Do I need a 7x57?

[Heym SR20]

Personally I would like to like the Blaser K95, have handled and used them, but just don't like them.

Why?

1) A fine gun should not use Torx heads on the action. It should have properly fitted and timed slot headed pins like a fine shotgun. And a single shot break action should have a shotgun style trigger guard, not something off a bolt action.

2) The stock shape is all wrong with too much of a vertical grip too close to the trigger - much prefer a more classic open style. Don't like the German style cheek piece either. The fancy burl walnut will break sooner or later. They do have a stock bolt that helps with strength.

3) The barrels and stocks are far too short. The beauty of a Kipplauf is the short length of the action. With a 25" barrel you have a nice long barrel for balance and that keeps the noise down, but still no longer than a short barreled shotgun. The stutzen K95s are very short overall - too short for me. But then I am 6ft with long arms.

But saying they shoot well.

Personally if I was going to be spending £7,000 for a Kipplauf I would have a good look at one from Single-shot Prinz NO.1 | Prinz Waffen

These are built by the chap who originally designed the K95.

 

[1st Pattern Paul]

What calibre?

7 x 57 and .270.
No longer own the .270 though.

 

[Lateral]

Personally I would like to like the Blaser K95, have handled and used them, but just don't like them.

Why?

1) A fine gun should not use Torx heads on the action. It should have properly fitted and timed slot headed pins like a fine shotgun. And a single shot break action should have a shotgun style trigger guard, not something off a bolt action.

2) The stock shape is all wrong with too much of a vertical grip too close to the trigger - much prefer a more classic open style. Don't like the German style cheek piece either. The fancy burl walnut will break sooner or later. They do have a stock bolt that helps with strength.

3) The barrels and stocks are far too short. The beauty of a Kipplauf is the short length of the action. With a 25" barrel you have a nice long barrel for balance and that keeps the noise down, but still no longer than a short barreled shotgun. The stutzen K95s are very short overall - too short for me. But then I am 6ft with long arms.

But saying they shoot well.

Personally if I was going to be spending £7,000 for a Kipplauf I would have a good look at one from Single-shot Prinz NO.1 | Prinz Waffen

These are built by the chap who originally designed the K95.

I wouldn’t classify the K95 as a “fine gun”. It’s effectively an off the peg rifle, with options. Picking wood, a barrel style, or stock type, is no different to choosing a 4 door, or estate, picking the paint colour on a car, or which engine you want.

Thank goodness we all have different tastes

 

[Orion]

I wouldn’t classify the K95 as a “fine gun”. It’s effectively an off the peg rifle, with options. Picking wood, a barrel style, or stock type, is no different to choosing a 4 door, or estate, picking the paint colour on a car, or which engine you want.

Is there a car manufacturer that has the same extended delivery time though?

 

[Lateral]

Is there a car manufacturer that has the same extended delivery time though?

Too bloody right there is

 

[deeangeo]

Is there a car manufacturer that has the same extended delivery time though?

Yup definitely ..

 

[big ears]

Ok to get this back on track I have looked at available brass and dies for all the calibres mentioned in order of difficulty and expense of set up it’s 7x 65r, 6.5x56r 7x57r, 7x57 then the cheapest is the 6.5x55 A's I have that kit already. Ballistically there is no difference between the 7x57 and the 6.5x55 on paper but the 6.5x55 does penetrate deeper and this might lead to more runners if bullet selection is not done proper. I’ve encounter this with Roe with my 30-06, 180gr partition all ran long distance, 280gr Sierra PH all dropped on spot.

Yet the recurring theme is that the 7x57 is better but no one can say why apart from that is the one I have got and I like it. The delivery of energy from a 140gr bullet is more in a 6.5x55 than a 7x57 out to 300m, the 7x57 can go up to 175gr but the 6.5 can go up to 160gr and indeed I have shot 156gr 6.5 ammo with good effect.

I have shot a k95 in 308 and did not find case extraction difficult but accept with cold hands and gloves this may be different.

My original question was why should I get a 7x57 instead of a 6.5x55? And to be fair there is no real reason I can see apart from “you want one” , which probably goes for all firearms we own. My friend has a 7.57 which is 120yrs old and he loves this because if it’s provenance. This will be a new rifle so that is not the case.

Thank you all for all your great comments and help but I think I have decided that as I know the calibre so well I’ll stick with the 6.5x55

BE

 

[User00003]

Ok to get this back on track I have looked at available brass and dies for all the calibres mentioned in order of difficulty and expense of set up it’s 7x 65r, 6.5x56r 7x57r, 7x57 then the cheapest is the 6.5x55 A's I have that kit already. Ballistically there is no difference between the 7x57 and the 6.5x55 on paper but the 6.5x55 does penetrate deeper and this might lead to more runners if bullet selection is not done proper. I’ve encounter this with Roe with my 30-06, 180gr partition all ran long distance, 280gr Sierra PH all dropped on spot.

Yet the recurring theme is that the 7x57 is better but no one can say why apart from that is the one I have got and I like it. The delivery of energy from a 140gr bullet is more in a 6.5x55 than a 7x57 out to 300m, the 7x57 can go up to 175gr but the 6.5 can go up to 160gr and indeed I have shot 156gr 6.5 ammo with good effect.

I have shot a k95 in 308 and did not find case extraction difficult but accept with cold hands and gloves this may be different.

My original question was why should I get a 7x57 instead of a 6.5x55? And to be fair there is no real reason I can see apart from “you want one” , which probably goes for all firearms we own. My friend has a 7.57 which is 120yrs old and he loves this because if it’s provenance. This will be a new rifle so that is not the case.

Thank you all for all your great comments and help but I think I have decided that as I know the calibre so well I’ll stick with the 6.5x55

BE

Sorry to hear you will not be joining the gentleman’s club then

 

[big ears]

Sorry to hear you will not be joining the gentleman’s club then

I know you keep saying this but I’m struggling to see why.

 

[Heym SR20]

Big Ears, you are correct. There is very little to choose between the 6.5x55 and 7x57 and any difference will be down to bullet type and shot placement. In the UK i think the 6.5x55 has a wider availability of ammo and rifles than the 7x57. And to change you have to go through pain of a variation.

 

[big ears]

Big Ears, you are correct. There is very little to choose between the 6.5x55 and 7x57 and any difference will be down to bullet type and shot placement. In the UK i think the 6.5x55 has a wider availability of ammo and rifles than the 7x57. And to change you have to go through pain of a variation.

Thanks. This kind of sums up where I am.

 

[User00003]

Lol..thing is, a 7x57 user doesn’t need to convince himself or think about ‘why’, he ‘gets it’..that’s why you’re in the 6.5 club

I say that tongue in cheek if course

 

[big ears]

Lol..thing is, a 7x57 user doesn’t need to convince himself or think about ‘why’, he ‘gets it’..that’s why you’re in the 6.5 club

I say that tongue in cheek if course

Haha, I have been sorely tempted with the 7x57 but the only option in the K95 is the 7x57R which adds another complexity.

I think the 6.5 club and the 7mm club are very similar in many ways and have very loyal followers. I am sure this debate will go in but IF one were better than the other then I’m sure this would have been sorted out around about 1900!!!

Thanks for all your help.

BE

 

[Heym SR20]

And of course in the good old days a gentlemen just needed a 22 long rifle, a 275 Rigby and a 375 H&H and he was good to hunt anywhere in the world.

But was far more likely to have either a 256 Mannlicher (the 6.5x54) or a 303 to do everything with.

Fast forward to today and the 308 or the 6.5x55, 7x57, 7x65r 270, 30-06, 7-08, 6.5 Creedmoor ( or any other cartridge that shoots a 140 to 150 grain bullet so that with a 200 m Zero its trajectory is within 4 or 5 cm of point of aim and with c2,000 J of energy at 100m and min muzzle velocity of 2450 fps, and able to shoot a non toxic bullet) will do everything you need.

If you want smaller - go to the 223 (I would like to say 222, but LH 222 are like rocking horse poo), bigger then 375 H&H.

But in answer to the orginal question - Do You Need a 7x57 - probably not. But should you want, desire, lust after a fine rifle in 7x57 / 275 Rigby - then absolutely.

 

[big ears]

But in answer to the orginal question - Do You Need a 7x57 - probably not. But should you want, desire, lust after a fine rifle in 7x57 / 275 Rigby - then absolutely.

Oh Sh*t now you have gone and done it all over again.

 

[Orion]

Personally I’d go for a 7mm Spanish Mauser just to be different.

 

[devon deer stalker]

Personally I’d go for a 7mm Spanish Mauser just to be different.

Ha, and you always told me Merkels were something different

 

[Orion]

Ha, and you always told me Merkels were something different

The cartridge not the rifle.

 

[Southern]

Haha, I have been sorely tempted with the 7x57 but the only option in the K95 is the 7x57R which adds another complexity.

BE

What "complexity" does 7x57R add? You reload them with 7x57 dies and a different shell holder.

In a combination gun or drilling, you would load it to lower pressures, but have a longer barrel, so not too much loss of bullet velocity.

In a modern single shot like the Blaser K95 or a Merkel, you load it to the same pressure as the 7x57 Mauser for a bolt action.

 

[Heym SR20]

Oh Sh*t now you have gone and done it all over again.

But want, desire, lust after doesn’t necessarily mean “need” or “must have” or “choose to change”.