National wild venison standard

[big ears]

That's exactly how you come across and it's exactly why we have such a deer population problem. Full time managers keeping populations overly high to keep customers happy and keep the tips rolling in also also have a role in it. You don't have to like it or agree but it's fact around my way! Big Ears #73 certainly has the same issues around his way. You only think my comment is silly because you don't like it and not because I'm wrong!

Sorry please do not drag me into this.

I do NOT condone your approach or the name calling. I simply was saying that you are not alone in your experience and that others have a similar problem.

I have little doubt that in your neck of the woods what you say is common practice with paid stalks, However if you were to do some research on here (using the search function) you will find that @devon deer stalker is not like you describe.

Making insinuations into someone’s character, you have never met, saying they deliberately don’t shoot deer to improve their financial gain from clients is Slanderous. Unless you have proof of this against @devon deer stalker you perhaps should apologise for those comments.

This was a civilised thread before your comment and as others have said what is important is that the silence from the representatives of BASC/BDS/NGO on here is broken and we here their stance on this matter.

Throwing mud at each other will get this thread shut down before answers are given.

BE

 

[User00040]

We already have standards and inspections. Do we really need more?

 

[75]

This was a civilised thread before your comment and as others have said what is important is that the silence from the representatives of BASC/BDS/NGO on here is broken and we here their stance on this matter.

Agreed. Let's keep this on track and await some input from @Alastair Boston and @Conor O'Gorman etc.

 

[NickJ]

It's a start, a step in the right direction, let's try and not judge it until we see the detail and it's delivery in action

 

[big ears]

It's a start, a step in the right direction, let's try and not judge it until we see the detail and it's delivery in action

Sorry agree let’s see ALL the details BUT let’s NOT allow it to be put into action before we ALL get a say on the matter.
Once started it will be like a snowball rolling down a snowy bank.

What we need is the organisations who have signed up to this without consulting their members to explain why.

 

[T.eddie]

I would also like to see what the threshold would be should a group need to step in to manage deer. X amount across Y size. As one landowner may sau they don't have a problem but next door it could be quite different

 

[fallow me]

As i see it ,it only applies to stalkers who supply to AGHEs, I supply direct to the public so can't see anything will change for stalkers who are presently registered with there local council and sell direct

 

[308rws]

I would also like to see what the threshold would be should a group need to step in to manage deer. X amount across Y size. As one landowner may sau they don't have a problem but next door it could be quite different

i.e. 25,000 'Trained Hunters' trying to manage approximately 2 million wild deer (with an annual recruitment of 30%) across the UK? How's that working out for everyone?

 

[T.eddie]

i.e. 25,000 'Trained Hunters' trying to manage approximately 2 million wild deer (with an annual recruitment of 30%) across the UK? How's that working out for everyone?

I mean if one farm I'd 400acres what is the expected number of deer on it to be "okay" really it should be however many the farmer is willing to tolerate but on say an area luke "essex" what would the acceptable number be overall

 

[sikamalc]

I think one or two on this thread need to cool down and back off.

 

[Dunwaters]

Why on earth don't they say up front what the cost will be?
I would assume game dealer will pay up and join, then insist that any supplier (i.e. us the deer stalker) also registers and pay's up.
So for the additional costs to all concerned a better price would be paid by the game dealer to the deer stalker, don't hold your breath on that one.
Does that mean less deer stalkers paying and with nowhere to dispose of the carcass less deer getting culled?
It is voluntary, so I assume we could still process and sell privately without the 'BQWV' special stamp?

I would hope that as BASC have had a hand they can advise what the cost will be?
@Conor O'Gorman any idea?

The dealer doesn’t need to offer a higher price, he/she just needs to refuse to accept game from people without the qualification. No doubt this policy will be officially backed by both government sponsored quality assurance schemes and our own representative bodies.
It’s easily done where the market is saturated with product from a multitude of uncoordinated sources. Venison suppliers will fall over themselves to comply. It might not be a totally bad thing either.
No doubt there’ll be extra costs at just about every level, and those costs will wind up carried by the primary producer, you.
We’re rapidly getting to the stage where the carcass of a wild shot deer is going to represent a potential cost.

 

[Pete6.5]

Ask yourself this before you sign up.

Why is there an explosion in deer numbers?

Will this scheme make it easier for the average stalker to sell his venison at a price to cover costs?

For me the answer to the first is that people are sitting on huge tracts of land and not doing the job of deer management correctly. This is nothing to do with resale value it’s simply either they are against shooting and see their land as a safe haven or they go around and sign up loads of permissions they cannot properly manage. Sadly I wager quite a few on here might fall into that last category.

To the second as everyone has said GD rates will not go up, cost will so in effect a reduction in the value of your venison. Unless there is a reward for managing your deer properly.

The answer is not more bureaucracy but to make it beholden on the land owner to prove effective deer management and fine them if they don’t.

Yet again the bloke at the bottom gets a raw deal.

This idea of people building large unmanaged areas is no less of a problem as lots of small bits done by lots of hobby stalkers that don't go out very often or if they do go out only to shoot one for the freezer or only shoot a few because they haven't sorted the facilities or outlets to deal with multiples. But people keep saying it because they can't get the ground they want.

 

[User00038]

I mean if one farm I'd 400acres what is the expected number of deer on it to be "okay" really it should be however many the farmer is willing to tolerate but on say an area luke "essex" what would the acceptable number be overall

This topic (normally limited to deer management courses) and much of the content of other posts were up for question at the recent FC event posted by @Alastair Boston. I think it is intended to run more of these days - when they come, sign up and don't feel in the dark. The people who attended the day in Worcester seem to come across as pretty positive!

 

[T.eddie]

This topic (normally limited to deer management courses) and much of the content of other posts were up for question at the recent FC event posted by @Alastair Boston. I think it is intended to run more of these days - when they come, sign up and don't feel in the dark. The people who attended the day in Worcester seem to come across as pretty positive

Cheers though not sure I'd get to one anytime soon with the new arrival, so they post minutes or anything?

 

[User00038]

Cheers though not sure I'd get to one anytime soon with the new arrival, so they post minutes or anything?

More of a conference than a minuted meeting... But if deer are a priority then I'm sure you'll find a way to get to the next day...
Accrue the credits!

 

[308rws]

I mean if one farm I'd 400acres what is the expected number of deer on it to be "okay" really it should be however many the farmer is willing to tolerate but on say an area luke "essex" what would the acceptable number be overall

I don't think that BDS has published the 2022 Deer Distribution Survey yet. Until they do, the latest survey data is from 2016: Deer Distribution Survey - The British Deer Society and based upon 10km x 10km squares. To get a more detailed 1000m x 1000m distribution survey for an entire county like Essex, you would have to ask the BDS for a more detailed breakdown of the estimated deer density. You would then have to workout the deer carrying capacity for Essex and do some population modelling. The theory is in the best practice guides, but you'll get the idea here: Setting cull targets | Best Practice Guidance. Estimating the resident deer population accurately is key to the process.

 

[devon deer stalker]

We’re rapidly getting to the stage where the carcass of a wild shot deer is going to represent a potential cost.

For some that is the case already with the price of fuel, tax, etc, etc

 

[User00038]

Estimating the resident deer population accurately is key to the process.

How do we actually do this though?

Edit: I'm sorry. That answer/question was unhelpful because estimating population (depending on spp) can be difficult and assessing the trend in deer-related impacts is probably more important.

 

[big ears]

@Alastair Boston would you be willing to comment on this thread? seems you are following it.

 

[308rws]

How do we actually do this though?

Everything from counting: Planning | Best Practice Guidance to drone survey: Deer Drone Surveys | BH Wildlife Consultancy. The latter being the most accurate technique.