BASC calls for independent regulatory body for firearms licensing

[finnbear270]

This^

 

[25 Sharps]

An independent regulator isn’t going far enough. We need a totally separate agency (not a private company) along the lines of DVLA operating nationwide and bringing in a fully digitised licensing, acquisition/ transfer, variation etc system.

Who is going to pay for that? How many driving licences are there in the country compared to SGC & FAC?

 

[NoIDeer]

Should be amortised into the dvla, they have access to the lot including medical information.

 

[GlosChris]

Who is going to pay for that? How many driving licences are there in the country compared to SGC & FAC?

Theoretically we are already paying for the service through a variety of funding mechanisms, so in principle the money already exists to pay for it. It would bring together under one body what 43 bodies are clearly not capable of providing consistently now.

 

[timbrayford]

Who is going to pay for that? How many driving licences are there in the country compared to SGC & FAC?

Passports?

 

[timbrayford]

Let's not forget that it was a senior FLD officer that facilitated Thomas Hamilton's murderous spree with legally held firearms

 

[Kalahari]

After my months of "fun" (other words are available) with the DVLA please don't let them mess up SGCs and FACs as well.

David.

 

[25 Sharps]

This seems rather a silly proposal. We all know firearms licensing doesn't work and police forces, on the whole, are doing it poorly. What on earth is the establishment of a new regulatory body supposed to achieve? Police forces already have an independent inspectorate which performs this function, and indeed criticises police forces where appropriate. There's no utility at all in having a different body tell the police they're not doing it very well. What effective sanction could it possibly wield?

Why did BASC not propose removing the firearms licensing function completely from the Police, instead forming a single independent national firearms licensing body which is subject to regulation by the Home Office and inspection by the Police? This body could be staffed and or managed by shooters and with an independent board determining the best ways to minimise risks while performing efficiently. There's no real reason why the Police need to be involved in this on a day-to-day basis. It's burdensome for them and they don't have good skillsets for administering it.

Theoretically we are already paying for the service through a variety of funding mechanisms, so in principle the money already exists to pay for it. It would bring together under one body what 43 bodies are clearly not capable of providing consistently now.

Careful what you wish for.

 

[spanj]

Should be amortised into the dvla, they have access to the lot including medical information.

But they’ll sell your details to a car park operator for £2 ish !!!!

 

[Bo Diddley]

I've got no complaints about the service I've had from Norfolk Constabulary Firearms Licensing department, not too sure a change like this would work out better .

 

[enfieldspares]

I think its a move that should be explored. Unless that is the shooting community just want to sit back and carry on complaining on forum sites about the current situation. I would also point out that whilst BASC might have its faults, its organisations like this that can only look to make a meaningful change in the system.

Yes. Like the time they took Lincolnshire Police's Chief Constable to court by judicial review when he began to demand full medical reports on ALL AND EVERY application for grant or renewal of SGCs and FACs.

 

[Liveonce]

No recommendation I could find in the BASC document to improve efficiency by a move to a ten year certificate, removing sound moderators from certificates or a process like in Northern Ireland where you do not need a variation if selling and buying within calibre bands, also investment in better online application process.

One thing is certain the fee will go up.

 

[mealiejimmy]

I have no problem with properly funded separate agency that deals with firearms licensing.
However it will require a change in the law since the Fireams Act specifically states that licensing is the responsibility of the police.

Cheers

Bruce

 

[charlie222]

Derbyshire firearms licensing have always given me a great service even during covid. No doubt that isn't the case everywhere. Agree BASC and other shooting groups need to play thier part in negotiating a better service. I'm not convinced telling the police they are unprofessional (true or not) is a great way of starting a sensible negotiation, they'll just push back.

 

[viking90]

Meanwhile at BASC HQ
Board member 1: "I feel we haven't shafted the shooting community enough by not really fighting the HSE and it's lead thing so we need to come up with another idea"

Board member 2: "I know! Let's push to get licensing done through a separate body that'll charge shooters an absolute fortune for their piece of paper, between that cost and the cost of lead free ammo they'll be well and truly fu*ked"

Board member 3 probably got fired for suggesting we just have section 1 and 2 permits that we present at the gun shop to buy what we like without the need for variations thus reducing the load on the police

 

[Len the dog]

Let’s just hope that G4S don’t tender for the work, we’ll be pleading for our 43 FLDs to come back.

 

[Bowland blades]

First thing i would do is put in class categories, how less or more dangerous is a person having a 243 or 308 for shooting deer ? or a 22-250 v 222 for Fox etc? Do we allow different safety factors ? no! If a person does they need Education or revocation. That's gotta be a whole chunk of admin hours wasted on its own ! Also why the heck aint we got ten year or over certs ? Its not like you wont have the coppers knocking on your door to collect your guns if you start a fight or get lifted for most other crime

 

[Conor O'Gorman]

BASC's proposal is about setting up an independent regulatory body to oversee the firearms licensing function carried out by each police force in England and Wales to ensure that this function is being consistently and effectively carried out – not to replace the firearms licensing function of the police but rather having oversight of that function and holding police forces to account where there are failings.

In our submission we highlighted the following:

• Provide adequate fiscal and human resources for its Firearms Licensing Units (FLUs).
• Employ properly trained, expert staff within those units.
• Abolish non-standard administrative practices which fall outside the Home Office Statutory Guidance, 2021.
• Achieve consistency of administrative practice which conforms to the Home Office document; “Firearms Licensing: Statutory Guidance for Chief Officers of Police.” (2021
• Adopt a risk-assessed and managed licensing regime as opposed to a risk-averse one.
• FLUs should be subject to Service Level Agreements.
• Incorporate proper mechanisms for stakeholder involvement and feedback.
• FLUs must be answerable to a central policy unit (akin to the Forensic Science Regulator). This unit must have statutory powers to compel compliance.
• Firearms Licensing Units must be inspected as part of a force’s PEEL inspection.
• Regional co-operation and eventual amalgamation between FLUs should be strongly promoted.

Click link below to read the full submission

https://committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/113007/html/

 

[Norfolk Deer Search]

BASC's proposal is about setting up an independent regulatory body to oversee the firearms licensing function carried out by each police force in England and Wales to ensure that this function is being consistently and effectively carried out – not to replace the firearms licensing function of the police but rather having oversight of that function and holding police forces to account where there are failings.

In our submission highlighted the following:

• Provide adequate fiscal and human resources for its Firearms Licensing Units (FLUs).
• Employ properly trained, expert staff within those units.
• Abolish non-standard administrative practices which fall outside the Home Office Statutory Guidance, 2021.
• Achieve consistency of administrative practice which conforms to the Home Office document; “Firearms Licensing: Statutory Guidance for Chief Officers of Police.” (2021
• Adopt a risk-assessed and managed licensing regime as opposed to a risk-averse one.
• FLUs should be subject to Service Level Agreements.
• Incorporate proper mechanisms for stakeholder involvement and feedback.
• FLUs must be answerable to a central policy unit (akin to the Forensic Science Regulator). This unit must have statutory powers to compel compliance.
• Firearms Licensing Units must be inspected as part of a force’s PEEL inspection.
• Regional co-operation and eventual amalgamation between FLUs should be strongly promoted.

Click link below to read the full submission

https://committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/113007/html/

Do you really think the police actually give a monkeys hairy scrotum about what BASC or its members think?

Of course, all you are to them is a thorn in the bottom of their foot all the whingeing and moaning and going ahead, if your members actually think forward and fill their tickets up with ammunition before they submit their tickets for renewal, then, it doesn’t actually matter how long it takes! as in the case, in my opinion for grants, they should go to the back of the queue because existing shotgun and firearms holders should come first!

 

[andyk]

@Norfolk Deer Search do you ever try to see things from anything other than your own perspective?

I have some sympathy for what you say about being prepared for the long wait but while that may work for you, it won’t for everyone.

I’ve recently moved from West Mids who wouldn’t give me more than 500 .22LR and around 200 for each centrefire. I’m now 8 months into my renewal. This means I’ve been using the .22 less on targets and the only thing which has saved me with the CFs is that I reload.

I did stock up before my licenses expired, but without breaching my holdings I can’t stockpile enough to get me through such a wait.

As for grants, do you stop to think of the RFDs who can’t get new sales because new shooters can’t get licenses? You’re very keen to say how much you don’t care about the future of the sport but some of you’re posts make it sound like you’re looking forward to it ending!