Ammo prices

[RCS Deer Management]

Look at Fox for non-lead hunting and use their target bullets for practice.

All bullets, even high BC lead bullets are affected by wind. Wind drifts are quoted at 10mph crosswinds at 100m or yards, so you always do need to consider even at 100m regardless of cartridge or bullet. If you don’t want to consider wind, shoot indoors or only shoot on very light no wind days.

10mph is a light breeze with a very gentle rustling of leaves and grass.

I don’t think that you are entirely correct. Look at the difference in windage values between a low bc and a high bc bullet. The difference is often shocking. If low bc bullets were cheaper, or more accurate, or killed better I could understand their appeal, but they don’t have any of these advantages. High bc bullets may not be the magical advantage people think they are, but they do hold velocity better, drift less and drop less all with no negative impact. So why wouldn’t you use them?

 

[patjack]

Norma tipstrike for the .223 jumped from £29 a box to £41

Still paying £26.70 here if they are going up that much I must get stocked up to the max.

 

[Heym SR20]

I don’t think that you are entirely correct. Look at the difference in windage values between a low bc and a high bc bullet. The difference is often shocking. If low bc bullets were cheaper, or more accurate, or killed better I could understand their appeal, but they don’t have any of these advantages. High bc bullets may not be the magical advantage people think they are, but they do hold velocity better, drift less and drop less all with no negative impact. So why wouldn’t you use them?

Drift less with high BC bullets - yes they drift less but they still drift.

On open Scottish hill 20mph is the norm, 30 mph very common. Even a high BC bullet from a fast cartridge will drift enough that you can easily wound rather than kill if you don’t take wind into account.

Thinking the kit you use means you can disregard the basics is just irresponsible.

 

[buckfever]

Still paying £26.70 here if they are going up that much I must get stocked up to the max.

Get them at that price while you can. A phoned couple other shops and they had went up as well Between £39 and £41. A was nearly sick

 

[GBR66]

I couldn't get Geco Zero .308 (think it was 136gr) to group in either of my Tikka or Sako rifles

Similarly I found the Geco very disappointing in my .30-06, really poor grouping. Ended up with Sako.

 

[RCS Deer Management]

Drift less with high BC bullets - yes they drift less but they still drift.

On open Scottish hill 20mph is the norm, 30 mph very common. Even a high BC bullet from a fast cartridge will drift enough that you can easily wound rather than kill if you don’t take wind into account.

Thinking the kit you use means you can disregard the basics is just irresponsible.

30mph wind at 100 yards with a 143gr eldx in a 6.5 prc at 100m is less than 2” of wind drift. How big is the kill zone on a red deers chest? Yes, with the right set up you can essentially forget about the wind at 100m.

 

[andyk]

Drift less with high BC bullets - yes they drift less but they still drift.

On open Scottish hill 20mph is the norm, 30 mph very common. Even a high BC bullet from a fast cartridge will drift enough that you can easily wound rather than kill if you don’t take wind into account.

Thinking the kit you use means you can disregard the basics is just irresponsible.

It’s not about disregarding basics, it’s about not picking kit that can exacerbate mistakes, e.g. making a wrong wind call, or make a situation unnecessarily difficult, e.g. a follow up shot.

Before making the decision not to use that Geco stuff, I did run the numbers on it.

It’s a bit of a simplification, but a red deer chest shot is an area around 6-8”, so wind drift not exceeding 3-4” is not going to cause a shot to fall outside of that.

The Geco has a BC of .229 and muzzle velocity (claimed, so probably less) of 3,036fps.

The ammo I went with, Hornady GMX 165gr, has a BC of .447 and a confirmed muzzle velocity of 2,850fps from my rifle.

At 150yds and in a 20mph, the Geco will move by 6.16” whereas the GMX will move by 3.14”. So with the Geco you’ll need to aim off but with the GMX it won’t matter. I’m not saying it’s a good idea not to bother with the GMX, but it proves the point that with that bullet it shouldn’t matter too much if you don’t, or if you’re not quite right about speed, direction and so forth.

In my view, the BC of the Geco is so bad that it makes it a poor choice for hill stalking.

 

[UpNorthMI]

I agree, UK ammo prices seem incredibly high at the moment, particularly as I get to shop both in the UK and US markets.

A little bit of comparative math:

A box of 20 rounds of non lead ammo is approximately $50 in the US retail market (Barnes, Norma, Winchester,...) for .308, and around $30 for regular soft point. If you look at the exchange rate, then add maximum possible import tariff ( 0 - 12%) and then add 20% VAT to it you reach £50 a box of 20 rounds for quality .308 non lead ammo. Remember we started with the US retail price. Compare the US Retail price of $2.50 per bullet or £1.86 per bullet to £5.00 a bullet in the UK, the UK retail price is 2.7 times the US retail price (VAT is part of that).

So why is the UK so high? Is all ammo shipped by wholesalers to the UK, is the shipping and transport cost so high? Are there wholesale and retail margins added. I'm sure another factor is the general economics of scale, the US market is so huge, UK retail gun dealers are operating with much smaller quantities, remember the cost of labour and overhead to keep a UK gun retailer open.

Personally, it's rare for me to buy ammo in the UK anymore, I just bring it with me when ever I'm flying back to the UK, declare it to customs and let my local firearms admin department know I made a personal import. Most of the time I'm importing my own quality reloads, currently in both lead and non lead.

As others say it does not take long to recover the small investment needed for basic reloading equipment. It's tough as ideally you want to support your local gun shop. At current UK prices an hour or two of practice is seriously expensive. I'm not sure that the situation is going to improve any in the UK.

 

[Heym SR20]

30mph wind at 100 yards with a 143gr eldx in a 6.5 prc at 100m is less than 2” of wind drift. How big is the kill zone on a red deers chest? Yes, with the right set up you can essentially forget about the wind at 100m.

Yes but not every one wants to run a 6.5 PRC nor pay the ammo cost.

2” of wind drift at 100 yards is 4” at 200 and at least 6” at 300. The wind drift increases as velocity falls off

The likes of the 243, 308, 270 etc all drift in the wind, and the vast majority of deer stalkers use such cartridges.

 

[Rake Aboot]

Bloody ammo

Tried to get rimfire ammo in the borders , wasn’t paying for it , was getting invoiced and was supplied with
Sellier and Bellot

Never used it but apparently it’s utter shite

And it wasn’t cheap!

 

[Liveonce]

it’s far from cheap to move dangerous goods into and around the U.K. so that will be adding to the cost.

Then the importers like to make a very good profit as they have significant overheads, the last in the chain the retailer as it is seen as quick turnover consumer goods are likely making very little probably 5% the vat man gets 17%

Likely the reason gun shops are closing rather than being sold on as a going concern, more money to be made and far eases in other way, so why invest your money in a gun shop.

 

[308rws]

I couldn't get Geco Zero .308 (think it was 136gr) to group in either of my Tikka or Sako rifles

Same, although the GECO STAR worked with a 0.388 BC

 

[wytonpjs]

Same, although the GECO STAR worked with a 0.388 BC

Was at the range yesterday - fitted 2 QD mounts to 2 rifles and juggled scopes around on a third. Five scope/rifle combinations to zero, thermal and NV on one, NV and glass on another, and glass on a third. Also to check placement at short and long range after a 100m zero. 30 rounds of .243 expended and 50 of .308 - all done bar one .308/glass combo which was proving a right PITA. Costly, but not as much as if factory. I hope never to be doing that in a oner again!

 

[Donkey Basher]

This time last year I paid £58 per box (50 bullets) for Sako Powerhead Blade 120gn. The same retailer is now selling the same bullets at £73 per box - that’s an increase of over 25% in a year, now that’s inflation!!

 

[homer]

It would be good to build up some kind of database of what ammo people use with what calibre and gun make and accuracy. It would save people a fortune trying to find the most suitable factory round.
Ok, I know that it would only work if you got good reliable information, which you probably wouldn't.

Not sure that would be of any use. You can have 2 identical rifles that won't shoot the same bullet.

 

[Bowland blades]

I hand load , Best advice when i started was " get into hand loading " 30 years or so later i still don't shoot Factory anything other than the Rimfire. This means i pay for powder , primers , brass . Most cases last at least ten firing and i never run short of ammo ! Also i can get better accuracy .
If i even packed in there would be a good return of my investment coming in on the presses and such . I hope i do not need or want to do that , think i would emigrate if things got worse in the UK

 

[Bowland blades]

Drift less with high BC bullets - yes they drift less but they still drift.

On open Scottish hill 20mph is the norm, 30 mph very common. Even a high BC bullet from a fast cartridge will drift enough that you can easily wound rather than kill if you don’t take wind into account.

Thinking the kit you use means you can disregard the basics is just irresponsible.

The full story though is ...... You can get a lot closer when the wind is up , Making the stalking closer is a lot easier . Wind through contours can always catch us out though as there are no wind flags and no two sighters like you get at a comp

 

[Ned_1]

Sako Powerhead Blade in 6.5 PRC ranges from £105 to £120 per box of 20 depending on the shop. Apparently it's the cost of the brass in that calibre that makes it expensive. As a bullet the Blade performs impressively in both my 6mm Creedmoor and 6.5 PRC being both highly accurate and effective. As a result, I now load my own rounds with this bullet. In the 6.5 PRC a home-load excluding brass (i'm using once fired Hornady brass from factory ammo) costs about £2.17 per round, so a significant saving.