I'd look at nothing larger than the Redring Powestream Eco or equivalent, which will give on demand all you really need. A s/h dishwasher complies with cleaning of boards, knives and utensils etc., but you can always buy a basin and just take them into the house to do.

Good effort!

Many thanks.

Interestingly none of those were actually a problem when it came to the inspection.

The fly zapper is not suspended above the prep area but rather within the hanging area. The photo is a little deceptive, as what you can see underneath the zapper is the top of the showerboard that lines all the walls. The EHO's only comment about it was that it was sufficient from a pest control perspective. The crevices also proved not to be an issue. The carcase goes immediately into the chiller, which is sealed, and then from the chiller straight to preparation, so there is no access for pests as the carcass is either sealed away or attended. So it was just recommended that I keep an eye on the condition of the building as part of my regular general inspection.

A lot of this may well come down to the individual EHO and their personal experience. Particularly how common it is for them to visit this type (recreational stalker) of operation.

Many thanks also for the recommendation on the Redring - I'll have a look at that. Good point, too, about the electrics possibly needing some upgrading. The whole building was completely re-wired 10 years ago and the junction box with the circuit breakers, etc is actually just through the wall in the adjacent privy, so hopefully not too much effort needed.

 

[homer]

just been reading the guidance from the Scottish venison association, and according to them, a stalker can sell in the skin, to a game dealer, and doesn't have to be registered as a food business!

 

[pjohn]

Found this

Game-changing government rules could take pheasant off pub menus

Ben O’Rourke You know your local pub where they serve pheasants from the local shoot? That may be about to stop. The Food Standards Agency is thought to be preparing to tighten up the rules on game meat, so only ‘approved’ gamedealers will be able to sell it to ‘food businesses’. British Game...

www.fieldsportschannel.tv

 

[Freeforester]

View attachment 173941just been reading the guidance from the Scottish venison association, and according to them, a stalker can sell in the skin, to a game dealer, and doesn't have to be registered as a food business!

To a registered venison dealer, a game dealer may or may not also be a venison dealer, the two are different! Though in practice there are many RVD's who also have a GDL from their local authority.

 

[bogtrotter]

View attachment 173941just been reading the guidance from the Scottish venison association, and according to them, a stalker can sell in the skin, to a game dealer, and doesn't have to be registered as a food business!

Some of their information seems at odds with the law, I would advise checking a bit further on the law regarding the sale
of venison in Scotland.
There may well be changes coming soon but they are not yet law.

 

[308tikka]

In a recent thread on here it became aparent that lots of people (myself included) weren't aware that registration as a food business would be required even if all you do is transfer carcasses directly from the field to an AGHE.
Following that discussion, I have registered as a food business with my local authority, and thought I'd just share the process for the benefit of anyone else who needs to do the same:

This thread appears to be the most comprehensive on the subject, and apologies if Ive missed the obvious answer Im seeking, from a silly question....

To do as VSS has above - transfer carcasses directly from the field to an AGHE - and possibly not even in the same county I live in, I get that you should register with local authority as a ‘food business’.

However, if you dont actually run a ‘business’ and this is on a casual basis, or to put into butchers and pay for processing into packs, is it necessary? Or can it be called something else?

Restricting factor - potential landlord doesnt want businesses run from residential address on a short lease. There wont be any business conducted from these premises.

 

[VSS]

This thread appears to be the most comprehensive on the subject, and apologies if Ive missed the obvious answer Im seeking, from a silly question....

To do as VSS has above - transfer carcasses directly from the field to an AGHE - and possibly not even in the same county I live in, I get that you should register with local authority as a ‘food business’.

However, if you dont actually run a ‘business’ and this is on a casual basis, or to put into butchers and pay for processing into packs, is it necessary? Or can it be called something else?

Restricting factor - potential landlord doesnt want businesses run from residential address on a short lease. There wont be any business conducted from these premises.

Yes it is necessary, but you don't have to register as a food premises, just as a food business, if all you're doing is transferring from field to AGHE.

 

[308tikka]

Thanks.

 

[VSS]

Thanks.

It doesn't mean that you're actually running a business for monetary gain. It's not like registering with Companies House or anything like that. I don't think your landlord needs to be concerned. It's you - and your vehicle - that's being registered for food use, not the house you live in.

 

[75]

As VSS says, the carcass may never even come onto your (rented) premises. You technically need to be registered to chuck it in your vehicle and drive it to the AGHE. I, and various others, have had to show how we transport the carcass, clean trays used in vehicles etc. I've also had chiller and prep area inspected, but if you haven't got either of those to inspect then not an issue.

I think you could reassure your landlord on the basis it's a technicality and doesn't mean you're running a business.

 

[foxdropper]

Registered same and was told no inspection needed .