Do I really need to rebarrel?

[muddy42]

I have a 1954 BSA Hunter in .222 that had the trigger adjusted so the bolt could not be removed and so had decades of fouling in the bore when I bought it. To get the bolt out I had to remove the trigger group. Spent about a day getting the fouling out (wearing out about five phosphor bronze brushes in the process) out and the middle third of the barrel was missing rifling due to horrendous pitting. I assumed it would need rebarrelling but it turns out to shoot about an MOA out to 600yds with cheapo brass and bullets and my clumsy neck-sized reloads. I clean it with JB bore paste as the extreme pitting accumulates lots of fouling.View attachment 232771

You probably tried this, but have you tried pushing the trigger forward to remove the bolt? This is one of the qwerks of some BSAs. I owned one in 243 for years before finding this out.
Its got no visible rifling left but can get 2 inch groups with the lighter ammo. 100g makes the target look like its been shot with a shotgun!

 

[HandB]

You probably tried this, but have you tried pushing the trigger forward to remove the bolt? This is one of the qwerks of some BSAs. I owned one in 243 for years before finding this out.
Its got no visible rifling left but can get 2 inch groups with the lighter ammo. 100g makes the target look like its been shot with a shotgun!

Thanks - I adjusted the trigger slightly heavier and now it is easy to get the bolt out by pressing the trigger and removing the bolt in the normal way.

 

[Border]

I have had a quandary recently, I am awaiting my variation for 30.06 , I have always kept Tikka T3 rifles, friend has offered me his Sako finlight with scope mounts for a little less then I could buy a new Tikka T3, The Sako has fired approx 500 rounds over a 3 year period since new and is extremely accurate.
What is the life expectancy on a rifle barrel that has received average care.?
I do know the sound mod is removed after every day use,

75 or 85 Finnlight?
In 30-06 I would imagine 5-6000 rounds barrel life. Maybe more if not shot hot.

 

[John Gryphon]

simple recrowning can at times sort out a 'shot out' barrel

 

[Jon P]

75 or 85 Finnlight?
In 30-06 I would imagine 5-6000 rounds barrel life. Maybe more if not shot hot.

85 Finnlight, - rifle never used on a range, but he shoots around200 deer a year.,had gun just under 3 years now .

 

[Border]

85 Finnlight, - rifle never used on a range, but he shoots around200 deer a year.,had gun just under 3 years now .

Should be loads of life then.

 

[Neddle]

A common theme running through many of the SD posts is “rebarrelling” - because the existing barrel is “shot out” i.e. so many rounds (sometimes less than 1000) through it that erosion, wear and tear etc… has negatively impacted on the accuracy required to the point that replacement is required. These comments and what followed intrigue me. I can perhaps see the case if shooting high-level competition —especially at 1000 yards plus but I really do wonder what real impact barrel wear has on accuracy for rifles used for deerstalking at the typically 300 yards or less ranges typical in the UK - even the DSC shooting requirement is easily attainable with “sloppy” bores. I am probably influenced by my god knows how old Remmy 700 .222 (bless) which has had literally tens of thousands of rounds through it, is only occassionally bore-cleaned, the bore looks like a crazed mirror but yet the old girl consistently does sub-half inch at 100 yards and my M44 Mosin which is just craze(d)y, counter-bored by more than an inch and as a result the barrel/bore length is verging on “sawn-off”.
Sooo, a genuine question chaps - am I just extremely lucky, is rebarrelling really necessary or is it just another “must have” for those who choose to subscribe to this theory?

I think it's the latest craze, rebarreling, alot of ones need to have a custom rifle in their cabinet, bragging rites

 

[ejg]

My tolerance level for bad barrels is very low. I wasted so much time and money in duff barrels that I sometimes don't even fire a second hand rifle before the new barrel is fitted. More than half of my second hand bought rifles were shot out.... why would they be sold otherwise. My new out the box 300wm was not shooting well, as in 1-1.5" and I was pricing barrels already but opted to give it one try with polish/lapping the barrel. She went to under 1/2" after that. I find 308 the easiest, if 168 match ammo does not shoot... barrel out.
edi

 

[MarinePMI]

As said many times before, barrels on rifles are what tires (tyres as you guys spell it) are on cars.

As to rebarreling? If you have a sports car that comes with Goodyear F1 tires, they're likely good enough, and handling is well enough for most drivers. But some just want to put on some Pereilli's, so they can eek out a little bit more performance around the curves. Is it needed? Nope. But some can't leave "well enough" alone, and so they change things.

It's a shooter's decision on whether to re-barrel or not, largely based on the rifle's use and minimum accuracy desired. A more accurate rifle doesn't mean it'll put more meat on the table...but the peace of mind might. <shrug> Shooters are often a superstitious and opinionated lot. Lots of different feelings on the matter.

As to the 30.06 barrel life; easily 6000rds if not shooting long strings of fire. Most likely will go to 8000rds if taken care of. Especially if you're not one looking for a group in the .2's....

 

[AndrewS]

Whitworth 308 from 1970's, was loosing accuracy, rechecked bullet seating. 150g 1mm out of case neck to touch lands, enough said.

Secondhand 222 Sako, looked OK but never shot well. New barrel via Robin and easy 1/2" groups with factory ammo.

If it shoot barrel is OK, if it doesn't, a worn barrel might be the issue.

Robin???

 

[AndrewS]

Most barrels that are denominated as 'shot out by their owners are simply miserably maintained. The groves are filled with carbon baked to glas hard deposits suggesting that the rifling is gone.
Having said that, it makes a world of a difference wether you are talking about a .222 or a .300WM, just to name these two. The former will hardly ever kill a barrel while the latter can do so within no time at all.

FWIW my Sako Varmint in .222 has gone from shooting one-hole groups (if I do my part!) to maybe 2 inches (and that doesn't include any fliers). But then it's probably shot 20k+ rounds... Think this does need a new barrel.

 

[Klenchblaize]

“Yes Sir, it is indeed shot out and beyond recovery. Furthermore do you not realise you need a Creedmoor chambering that is setup for copper heads?”

K

 

[Muir]

The wisest statement I ever heard about barrel wear was this:
"If you don't want to wear out your barrel, leave it in the closet."

How long a barrel lasts will be determined by the ammo that was shot through it, and what kind of barrel it is. I had an Anschutz 22WMR that was worn almost smooth after 20 years of sport shooting. Makes sense -many makes of rimfire target barrels used mild steel to enhance the finish/accuracy of the final product.

On the other hand, I have a hammer forged Ruger American 7.62x39 that I know has had at least 1000 rounds of copper plated steel bullets through it, with my usual (cough!) non-cleaning regimen. Still has rifling and still shoots as well as it it did the first time out -perhaps better.

I think some people rebarrel rifles because they fall out of practice, mess up a few shots and blame the rifle for being shot out. Verified of course, by the gunsmith who is anxious to do the work. ~Muir

 

[Selous]

Interesting responses chaps and as ever many differing views. As no-one has really mentioned it, it did leave me wondering whether the state of the barrel crown could be the more significant factor in loss of accuracy - as it is the last point of contact for the bullet?

The attached photos are before and after a recrown by Ronin as there was pitting present at the very end of the barrel

 

[Ronin]

Whitworth 308 from 1970's, was loosing accuracy, rechecked bullet seating. 150g 1mm out of case neck to touch lands, enough said.

Secondhand 222 Sako, looked OK but never shot well. New barrel via Robin and easy 1/2" groups with factory ammo.

If it shoot barrel is OK, if it doesn't, a worn barrel might be the issue.

Robin ,,,,,,,

I’m not running a cafe with a one armed Irishman

 

[regi]

When I looked around for a new barrel on a Steyr Mannlicher UIT in .308 ( what else?) , I was informed that this poses a problem: pressed in barrel. Feasable, but very few who do it.

 

[Uncas]

Once upon a time when you bought a rifle it had some meat in the barrel thickness.
And you could rebore/cut it to a larger calibre, but I have not heard any smiths doing this
for a very long time ( perhaps the machinery is not available or the knowhow any more ).
Old Martini single shots where often rebored/cut from .22 to 218 bee & 222.
Or even sleeved.

 

[Steff]

Once upon a time when you bought a rifle it had some meat in the barrel thickness.
And you could rebore/cut it to a larger calibre, but I have not heard any smiths doing this
for a very long time ( perhaps the machinery is not available or the knowhow any more ).
Old Martini single shots where often rebored/cut from .22 to 218 bee & 222.
Or even sleeved.

Becuse in most cases it just not worth the effort and cost involved. Replacement barrels are widely available either from the original manufacturer or from companies like Lothar Walther, Shilen, Bartlein and many others.

 

[NullMac]

A common theme running through many of the SD posts is “rebarrelling” - because the existing barrel is “shot out”

It is Group Think and ego.

Minimum accuracy "requirements" have shrunk. It used to be 1 moa but now anything worse than 0.5moa means you have a crap gun and only an unworthy man would ever have a crap gun. Deer on the other hand are still at the same range and still the same size.

Personally I doubt if these guns really are 0.5moa. One three shot group proves nowt. I love the "when I do my part" comment. To me that means, I have shot a load of groups and eventually one was small enough to make me proud. Totally failing to understand that even a 2moa rifle will shoot a 0.5moa group, and ignoring all the evidence that suggests the rifle is anything but 0.5 moa.

What I am certain of is that people are not capable of shooting 0.5 moa when stalking so that level of precision from a rifle is not required on deer sized targets.

Similarly switching to a less common calibre. The gains on say a 7-08 to a 3-08 are in reality imperceptible at the target and are only apparent on paper because for some reason the shooter never aims to compensate for windage or drop. Sure there are situations where a more exotic calibre is an optimisation or more flexible (hence the 65CM is still around) but a lot of it is just ego and a lack of understanding of what is really happening out there.

 

[User00044]

I have had two rifles rebarreled , one was goosed the other still had some life in it and in the not to distant future will be getting rebarreled again , in a different chambering .
My rifle , my money , my choice . Do I need to rebarrel ? No . Do I fancy a change ? Hell yeh !





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