The DSC1 courses that I have attended (initially as candidate, subsequently as range assistant) did provide a demo on a freshly shot deer.
Should be done as standard, imo.
Do you think that the current shooting test for the DSC1 qualification is suitable or sufficient?
- Thread starter 8x57
- Start date
Should be done as standard, imo.
The Green Man
Well-Known Member
Surely Passing the DS1 examination is similar to passing your driving test we all know that a newly qualified driver isn't going to drive to the same standard as an experienced driver especially since they will have never driven on the Motorway before passing their test!
Whilst everyone would like to be proficient stalkers and have 100% shot placement from word go, in reality it takes time to lean any skill. The DSC1 as the driving test is a measure of the minimum standard set.
Whilst everyone would like to be proficient stalkers and have 100% shot placement from word go, in reality it takes time to lean any skill. The DSC1 as the driving test is a measure of the minimum standard set.
The flip side is those who had the chance to learn clutch/brakes/changing gear with Dad on a field or open space
put you in good stead much the same as starting off with an air gun being shown what it what.
As for %100 shot placement then none of us do that just by the numbers game a shot will not go where you thought it was as you did something to change that.
All my driving lessons were local and then into Chelmsford back in 79 but my air gun handling was 72 @11.
bottletopbill
Well-Known Member
BUT how many folks now do not have the chance to go shooting as kids as we all did.
Think this is why the number of shooter's is decreasing by the year
So lets get more folks involved and keep our shooting going.
On Sunday at my rifle club saw a young girl about 6 or 7 firing a air rifle with so much confidence and was safe to shoot .
Her dad does the safety course to all new members He must have been so proud of his daughter as we all was
Think this is why the number of shooter's is decreasing by the year
So lets get more folks involved and keep our shooting going.
On Sunday at my rifle club saw a young girl about 6 or 7 firing a air rifle with so much confidence and was safe to shoot .
Her dad does the safety course to all new members He must have been so proud of his daughter as we all was
I did it a couple of weeks ago - it is only meant to be basic but I agree with most of the posters....I'd suggest 4, 4 and 2 would be a simple improvement over 2, 2 and 2 to make it a bit more a proof of consistency without taking up a huge amount more range time.
The target is marked with a feint line circle so you just have to work out where that is and aim at the spot - not tricky.
sikamalc
Administrator
Having held these courses I think the old Level 1 test was better than the current one. Besides the minimum to attend the course is 6 candidates, in most instances. On most of the courses we ran, we had 10 to 12 attending. It only took one person to screw up and the whole backlog started, and the whole day would be put back.
Many people get nervous with a group watching on whilst they shoot, bit like a driving test in my opinion. Nothing at days end counts for experience in the field. Everyone misses, despite what some think.
Some were very good at the zero target, and yet failed on the life size Roe target. Its a test, and even walking away with 100% pass, its not going to stop someone wounding or missing in the future, whilst stalking.
One of the first things Level one should have sorted out when thy first started was to include the disability act. Something I think was not included in the course.
Some people are dyslexic, others colour blind.
The One and two courses have evolved over time, and no doubt will continue to do so. Stalking and deer management have changed vastly in my time, a lot for the better, and the Level 1 and 2 are here to stay, and should be the foundation for anyone wishing to walk around the countryside with a rifle. If anything needs changing on Level 1, its the safety course. Too short and not enough time to make sure candidates know what a rifle bullet can do and how far it can travel.
Many people get nervous with a group watching on whilst they shoot, bit like a driving test in my opinion. Nothing at days end counts for experience in the field. Everyone misses, despite what some think.
Some were very good at the zero target, and yet failed on the life size Roe target. Its a test, and even walking away with 100% pass, its not going to stop someone wounding or missing in the future, whilst stalking.
One of the first things Level one should have sorted out when thy first started was to include the disability act. Something I think was not included in the course.
Some people are dyslexic, others colour blind.
The One and two courses have evolved over time, and no doubt will continue to do so. Stalking and deer management have changed vastly in my time, a lot for the better, and the Level 1 and 2 are here to stay, and should be the foundation for anyone wishing to walk around the countryside with a rifle. If anything needs changing on Level 1, its the safety course. Too short and not enough time to make sure candidates know what a rifle bullet can do and how far it can travel.
bottletopbill
Well-Known Member
Most gun clubs now have a gun safety course before you are allowed on the range.
New members who have a FAC still have to attend as every new member does .
All are tested on air and LR rifles auto and bolt before they can go onto a range
New members who have a FAC still have to attend as every new member does .
All are tested on air and LR rifles auto and bolt before they can go onto a range
8x57
Distinguished Member
I think that's where it could be beneficial to have a number of candidates shooting alongside each other rather rather than each single candidate shooting in turn. You do however then need a range safety officer or safety overseer for each candidate.
It will be quicker to get the whole squad through, and no one should then think that all the others are watching them so it takes a little pressure off.
8x57
Distinguished Member
It's a requirement that all not just most H.O. approved rifle clubs provide safety instruction and training.
As you say most clubs will irrespective of weather a new member has a FAC or not treat new members as an unknown quantity, and will usually still apply a probationary period.
DSC1 and DSC2 , have become over time a pass factory ! Someone who holds DSC2 today might very well have shot just one deer and the stalk could be getting out the Landrover and taking the shot at a pretty tame fenced in beast off the bonnet
When i took DSC2 its was a minimum of three beasts ( people where often told " gather more evidence") .
The only thing we have improved is the number of folks who have DSC1 / DSC2 at the same time making both worth less than the previous . Training providers have made a few quid , the orgs can band about higher numbers of " trained hunters " in the press .
Previously , we had to put in a portfolio of evidence with a minimum of 3 culled beasts ( and the stalk details ) , most put evidence of more than three in and a good few still got told " go gather some more evidence and re-submit " after questioning .
If this seems harsh ? Remember it also meant more to landowners and within the industry , lowering the bar I feel has degraded the standards
When i took DSC2 its was a minimum of three beasts ( people where often told " gather more evidence") .
The only thing we have improved is the number of folks who have DSC1 / DSC2 at the same time making both worth less than the previous . Training providers have made a few quid , the orgs can band about higher numbers of " trained hunters " in the press .
Previously , we had to put in a portfolio of evidence with a minimum of 3 culled beasts ( and the stalk details ) , most put evidence of more than three in and a good few still got told " go gather some more evidence and re-submit " after questioning .
If this seems harsh ? Remember it also meant more to landowners and within the industry , lowering the bar I feel has degraded the standards
With the pds1-2 you don't have to do a shooting test if you can provide proof of competence with firearms.
terrier1
Well-Known Member
I fully agree hands on training is the best way to start a career in deer stalking. Get out with a good guide and get some stalking in as a good guide will always be prepared to help in anyway they can if they can see that you are keen to learn. This is the way I started my deerstalking journey many years ago I was lucky enough to meet a fantastic guide. I went with others in my early days of stalking and you just know when someone is right this same guide recommended me doing my DSC1 and in the run up to it gave me all the preparation I needed to pass it I still went stalking with this guide and when I started my DSC2 he was always there for a chat on the phone. You can't beat hands on experience you just need to find the right person.
Dagless
Well-Known Member
This is what happened on my recent DSC1 course at Great Cressingham, and it seemed to work well with us firing in pairs. Further to this, we were also split up so that whilst some of us were doing the shooting test, others were off doing the safety assessment in woods a short drive from the range.
Everyone still seemed worried beforehand about failing the shooting test in front of witnesses though! I went on the first detail, and found that after a couple of rounds to check zero my nerves settled, however almost all my shooting experience is as a target shooter so I'm used to the scrutiny.
bottletopbill
Well-Known Member
My DSC1 test was in pairs on the range and was a very good
3s when I took the test and it worked well
Dagless
Well-Known Member
As for the shooting test and whether it's appropriate, I have some observations. The 100m prone element seems a bit odd as a realistic test if most of your stalking is going to be lowland, as in my (very limited) experience not many shots at all are going to be taken this way when stalking in woodland and fields - as I understand it, not many people even bother fitting their stalking rifle with a bipod. I had no issues at all with passing this element of the test, as it's my bread and butter being a target shooter, and as well as having lots of experience firing prone I also brought my own rifle that I routinely use for shooting out to 1000m (I didn't want to leave anything to chance!).
The bit that worried me was the 70m shots off sticks. I had no experience of firing a rifle in this way, because there is no way any target shooting club I am aware of will let you use a CF rifle in this manner on their range. Those already with an appropriately conditioned FAC and access to land therefore have the advantage of being able to practice for this. I had to make do with practicing in my suburban back garden at 40m with an air rifle. Therefore, the first time I'd ever fired a CF rifle off sticks was for the two rounds I fired during my test (I passed, using quad sticks and my very heavy rifle). Likewise for the 20m humane dispatch shots.
So in conclusion, I don't really think I've proved very much by using a 9kg rifle setup to fire a total of six rounds, two of which from a position I am unlikely to ever find myself firing from during a stalk. I think a lot more emphasis needs to be put on maneuvering and setting up the shot using sticks, because this is how it's done in the wild. Also, two rounds from each distance probably isn't enough to prove consistency, as you need at least three to be able to call it a group!
The bit that worried me was the 70m shots off sticks. I had no experience of firing a rifle in this way, because there is no way any target shooting club I am aware of will let you use a CF rifle in this manner on their range. Those already with an appropriately conditioned FAC and access to land therefore have the advantage of being able to practice for this. I had to make do with practicing in my suburban back garden at 40m with an air rifle. Therefore, the first time I'd ever fired a CF rifle off sticks was for the two rounds I fired during my test (I passed, using quad sticks and my very heavy rifle). Likewise for the 20m humane dispatch shots.
So in conclusion, I don't really think I've proved very much by using a 9kg rifle setup to fire a total of six rounds, two of which from a position I am unlikely to ever find myself firing from during a stalk. I think a lot more emphasis needs to be put on maneuvering and setting up the shot using sticks, because this is how it's done in the wild. Also, two rounds from each distance probably isn't enough to prove consistency, as you need at least three to be able to call it a group!
Curried Venison
Well-Known Member
The test is adequate for what it's intended to test, but it doesn't test firearms competency, practical issues like cleaning/ maintenance/ bore sighting etc. I took a separate course prior to applying for a FAC to cover these items off.
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