Interesting article on 243, BASC magazine

[Bowland blades]

Yes, you can get bullets to stabilise. The issue is, said bullets aren't exactly effective and are certainly not effective past a couple of hundred yards because they've got the BC of a brick. Usually the minimum velocity for lead free expansion is around the 2200fps mark and said bullets will drop off below that before 250 or so (barrel length dependent).

Im trying load development currently for a 1:8 tikka. Ive got the benefit of a fast twist barrel but im really struggling to get anything under inch and a half. My usual lead load will literally put a bullet through a bullet hole (pretty sure I've actually got a video of it somewhere).

Not all rifles are equal. The majority of lead free bullets aren't the right choice for much over 200, especially in 6mm.

The rifle is a duffer (it happens) , the load needs a change or two or its the shooter well off par that day ?. Your not using the same old powder you had for another firearm are you ?
I have had zero issues on the .260 rem 1-7.5 twist with any lead and nil with any of the 100 grain and 120 grain copper from Barnes tTSX ( 100 grain works the best on expansion at 300 plus yards ) Normally it will exit far side but some angles means not always . I VERY MUCH RECOMEND Barnes tTSX
Only issues i have had with copper expansion is with my 223 on CWD Barnes and Hornaday 50 grain and have therefore gone back to lead Nosler 60 grain

 

[geoshot]

Thanks, but where does the 2200fps limit for reliable expansion come from? Granted I’ve not tested the 120gn 6.5 Powerhead Blade bullets yet due to not having enough time to sort a load out for them, but my test last spring of the .308 162gn at 200 yards proved they expand perfectly - with petals rolled back right down to the bottom of the cavity in the front of the bullet, as did a 300+ yard shot on a fallow pricket & a 200+ yard shot on a fallow buck the same evening.

Apologies if I’m being a bit dense, and I’m genuinely not trying to offend or provoke with this comment, but isn’t this sort of statement (just like the BASC article itself) simply perpetuating the myth that ‘we’re all doomed’ once we have to switch to copper?

I think that discusion of a 2200fps expansion threshold might have arisen during the days of the good-old/bad-old Barnes TSX, which had a reputation for "failing to expand" - our own sikamalc detests copper bullets because of poor experiences with those bullets
I chose Barnes LRX for my own reloading, which I'll get started on after I use up all my Hornady CX
Barnes claim that the LRX will expand, but don't say by how much, at velocities down to 1500fps
However, as they also recommend limiting use to distances where the bullet will impact at 1700-1800fps I suspect that "expansion" at 1500fps is probably limited/unreliable

It's only anecdotal but I have spoken to the head keeper & the deer keeper (two separate people & separate conversations) of a large estate in East Anglia about the use of copper bullets
They actually advised against the use of non-lead rounds which are designed to fragment when targetting deer at close range due to the likelihood of ruinous carcass damage, especially when using cartridges known to generate high muzzle velocities
It seems that perhaps non-lead bullets really are starting to mimic the performance, and some of the drawbacks, of lead ammo

 

[hendrix's rifle]

The rifle is a duffer (it happens) , the load needs a change or two or its the shooter well off par that day ?. Your not using the same old powder you had for another firearm are you ?
I have had zero issues on the .260 rem 1-7.5 twist with any lead and nil with any of the 100 grain and 120 grain copper from Barnes tTSX ( 100 grain works the best on expansion at 300 plus yards ) Normally it will exit far side but some angles means not always . I VERY MUCH RECOMEND Barnes tTSX
Only issues i have had with copper expansion is with my 223 on CWD Barnes and Hornaday 50 grain and have therefore gone back to lead Nosler 60 grain

Rifle certainly isnt a duffer, both the 243 and prc went on to shoot ragged holes with their lead counterpart and the prc put 5 130g cx bullets under half an inch.

I have loaded yew tree in three or four other cartridges and never had issue, maybe they just dont like the barrel or the powder/primers im using. Stranger things have happened.

Im not a lover of the ttsx, they are renowned for requiring a reasonable velocity to expand (2000-2000fps appears to be the number) and that doesn't give the margin for error I like. The issue with an expanding lead free projectile rather than fragmenting also means expansion will drop with lower velocity - further shot, less expansion until you hit that 2200 mark and they pencil on through

 

[hendrix's rifle]

..

 

[hendrix's rifle]

I think that discusion of a 2200fps expansion threshold might have arisen during the days of the good-old/bad-old Barnes TSX, which had a reputation for "failing to expand" - our own sikamalc detests copper bullets because of poor experiences with those bullets
I chose Barnes LRX for my own reloading, which I'll get started on after I use up all my Hornady CX
Barnes claim that the LRX will expand, but don't say by how much, at velocities down to 1500fps
However, as they also recommend limiting use to distances where the bullet will impact at 1700-1800fps I suspect that "expansion" at 1500fps is probably limited/unreliable

It's only anecdotal but I have spoken to the head keeper & the deer keeper (two separate people & separate conversations) of a large estate in East Anglia about the use of copper bullets
They actually advised against the use of non-lead rounds which are designed to fragment when targetting deer at close range due to the likelihood of ruinous carcass damage, especially when using cartridges known to generate high muzzle velocities
It seems that perhaps non-lead bullets really are starting to mimic the performance, and some of the drawbacks, of lead ammo

You're probably quite right, like the TTSX bullets. However, they rarely appear to be available here. I have just had a butchers and found somewhere that currently stocks them mind.

 

[Bowland blades]

Rifle certainly isnt a duffer, both the 243 and prc went on to shoot ragged holes with their lead counterpart and the prc put 5 130g cx bullets under half an inch.

I have loaded yew tree in three or four other cartridges and never had issue, maybe they just dont like the barrel or the powder/primers im using. Stranger things have happened.

Im not a lover of the ttsx, they are renowned for requiring a reasonable velocity to expand (2000-2000fps appears to be the number) and that doesn't give the margin for error I like. The issue with an expanding lead free projectile rather than fragmenting also means expansion will drop with lower velocity - further shot, less expansion until you hit that 2200 mark and they pencil on through

I have a fair old amount of recovered 100 grain and 120 grain Barnes from the 260 Barnes kills and you are more than safe to 300 yards and some . I rate them higher than lead and what comes out the other side is regularly adding up to the when it left the barrel . Around 400 yards is where I see slowed expansion - BUT STILL VERY VIABLE FOR CLEAN KILLS none the less. You can tell the difference in expansion isn't going to do much more , honestly though that's a good double the range most would try.
It is a very aminic 260 load you have been told by someone of there for sure !

 

[Conor O'Gorman]

have a look at a recent thread quoting some very skewed and flawed german research , while being passed off by the poster as sound and even misquoting his own figures to benefit his anti lead crusade , nah sorry not convinced.
its a very thinly veiled threat to shooting which for some inexplicable reason shooters and orgs think is a good thing .

To be fair, science in itself should not be considered a threat to shooting. Shooting activities have scientifically proven positive and negative impacts. We tend to pick and choose from those studies what we want to see/agree with, to validate our existing views. That could be evidence of the negative impact of lead shot ingestion for some birds, the positive impact of snaring of foxes for some birds, and so on. The challenges on the policy development front is perhaps disentangling fact from fiction with consideration for public attitudes and political realities.