Land Reform and it's Impact On Stalking and the countryside

David Brown

Well-Known Member
On Saturday night I was invited to a meal out at a friends house. I was told a couple would be there who work for two big charities that have huge land holdings all over Scotland and the rest of the UK . The girl had been invited to give 'expert' evidence to the committee looking at the next round of land reform proposals and I was told by my host I would be interested in what she had to say. On being introduced I reminded myself not to judge a book by its cover-she had face piercings with enough steelwork to sink a ship, hair twenty different colours and scarily a tuft of hair hung over one eye tied with two pigeon feathers. I knew we were in for an interesting chat. Eventually the host steered the conversation round to land reform and off she went." The committee " she began , realise that a Mugabe type land grab would make the new Scottish Government very unpopular internationally so they had to come up with ways to get the land of Scotland into community ownership. This relied on getting values to plummet so the land fund and communities could afford it. Vast estates used for field sports she said were an easy target as all the value was in the sport. First she said we will nationalise Deer, Salmon and Grouse, landowners would have to buy a license to take them. Re institute sporting rates at say £600 per head for these species. Alter the tax system by bringing in an annual property tax on individuals with more than a garden and abolish capital and inheritance tax reliefs. Watch she said as these ' Lord Snooty' types rush to get rid of their thousands of ill gotten acres. What about the impact on gamekeepers or others working for these estates or the other tradespeople who rely on the influx of Southern money to keep the economies of these often isolated communities afloat I asked. They would find work with the new local committees set up to run the now community -owned holdings. These communities would also appoint members to do any wildlife management or controls and the land would no longer be a playground for the rich.
This is all possible she said without a Yes vote in September , it will be rolled out within the next two years . Of course the charities she and her partner represent would be exempt from all this and next they would look at the prospect of having farming also controlled by local communities . Intensive farming she said has resulted in a raping of the land producing food crammed with pesticides , hormones and antibiotics. Smaller community run farming is the way forward she said.
I sat stunned. Usually I would dismiss such talk as idealistic wish list building but these folk have the ear of our parliament and the politics of envy is powerful. Looking at how this would progress is depressing. I feel like emigrating especially as she often justified what she said by stating " it's the will of the Scottish People" . Surprise surprise both she and her partner are English.

David
 
On Saturday night I was invited to a meal out at a friends house. I was told a couple would be there who work for two big charities that have huge land holdings all over Scotland and the rest of the UK . The girl had been invited to give 'expert' evidence to the committee looking at the next round of land reform proposals and I was told by my host I would be interested in what she had to say. On being introduced I reminded myself not to judge a book by its cover-she had face piercings with enough steelwork to sink a ship, hair twenty different colours and scarily a tuft of hair hung over one eye tied with two pigeon feathers. I knew we were in for an interesting chat. Eventually the host steered the conversation round to land reform and off she went." The committee " she began , realise that a Mugabe type land grab would make the new Scottish Government very unpopular internationally so they had to come up with ways to get the land of Scotland into community ownership. This relied on getting values to plummet so the land fund and communities could afford it. Vast estates used for field sports she said were an easy target as all the value was in the sport. First she said we will nationalise Deer, Salmon and Grouse, landowners would have to buy a license to take them. Re institute sporting rates at say £600 per head for these species. Alter the tax system by bringing in an annual property tax on individuals with more than a garden and abolish capital and inheritance tax reliefs. Watch she said as these ' Lord Snooty' types rush to get rid of their thousands of ill gotten acres. What about the impact on gamekeepers or others working for these estates or the other tradespeople who rely on the influx of Southern money to keep the economies of these often isolated communities afloat I asked. They would find work with the new local committees set up to run the now community -owned holdings. These communities would also appoint members to do any wildlife management or controls and the land would no longer be a playground for the rich.
This is all possible she said without a Yes vote in September , it will be rolled out within the next two years . Of course the charities she and her partner represent would be exempt from all this and next they would look at the prospect of having farming also controlled by local communities . Intensive farming she said has resulted in a raping of the land producing food crammed with pesticides , hormones and antibiotics. Smaller community run farming is the way forward she said.
I sat stunned. Usually I would dismiss such talk as idealistic wish list building but these folk have the ear of our parliament and the politics of envy is powerful. Looking at how this would progress is depressing. I feel like emigrating especially as she often justified what she said by stating " it's the will of the Scottish People" . Surprise surprise both she and her partner are English.

David
Do you belive this could actually happen ?
 
Do I honestly think this is likely to happen err !!! No but hang on a minute didn't the tree huggers get hunting with hounds banned !!! So never underestimate the power these people can find when needed.
Regards
Jimmy.
 
I hope that it never comes to that .But if she was as mad looking as discribed i doub to many would take her seriously MP and toff's and normally very judgemental indeed they will hear what they have to say ,then behind close doorsthe 1st thing they will talk about is all the metal in her face ,the good things that the tree hugers dont help them selfs by not looking very clean and covered in metal and silly hair colour ,like boy george how can they be taken seriously .we might see foxing with hounds come back as yet (ukip)
 
Berg how I hope your last statement is true, personally and unfortunately I can't ever see it happening. As for the great unwashed they never are the ones that the public see too much of, it's normally the actors or famous face who they get on side that do that bit.
Regards
Jimmy
 
There is an awful lot of written evidence going into this from people who have more connection with the land than the folk mentioned above.
As said above I think that these Looney Tunes will be recognised as such.
It's people like Denis Canavan I worry more about.
 
There is an awful lot of written evidence going into this from people who have more connection with the land than the folk mentioned above.
As said above I think that these Looney Tunes will be recognised as such.
It's people like Denis Canavan I worry more about.


Yes it's very easy to dismiss them as loony tunes and that is indeed my opinion of them too but the organisations they represent have already been given some degree of powers . They now have a say on local planning , land use and forestry . As has been said too it is not these folk that will appear on media but the politicians ,academics and others with a personal axe to grind. I think I am correct in saying that an ex chairman of the Deer Commission has already suggested that the deer population be nationalised. Some high ranking politicians have suggested a land tax and it's in the latest land reform proposals to bring back sporting rates and limit land ownership.


David
 
I love the idealistic ignorance and passion of the socialist extremist. They always think someone else can and should foot the bill for them. Not that I was ever a fan of Margaret Thatcher but I always smile when I hear this quote of hers "The problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other people's money [to spend]."
 
Yes it's very easy to dismiss them as loony tunes and that is indeed my opinion of them too but the organisations they represent have already been given some degree of powers . They now have a say on local planning , land use and forestry . As has been said too it is not these folk that will appear on media but the politicians ,academics and others with a personal axe to grind. I think I am correct in saying that an ex chairman of the Deer Commission has already suggested that the deer population be nationalised. Some high ranking politicians have suggested a land tax and it's in the latest land reform proposals to bring back sporting rates and limit land ownership.


David

SNH already proclaim deer to be a "National Asset" in their literature, doubtless the pierced lady of your recent acquaintance sees land as yet another "National Asset". The fact that she voices a desire to devalue this asset does seem to indicate that her wishes should perhaps be disregarded. One can only hope that somewhere in the process the grown-ups will realise and moderate the imprudence of her aims.
 
Which are the charities being mentioned? Please name them. If we know who they are, we too can apply pressure to counter the viscious Marxist twaddle that is being spun by those extremists. If we do nothing to spread a more balanced view we can only expect to get shafted (again).

Ian
 
Which are the charities being mentioned? Please name them. If we know who they are, we too can apply pressure to counter the viscious Marxist twaddle that is being spun by those extremists. If we do nothing to spread a more balanced view we can only expect to get shafted (again).

Ian


Sorry Ian but I probably didn't make it clear but those views and tactics were given at the meetings of these committees and not just by the person I met. I believe the committee has already made over 60 recommendations to the Scottish Parliment and now it is up to the politicians to implement the ones they want. Make no misteak landowners are in the firing line. Only last week wee Eck dismissed the No Campaigns raising of more funds than his as just 'Tory voters and landowners. '. The BBCScotland documentary exploring 'Who Owns Scotland ' was completely biased and ignored the tenant farmer who praised his landlord yet gave time for the criticism by a multicoloured haired local councillor that the laird didn't do enough for the locals. The camera panned round a group of derelict cottages implying neglect but not explaining that these houses have been empty since the 1920s and the lack of population here is due to advances in mechanisation of farming not feudalism.

David
 
Its not a surprise really. Having been involved with one or two areas of Scotland where they have purchased the land under the right to buy scheme, they give the money out ok. But the strings attached are a different matter.
I am all for the people of Scotland having their own land when it becomes viable and sensible to do so. But most of the big land owners of Scotland are the ones that employ many people in very rural areas and also can and do contribute to the local community. God help Scotland if they have a government ready to take this away from folk and implement draconian measures.

It will be the end of it all as far as I am concerned. Blimey I sound like the chap off Dads Army...................were all doomed I tell ye all doomed.
 
Its not a surprise really. Having been involved with one or two areas of Scotland where they have purchased the land under the right to buy scheme, they give the money out ok. But the strings attached are a different matter.
I am all for the people of Scotland having their own land when it becomes viable and sensible to do so. But most of the big land owners of Scotland are the ones that employ many people in very rural areas and also can and do contribute to the local community. God help Scotland if they have a government ready to take this away from folk and implement draconian measures.

It will be the end of it all as far as I am concerned. Blimey I sound like the chap off Dads Army...................were all doomed I tell ye all doomed.

Oi ! :)
 
Of course this is but the tip of an iceberg. There also proposals to limit the size of land holdings (gawd knows how that can be implemented, fairly or otherwise) Then there are limitations not only upon who might own land but where they must live and whether or not they use it to the satisfaction of government. This is all in the pipeline and gathering traction. Note the number of prominent grouse moors un-shot nowadays and also the number of sizable estates currently for sale. I've even been asked to find places for guns who wish to shoot in Scotland "now before it all changes forever", which they reckon it will do irrespective of the referendum. Interesting times.
 
It all started a while ago with SNH and the Deer Commission (so many deer per hundred HA etc) and will continue to restrict the rights of landowners and sportsmen alike. The only thing cared about by politicians is votes and there aint many of them in rural areas. I fear for our Scottish rural society having spent a while working in the North, but beware it is also starting South of the Border. We are all aware of the RSPCA and other anti bodies,but beware the Deer Initiative which will (and I would bet money on it) become another Quango before long,taking on the mantle of the DCScotland as a govt department.
 
The banning of hunting with Hounds was a sop to back bench socialists to support B.Liar's Stephen Byers; 700 hours to say my beagles can hunt a rabbit but not a hare; 70 hours to take us to a war in Iraq. As the Americans say 'Go figure'

Collectivisation of land and it's inherent 'wealth' and 'assets' is a similarly powerful totem for Scottish Nationalists
 
Frankly, I know BASC often get attacked on this forum, but this is why I am a member. I don't compare the cost of insurance and other "benefits" vs other organisations I just feel shooting needs a well positioned, professional, well resourced voice to input into all these debates, consultations and committees and IMO BASC is the best voice we have.
 
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