Invincible deer?

[Sol]

I've heard a lot of people using vmax on roe recently It seems too preform really well Its less damaging externally than the regular hunting ammunition whilst absolutely smashing the internals.

I'm not particularly bothered just another weird case, I would of been disappointed if It was an obvious gut shot (and I was in the moment, I assumed) but on inspection, I cant really see an error on my end bit back sure, but nothing that should of kept it on its feet.

I wonder if adrenaline Is too play a bit I spotted them stopped whilst on quads about 250y out and when I drove down and popped over the hill they were on the move, I feel like they caught my wind a smidge rather than outright seeing me, thermals were pushing it everywhere.

 

[DMc88]

I've heard a lot of people using vmax on roe recently It seems too preform really well Its less damaging externally than the regular hunting ammunition whilst absolutely smashing the internals.

I'm not particularly bothered just another weird case, I would of been disappointed if It was an obvious gut shot (and I was in the moment, I assumed) but on inspection, I cant really see an error on my end bit back sure, but nothing that should of kept it on its feet.

I wonder if adrenaline Is too play a bit I spotted them stopped whilst on quads about 250y out and when I drove down and popped over the hill they were on the move, I feel like they caught my wind a smidge rather than outright seeing me, thermals were pushing it everywhere.

Atleast you managed a follow up and it died. Never a nice feeling seeing them living longer than expected after you shoot them.

 

[homer]

Not sure how this roe managed too be on its feet for over 5 minutes with not a single reaction too being hut, ended up having too be shot again obviously not sure what ones mine, and what Is his but the exit on the other side (he took quartering, exited at the neck) Is pretty small with very minimal blood on the coat, tighter too the shoulder too so lungs being damaged shouldn't of been an issue.

no green spilt or anything both shots entirely within the diaphragm, another friend suggested the bullet pencilled through? pretty unusual for .222

I've had higher shots (if mine Is left) take a little longer expiry as gravity Isn't in your favour but even those have been within 45 seconds with obvious reactions too being hut, I've never had one be on its feet for so long looking around alert like nothing happened.

View attachment 476298

Any pictures of the inside?

 

[hendrix's rifle]

I've heard a lot of people using vmax on roe recently It seems too preform really well Its less damaging externally than the regular hunting ammunition whilst absolutely smashing the internals.

I'm not particularly bothered just another weird case, I would of been disappointed if It was an obvious gut shot (and I was in the moment, I assumed) but on inspection, I cant really see an error on my end bit back sure, but nothing that should of kept it on its feet.

I wonder if adrenaline Is too play a bit I spotted them stopped whilst on quads about 250y out and when I drove down and popped over the hill they were on the move, I feel like they caught my wind a smidge rather than outright seeing me, thermals were pushing it everywhere.

Bullets can do weird and wonderful things. I recall a good few years ago sorting a 243 load with sierra 85g hollow points. We're talking ragged hole at 100 yards. Head shot a muntjac with them and found it blew up on impact. It didnt penetrate the skull and I ensured death with a knife. Tried them on fox and the same result. Got rid immediately after and went to 100g soft points. Worth noting I'm 99 percent sure everyone else recommended the 85g so was I just unlucky? Probably.

I've had ELD's impact broadside and exit through the haunch. It happens.

Petals from lead free tearing off and ending up in the back end after piercing the gralloch. Nothing is perfect but there certainly some are closer to perfect than others!

 

[nick100]

A fiend of mine @hannah123 shot a roebuck last summer. .308 180gr sp very little reaction.
It then started to slowly walk off. I thought lungs, it’ll soon go down.
Couldn’t get a follow up shot.
UKTDR came out first light next morning.
A 7/800 m track and we found it stone dead.
It had only just died. Eyes still bright etc.

Perfect placement but no expansion of the bullet.

 

[Smellydog]

Many a barrel is different. Some rifling really can compromise a bullets jacket but the same bullets in a different barrel can keep it together just that micro second longer.

It's why some are happy to use a vmax and others are not.
There is no blanket rule but my rule is two holes are better than one.

 

[Sol]

A fiend of mine @hannah123 shot a roebuck last summer. .308 180gr sp very little reaction.
It then started to slowly walk off. I thought lungs, it’ll soon go down.
Couldn’t get a follow up shot.
UKTDR came out first light next morning.
A 7/800 m track and we found it stone dead.
It had only just died. Eyes still bright etc.

Perfect placement but no expansion of the bullet.

I feel like if we didnt dispatch it the outcome would of been similar It was very mobile I heavily expect no expansion, I cant say the gralloch had overly damaged lungs by any means but Its hard too tell with the second shot of course, the backside looked pretty undamaged though!

 

[nick100]

I was fairly sure it’d drop. We stalked on behind it. (Slow walking pace) it was in a field of beans expecting it to drop.

The only follow up available at any point was a Texas heart shot.

If my dog had been a few years younger he’d have soon pulled it down too.

Hind sight is a wonderful thing.

 

[Sol]

Yeah original shot was perfectly fine shooting upwards however It decided too loop back towards my mate towards houses, dont get me wrong there was a backstop with the angle a stone wall, then a wood behind it but regardless there's houses half a mile down that road Its just something I wouldn't attempt, not too mention the deer, me, and him where effectively a triangle me being at the tip If it decided too exit weird Its had the chance too come directly for him, just something I wouldn't do, no deer Is worth the risk no matter the scenario, the follow up a few minutes later was significantly safer.

Its a shame! small buck wasn't really shot for the head more so for the meat but now Its got four holes in it wonder how bad Its going too be

 

[Heym SR20]

No deer has ever read the best practice manuals. Lung / behind the shoulder shots can always be tricky. There are not many major blood vessels - lots of little ones, but clotting system soon blocks those up. Bullet placement further forward has a much greater chance of severing major blood vessels which then quickly reduce blood pressure to a level where the animal looses consciousness. Doesn’t really matter whether you are using a .222 or a 7mm, shot placement is key.

I have had roe go 200m after taking a 7mm bullet through heart and lungs, show no sign of being hit but then saunter off and collapse stone dead.

 

[Leec6.5]

Shot a CWD at 200m with 150g copper Federal powershok. You heard the hit but the thing got up, trotted off 20m or so, then just stood. A second bullet had it on the deck but when I got there it was still breathing. Bullet through the lungs but still breathing.

That’s typical cwd, pin shoulders sorts them out!

 

[Tim.243]

Shot a CWD at 200m with 150g copper Federal powershok. You heard the hit but the thing got up, trotted off 20m or so, then just stood. A second bullet had it on the deck but when I got there it was still breathing. Bullet through the lungs but still breathing.

190 yds 150gn Lead...
55kg dressed or 5.5 cwd
Just a knife to bleed it....

 

[Sol]

Deer are weird creatures sometimes!

 

[Leec6.5]

190 yds 150gn Lead...
55kg dressed or 5.5 cwd
Just a knife to bleed it....

222 the OP

270 and the fallow - massive difference

 

[Tim.243]

Deer are weird creatures sometimes!

Not weird just they react to being shot as anything would, lung shoot a fox and it will take off just as fast if you missed it.
Shoot it front on in the bib and it will be far inclined to run, shoot it front on (pulled the shot and blow its leg off then it will take off..

 

[Tim.243]

222 the OP

270 and the fallow - massive difference

JH1986 posted this which I replied to
Shot a CWD at 200m with 150g copper Federal powershok. You heard the hit but the thing got up, trotted off 20m or so, then just stood. A second bullet had it on the deck but when I got there it was still breathing. Bullet through the lungs but still breathing.

 

[Leec6.5]

JH1986 posted this which I replied to
Shot a CWD at 200m with 150g copper Federal powershok. You heard the hit but the thing got up, trotted off 20m or so, then just stood. A second bullet had it on the deck but when I got there it was still breathing. Bullet through the lungs but still breathing.

Factory copper and home loaded copper are 2 very different things!

Factory copper in my opinion is way too fast!

Pin shoulders sorts the problem- no front legs can’t go anywhere

For the record I’ve seen them shot with lead and run long distances too.

 

[Mike1979]

Deer are weird creatures sometimes!

That sums it up perfectly.

My view is that if there is any doubt in your mind put a second shot in it. I shot a muntjac on a guided stalk...I knew the shot was good but for some reason the guide seemed a bit funny so a put a second shot into the muntjac....first shot smashed its heart to bits and the second rendered the front end of the carcass "not fit for more then dogfood". I did tell the guide the first shot was good...oh well "if in doubt".

 

[RCS Deer Management]

Factory copper and home loaded copper are 2 very different things!

Factory copper in my opinion is way too fast!

Pin shoulders sorts the problem- no front legs can’t go anywhere

For the record I’ve seen them shot with lead and run long distances too.

Ever wondered if the reason you are having to pin shoulders is because your bullets arnt performing the best?

 

[Sandy25]

Ever wondered if the reason you are having to pin shoulders is because your bullets arnt performing the best?

I still use lead and don't have any issues with expansion, but agree with @Norfolk Deer Search on pinning front shoulders..
I always pin the front shoulders on all muntjac I shoot - I know they aren't going to run, and removes risk of green contamination as 90% of the time they are quartering away/towards you.

I think it is all down to individual scenarios, the estate we manage has a lot of footfall from dog walkers and guests, so I would rather lose some meat on the shoulder but have the animal drop on the spot with no risk of it running on. Boundaries are also an issue, as we don't have any access to surrounding land. In other areas you might elect for standard shot placement behind the shoulder, but as I said I think it is very scenario dependent.

Sandy