How good a shot are the stalkers in the UK?

[bewsher500]

I did ask in the original thread where that "Fact" came from, I still don't know. For it to be a "Fact" one would hope there was some irrefutable empirical evidence to support it. Until there is, this is more of an opinion than a fact.

the results at most DSC1 rifle tests speak for them selves.
I know very few people (if any) who had a clean sheet of passes in their groups on what is a pretty simple test

in my group 4 failed, out of 11. 3 of my group were complete novices who did not own rifles. (they all passed first time incidentally)

 

[Pine Marten]

When I took mine, I passed on the first attempt, having not shot a rifle for years, but there were a few people there who had apparently done a lot of stalking who were really struggling. With their own rifles too. But then I think that exam nerves were getting to them. On the other hand, my only shot at a deer so far resulted in a clean miss, so I'm going meekly sit back in this conversation... That said, since then I've joined the BSRC and practiced!

 

[Tamus]

the results at most DSC1 rifle tests speak for them selves.
I know very few people (if any) who had a clean sheet of passes in their groups on what is a pretty simple test

in my group 4 failed, out of 11. 3 of my group were complete novices who did not own rifles. (they all passed first time incidentally)

In my limited experience: Novices, who do what they are told to do, usually shoot startlingly well, often better than the person telling them... Me.

Novices who will not do as they are told or who have no-one to tell them, will often struggle at first and possibly forever.

As I recall, on my DSC1, many years ago, no-one actually coached us in good shooting technique (yes, it was discussed in class, but that is NOT the same as coaching) and yet all but one of our group (of about 14) nailed the shooting test.

The above said, every shooter I actually know can reliably hit a 4" diameter disc at a hundred yards... that's plenty good enough to take roe deer and larger humanely, provided the chest shot is the only one taken and you do know where to try and put that shot. Knowing one's limitatations is all that's required. Olympic class marksmanship is an irrelevance in the stalking field... self discipline and practice are the keys... IMHO.

How good a shot are the stalkers in the UK ? Good enough, I'd say. But...there's always room for improvement, everywhere.

 

[Pine Marten]

Knowing one's limitatations is all that's required.

I believe that Inspector Harry Callaghan said as much in Magnum Force...

 

[bambislayer]

The problem is that it is very dificult to simulate "live deer" shooting on a rifle range. In the same way that clay pigeons dont exactly mimic live game.

One solution may be a simulator, the technology is there, who's got the cash to develop it. I'm not thinking of an arcade game but a system geared around real life scenarios, a 3d image could be produced of the shot , showing the likely path of the bullet through the animal. Again you wouldn't be in the field, but a handy teaching tool, if anyone wants to develop it???????????

At the end of the day, it is practise, knowledge & experience that count, the amount needing to be gained depends on the individual.

 

[stag1933]

I did ask in the original thread where that "Fact" came from, I still don't know. For it to be a "Fact" one would hope there was some irrefutable empirical evidence to support it. Until there is, this is more of an opinion than a fact.

What more of a `fact` than having the shot targets under your nose do you require or are you a statistical lame brain ?

HWH.

 

[Tamus]

What more of a `fact` than having the shot targets under your nose do you require or are you a statistical lame brain ?

HWH.

Ouch!

Ok then... just what size of statistical sample... of all the shooters in the UK, have you taken.

Frankly, you're a bit of a gruff old codger at times on here (not that I give a flying fig about that) but... if you are anything like that with novice shooters in the "real world" I'd not be at all surprised if they made a hash of the job.... in front of you.

TBH, I think the idea of stalkers coming on here saying that they think "other" shooters (it's always the other's isn't it?) are often.... sh!te... is not only a great pile of steaming ordure, it is an own goal of spectacular proportions. What are you thinking?

 

[NorthDorset]

This thread has some fantastic graphic images and celebrates the incompetance of shooters and stalkers alike.

A dream pass to the League Against Cruel Sports.

THINK!

 

[neil_r]

What more of a `fact` than having the shot targets under your nose do you require or are you a statistical lame brain ?

HWH.

I am neither a statistical lame brain, nor am I rude in my discourse, the fact that I am asking for some sort of empirical (look it up) evidence for is the assertion that "It is a fact of life that 8 out of 9 stalkers cannot place 3 consecutive shots on to a one inch bullseye at 100 yards" I am sure that there are a number of poor shooters about but 8 out of 10 is a very specific claim and I would be very interested to see the data behind it.

Stag1933, are you as incapable of having a civilised discourse when you meet someone for the first time face to face?

 

[sikadog]

Stag1933 is one of the nicest and helpfull guys you would ever wish to meet face to face.

 

[Tamus]

Stag1933 is one of the nicest and helpfull guys you would ever wish to meet face to face.

Actually, I don't doubt that for a .... metaphorical.... heartbeat

The man is quite clearly a veritable mine of experience and useful information. He also proves the point that accurate shooting is a dawdle... I mean, half blind and geriatric as he claims to be... he can still post sub MOA groups... So, it can't be all that hard, can it?

 

[stag1933]

Stalkers shoot April 2010 , twelve shot comp. Various positions and distances.
I was less geriatric then but still a nasty old bugger and I have no intention of changing having perfected THAT art also.

HWH.

 

[Jagare]

So being able to put the bullets in a 4´´ circle is what to strive for? Good grief !
I did my Dsc in 1985. 3 of us passed first time. The rest needed several go’s to pass. It looks nothing has changed since then when it comes to people doing the shooting test for Dsc. Why are they allowed to carry on with the test if their rifle is not sighted in.
The thing that shocks me from my observations here and in England is not only peoples lack of shooting skill but also their lack of basic knowledge about the weapon and scope they own. Sometimes its quite scary.

 

[Jagare]

Stag1933, Many years ago Litts in newport had a shooting competition that was held on a range built on a slag heap. Did you shoot in said competition?

 

[Tamus]

So being able to put the bullets in a 4´´ circle is what to strive for? Good grief !
I did my Dsc in 1985. 3 of us passed first time. The rest needed several go’s to pass. It looks nothing has changed since then when it comes to people doing the shooting test for Dsc. Why are they allowed to carry on with the test if their rifle is not sighted in.
The thing that shocks me from my observations here and in England is not only peoples lack of shooting skill but also their lack of basic knowledge about the weapon and scope they own. Sometimes its quite scary.

Pish! Not what I said. Stop playing at wind-up merchants. If you want to know what I said, read my posts properly.

HWH... Good retort... For down the pub... But you never answered my question asking what proportion of British stalkers your survey included, that made your "opinion" statistically valid.

For those who wish to spend the remainder of this thread saying how rubbish British stalkers are... knock yourselves out. I know you are talking about the rotten apples only... and there are damned few of those in my necks of the woods.

 

[finnbear270]

So being able to put the bullets in a 4´´ circle is what to strive for? Good grief !
I did my Dsc in 1985. 3 of us passed first time. The rest needed several go’s to pass. It looks nothing has changed since then when it comes to people doing the shooting test for Dsc. Why are they allowed to carry on with the test if their rifle is not sighted in.
The thing that shocks me from my observations here and in England is not only peoples lack of shooting skill but also their lack of basic knowledge about the weapon and scope they own. Sometimes its quite scary.

How are the Swede's rated?.........................I know they can work across borders!

 

[nell]

Would be intresting to know what proportion of "out of the box" rifles using factory ammo are capable of shooting the sub MOA often boasted...
I have always been a fairly good shot,for many years using a factory rifle and home loads i was more than happy with results,a few years ago i treated myself to a custom barrel, now im a VERY good shot...dont put yourselves down some rifles would be doing well to hit a 4in circle...

The term heart lung shot always makes me smile,your going to pretty unlucky if you aim at the ribs and dont hit one of the two..
A good friend is a game dealer,you should ask these guy's about the standard of shooting, every bad shot comes with a very good explanation..

 

[stag1933]

Stag1933, Many years ago Litts in newport had a shooting competition that was held on a range built on a slag heap. Did you shoot in said competition?

No. I never got that far down for a competition. My furtherest would be to the Pickering range of the Yorkshire BDS Branch.
On Sept.7th 1986 I won their shoot with 90/90 against 59 other competitors but did not get the trophy as I was not a member of their branch.
The late Lord Riverdale gave me a very nice bottle of Malt though !

HWH.

 

[Monkey Spanker]

I think you will find that the British are quite good shots and have been over the years which is why we still speak English and not german!
MS

 

[bogtrotter]

I think you will find that the British are quite good shots and have been over the years which is why we still speak English and not German!
MS

I will have you know young man my father travelled to Germany twice a week.

No he was not a businessman!

He was the tail gunner in a Lancaster bomber.