Guntrader Data Leak and compensation claims

204rips

Well-Known Member
Hey all, as many of us more than likely are I was one of the people that had my details stolen as part of the hacking on guntrader. Question is, I have been getting calls from no win no fee claims companies regarding it and offering to gain compensation for this. Has anyone else thought about it or even started a claim yet?
 
Hey all, as many of us more than likely are I was one of the people that had my details stolen as part of the hacking on guntrader. Question is, I have been getting calls from no win no fee claims companies regarding it and offering to gain compensation for this. Has anyone else thought about it or even started a claim yet?
I would go for it. The arrogant MD needs to be taught a lesson.
 
Hey all, as many of us more than likely are I was one of the people that had my details stolen as part of the hacking on guntrader. Question is, I have been getting calls from no win no fee claims companies regarding it and offering to gain compensation for this. Has anyone else thought about it or even started a claim yet?
What is your loss exactly ? You can't just sue 'cos you are ****ed off, this is not America.

In the absence of a demonstrable loss, presumably they are just going to run an "extortion racket". It will be very expensive to defend the claim, even if there is no loss to sue for, so extort some cash out of them as it is cheaper to settle than contest it. If you are the kind of scumbag that is up for that, fill your boots....

However....

I always like to ask these scumbags where they got my data. In this case it would seem plausible that they have broken the law in downloading the data or receiving stolen data from another party. How else would they have got it ?? Not sure.

Let me know which company/s it was and I will ask the National Crime Agency to investigate whether they have broken the law. Maybe you would get involved in that, day in court, expenses junket? Whadayyathink ?? However, Law firms potentially getting their ass in a wringer with the NCA/ICO? Criminal offence == struck off lawyers. Shame.

Hope they phone me, that should be a fun conversation !!
 
What is your loss exactly ? You can't just sue 'cos you are ****ed off, this is not America.

In the absence of a demonstrable loss, presumably they are just going to run an "extortion racket". It will be very expensive to defend the claim, even if there is no loss to sue for, so extort some cash out of them as it is cheaper to settle than contest it. If you are the kind of scumbag that is up for that, fill your boots....

However....

I always like to ask these scumbags where they got my data. In this case it would seem plausible that they have broken the law in downloading the data or receiving stolen data from another party. How else would they have got it ?? Not sure.

Let me know which company/s it was and I will ask the National Crime Agency to investigate whether they have broken the law. Maybe you would get involved in that, day in court, expenses junket? Whadayyathink ?? However, Law firms potentially getting their ass in a wringer with the NCA/ICO? Criminal offence == struck off lawyers. Shame.

Hope they phone me, that should be a fun conversation !!
I do kind of agree in a way, although the loss is my personal data, my piece of mind that my family is safe in their home with some anti **** knowing all my contact details, full address and even a grid ref to where we live. The fact I registered with a professional company and trusted them to keep my personal data safe. I worked the foot and mouth cull 20 years ago and believe me I know first hand just how dangerous they can be.
 
I looked into this quite carefully and decided not to do it as the main benefactor is clearly the lawyers and there is some risk of bills for almost FA return. It also seems a bit damaging to the gun trade generally which can not be a good thing
 
I do kind of agree in a way, although the loss is my personal data, my piece of mind that my family is safe in their home with some anti **** knowing all my contact details, full address and even a grid ref to where we live. The fact I registered with a professional company and trusted them to keep my personal data safe. I worked the foot and mouth cull 20 years ago and believe me I know first hand just how dangerous they can be.
I have to agree with Nullmac - to be successful in an English court you would have to quantify your loss in money terms (i.e what is the value of the damage you have suffered) and prove that loss.
 
I looked into this quite carefully and decided not to do it as the main benefactor is clearly the lawyers and there is some risk of bills for almost FA return. It also seems a bit damaging to the gun trade generally which can not be a good thing
I haven’t actually looked into it in any detail, I am assuming they want to take a hefty percentage to make the claim? I really hope lessons are learnt from this, I have seen another new online gun sales platform has popped up all ready stating they offer state of art online security etc obviously making a dig at guntrader and trying to poach their users.
 
For what it’s worth here’s the deal:-

THE SCOPE OF THIS AGREEMENT IS AS FOLLOWS


1. What is covered by this Agreement?

1.1 Your claim for damages for Distress and Loss (including General Damages for Pain, Suffering and loss of Amenity and Damages for Pecuniary Loss) suffered as a result of, but not exclusively, the misuse of private information by the defendant,

1.2 All work already undertaken on your behalf including the work required in setting up this agreement;

1.3 Any Application for pre-action or non-party disclosure;

1.4 Any Appeal you make against an Interim Order or an Assessment of Costs;

1.5 ADR (including mediation) relating to the ‘claim’;

1.6 Any Appeal by the Opponent;

1.7 Any proceedings you take to enforce a Court Judgment, Order or Agreement;

1.8 Negotiations about and/or a Court Assessment of the Costs of this claim.

2. What is not covered by this agreement (unless otherwise agreed)?

2.1 Any Appeal you make against the final Judgment or Order;

2.2 Any Part 20 Counterclaim made against you, or Counterclaim or Defence by way of set off which still exists after your claim has either been ‘Won’ or you ‘Lose’, or otherwise concluded;

2.3 Any Appeal against an Interim Order made by your Opponent.

3. Paying Us If You ‘Win’

3.1 If your claim is successful you are liable to pay all our basic charges, our expenses and disbursements and a success fee, together with the premium for any After The Event (‘ATE’) insurance you take out.

3.2 In the event that your claim has a value in excess of the Small Claims Limit (currently £1,000 for damages for Pain, Suffering and Loss of Amenity or £10,000 for other losses), then you may be entitled to seek recovery from the Opponent, part, or all, of our basic charges and our expenses and disbursements, you may also be able to the ATE Insurance premium from the opponent with any unrecovered element being paid by you subject to clause 8.5 below.

4. Disbursements and Expenses

4.1 If you receive interim damages before the end of your claim, we may require you to pay our disbursements and expenses to date at that point and an amount for future expenses and disbursements;

4.2 If your claim is successful but you are ordered to pay the other side’s charges following an Interlocutory Hearing, then such charges will usually only be up to the amount of damages awarded to you. Such charges may be covered by your ATE insurance policy subject to the terms of the policy and your compliance with such terms;

4.3 If, prior to a final Judgment, you are awarded any costs, either by way of a Court Order or Agreement, then we are entitled to payment of those costs together with any success fee on those charges if your claim is successful.

5. What Do I Pay If I Lose?

5.1 If you lose you do not have to pay our basic charges provided that you have complied with our Terms and Conditions. However, you may be required to pay our disbursements and expenses, although these may be covered by any ATE insurance policy you have purchased, subject to compliance with the Terms and Conditions of that policy;

5.2 If you lose your claim, you may be responsible for some, or all, of the Opponent’s costs. If your claim includes a claim for General Damages for Pain, Suffering and Loss of Amenity, then you may benefit from Qualified One-Way Costs Shifting. In such circumstances, the Court will not usually enforce an Order for Costs against you unless:

5.2.1 The claim is fundamentally dishonest; or

5.2.2 The proceedings have been struck out; or

5.2.3 The claim includes a claim for the financial benefit of another party.

6 Basic Charges

6.1 These are for work undertaken on your claim from your initial instructions until this Agreement ends. These charges are subject to an annual review;

6.2 We calculate these charges based on each hour engaged on your case. Routine letters and telephone calls are charged as units of 1/10 of an hour. Any other type of letters and telephone calls will be charged on a time engaged basis. The hourly rate that we will charge is £400 per hour depending on the actual work being undertaken and the grade of fee earner undertaking the work. This section should be read alongside our Terms and Conditions and the section entitled ‘Your Legal Costs and Disbursements’.

6.3 The hourly rate set out in 6.2 assumes that the work being undertaken relates to negotiations and/or proceedings in the County Court that is commensurate with the type of work, in terms of value and complexity akin to that jurisdiction. Occasionally it may be necessary to commence proceedings in the High Court in relation to declaration proceedings or proceedings for Injunctive relief. In these circumstances, and to reflect the increase complexity of these types of proceedings our hourly rate will be charged at £550 per hour.

7 Right to Cancel/Ending This Agreement

7.1 If you have entered into this Agreement in the physical presence of our employees, servant and/or agent, away from our business premises (i.e. in your home), or the Contract was agreed on our business premises immediately after you were personally and individually addressed away from our business premises, in the presence of one of our employees, servants and/or agents, then you have a right to cancel this Agreement within 14 days;

7.2 If you cancel within the 14-day time limit, you will pay nothing. However, if you end the Agreement before you ‘Win’ or ‘Lose’, you pay our basic charges and disbursements and expenses. If your case ultimately succeeds, you also pay a success fee. We reserve the right to end this Agreement at any time if either you have failed to comply with the terms of this Agreement, you reject our advice on any potential settlement or the prospects of success of a ‘Win’ are reduced to below 50%.

8 The Success Fee

8.1 The success fee is set at 75% of our basic charges, or 100%, if the claim concludes less than 45 days before Trial, including following a Judgment.

8.2 The success fee percentage reflects the following: -

8.2.1 Our assessment of the risks of your case;

8.2.2 The fact that if you lose, we will not earn anything;

8.2.3 Any other appropriate factors;

8.2.4 Our arrangements with you about paying expenses and disbursements;

8.2.5 The risks of recovering damages from your opponent, which is less than their Part 36 Offer which you have rejected, on our advice;

8.2.6 Unless it is expressly stated in writing, no part of the success fee relates to postponement of payment of fees and expenses.

8.2.7 Additional case specific risks which are set out in any risk assessment.

8.3 The success fee cannot be more than 100% of the basic charges in total.

8.4 As your claim may include a claim for Pain, Suffering and Loss of Amenity, for psychological or psychiatric injury, there is a maximum limit, in percentage terms, on the level of success fee which we can recover from you.

8.5 That maximum limit is 25% of the total amount of any claim for General Damages for Pain, Suffering, Loss of Amenity and Damages for Pecuniary loss. Claims for future Pecuniary Loss are unaffected.

8.6 The maximum limit in percentage terms that is applicable is net of any sums recoverable by the Compensation Recovery Unit of the Department of Work and Pensions. The maximum limit (25%) is inclusive of any VAT charges at the prevailing rate.

8.7 The maximum limit, in percentage terms, only applies to a success fee for proceedings at first instance. The maximum limit would not apply, for example, to any Appeal by your opponent.

8.8 In the event of a dispute regarding the calculation of the success fee, the parties agree for the dispute to be determined by an independent barrister of at least 10 years call, to be appointed by agreement between us. In default of agreement, the barrister be appointed by the President of the Law Society of England and Wales, such barrister to act as expert, not arbitrator and his/her decision shall be binding.

The barrister’s fees are to be met by the losing party to the dispute.

9 Additional Information and Terms

9.1 We add VAT at the prevailing rate that applies to the work when it has been carried out. VAT is added to the total of the basic charges and the success fee (however, the maximum success fee of 25% is inclusive of VAT). Our VAT registration number is 329824182 The parties acknowledge and agree that this Agreement is not a contentious Business Agreement within the meaning of the Solicitors Act 1974;

9.2 It may be that your opponent makes a Part 36 offer, or other formal offer to settle your claim, which you reject on our advice, and your claim for damages goes ahead to Trial where you recover damages that are less than that Offer. If this happens, we will not claim our basic charges and success fee for any work done after the expiry of the Part 36 Offer. However, in these circumstances, you may be ordered to pay your opponent’s costs from the expiry of the Part 36 Offer. If your claim includes a claim for General Damages for Pain Suffering and Loss of Amenity, then any payment to your Opponent in costs, will be limited to the amount of damages and interest awarded to you, under the Qualified One-Way Costs Shifting Provisions;

9.3 In the event of a ‘Win’, but we fail to recover all of our basic charges and success fee from the opponent; we will not claim from you any basic charges, success fee and vat, in excess of the amount recovered (for basic charges, success fee and vat) from the opponent.

9.4 The above clause (9.3) will not apply if this agreement is ended for any reason before a ‘Win’ or a ‘Lose’.

9.5 The description of the Claim, as set out above and within the definitions, is for recognition purposes and does not in any way limit the ambit of this Agreement; the ambit of the retainer shall be taken to include all issues that the parties understood to be the subject of the Claim. The ambit may change from time to time, as the Claim progresses. For example, if an opponent is incorrectly described or if there are additional opponents added, after this Agreement was first made, the ambit of the Agreement will not be in any way limited by the fact that the description of the Claim as set out above, may not be wholly accurate and complete;

9.6 You have the right to apply to the Court for an assessment of our costs, including the success fee.
 
I do kind of agree in a way, although the loss is my personal data, my piece of mind that my family is safe in their home with some anti **** knowing all my contact details, full address and even a grid ref to where we live. The fact I registered with a professional company and trusted them to keep my personal data safe. I worked the foot and mouth cull 20 years ago and believe me I know first hand just how dangerous they can be.
So you have no financial loss then. No case sadly

Like you I am not happy but there isn't much we can do its a police job.

I had a couple of roofers turn up at the door a couple of days after the leak. Scruffy tickets. Looked like a couple of sabs, checkin out who I was. Gave them my worst Glagow bampot stare before I realise who they were :) They must think I am a right ****er. Not necessarily wrong.:lol:
 
have been getting calls from no win no fee claims companies
Hmm. Tread carefully.
How did the No win, No fee company get your details?
Are they using stolen data?
It might be a scam.
I recall a post on here with advice from the police, suggesting that individuals should contact them if they are approach.
 
I’m sure someone posted on a similar thread, quoting a note from Guntrader who said they’ve no insurance - not sure what else they might have by way of assets for the ambulance chasers to go after…
 
I, and no doubt others, have recently received an “apology” from Alexander Andover who “owns “ Guntrader (thought that was the meerkat from CtM.com) which includes the details below wrt to compensation. I know CEL solicitors are pushing a “no-win no-fee” class case against Guntrader and it will be interesting to see if they succeed.
View attachment 219011
 
My details were on the hacked list. They are all still current. However, I will not willingly help destroy a shooting organisation - in this case, by potentially forcing it into liquidation on the back of some scumbag ambulance-chasing shyster.

I have suffered no pecuniary loss. I have not suffered £1,000 worth of distress. Sorry, that is £750, as I would have to give 25% to the ambulance-chaser.

It should be no surprise that, as deerstalkers/rifle shooters, we are remarkably adept at shooting ourselves and our sport in the foot.
 
Its the way of the world these days. As soon as you respond or apply to join anything on the web or any organisation these days, you automatically are giving a certain amount of your personal information. Whether it be the Electric bill, council tax, paying for something on Ebay, your bank or Guntrader it makes no difference you are requested for information.

At days end just about everyone tries their best to make sure this personal information stays safe, stands to reason, no one wants their clients information floating around for all to see. But there will always be someone out there who will try to extract that information. Its a risk we take these days, and someone will always find away around it.
One only has to look at the British guy a few years back who managed to hack into the Pentagon computer frame work.

Its also typical of today's society that straight away the Vultures start circling in the form of these blame organisations, asking those affected to take action against the company. There as bad as the people that hacked the business in the first place, in my opinion.

I would think those who perpetrated the act in the first place have now got more than enough to concern themselves with, the authorities will deal with them.
 
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I was thinking about this the other day.
Ordinarily I am not one to seek arbitrary compensation as I think people should have a level of personal accountability, but it did occur to me that this breach, and the subsequent mapping by anti's, does actually have me worried.
I've not told the Mrs about it as I think without an effective mitigation it will do nothing but cause worry, or 'distress', as the GDPR calls it.

My thoughts then moved on to whether I need to upgrade home security with cameras and linked alarm as a consequence of this breach, which I think is a logical and rational position.
I'm therefore actually considering making a claim. Personally, I wouldn't make use of a no-win no-fee on an arbitrary claim basis, as I agree, they are disingenuous at best, and there are procedures for this sort of thing anyway and I think the ICO and court would likely side with the consumer on this.

Thoughts?

p.s. to correct some of the people above, you don't need to demonstrate a tangible loss under GDRP, you can in fact make a claim for distress. Question in my mind is how that is quantified...
 
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