New rifle, new calibre and a variation.

[Gorgon]

Greetings all! I'm planning on putting in my first variation shortly but I'm having to make decisions on rifles and calibres. Not a bad problem to have, but I'm after some input.

Firstly, I want to do a one for one. I have a Parker Hale in .243 but it's not screw cut. I have found that in the dead of night the muzzle flash is as bright as the sun and it sounds like a cannon going off. As such, I'd like something I can put a moderator on without invoking the wrath of the Parker Hale fan club! I've had a look at some rifles and I think it's going to be a toss up between a Bergara B14, Howa 1500 or Mauser M18. I'm hoping to hear from people who own/have used these particular rifles to figure out which to get. They all felt nice to hold and I did examine the fore end of the Howa to check for flex which was there but needed quite a bit of force to get it to move, so I imagine it will be fine? The rifle will be used for deer (roe) and foxes.

The second rifle will be a new calibre. I want to do some trips to The Forest of Dean after boar and also use it for bigger (fallow) deer. I'm thinking a .30 of some description. I'm going to hand load so ammunition availability isn't too much of a problem but I was thinking .308 or 30-06. .308 seems very popular compared to 30-06. In fact there were two rifles listed on Guntrader within 100 miles and I saw them both sat next to each other in the same rack! It seems there isn't much in it performance wise until heavier bullets are used but reading about both calibres has not helped me come to a decision. Which of these would be best for boar and deer, or is there another calibre that does it better? I'm not set on a .30 per say but it seems to be the best choice for both types of quarry. I will stand correction though!

Lastly, I have an unused moderator slot for the .243. When I do the variation will this stay or will I need to ask for it again? In fact would it just be best to phone the firearms folk?

I think that's all for the minute. I'm going back to the shop tomorrow with the intention of putting a deposit on a .243 then getting the paperwork sent off. I'm a bit reluctant to put a deposit on something else as I may not get it granted.

Thanks in advance!

 

[Lateral]

The second rifle will be a new calibre. I want to do some trips to The Forest of Dean after boar and also use it for bigger (fallow) deer. I'm thinking a .30 of some description. I'm going to hand load so ammunition availability isn't too much of a problem but I was thinking .308 or 30-06. .308 seems very popular compared to 30-06. In fact there were two rifles listed on Guntrader within 100 miles and I saw them both sat next to each other in the same rack! It seems there isn't much in it performance wise until heavier bullets are used but reading about both calibres has not helped me come to a decision. Which of these would be best for boar and deer, or is there another calibre that does it better? I'm not set on a .30 per say but it seems to be the best choice for both types of quarry. I will stand correction though!

There's a big difference between shooting "Driven boar", & shooting boar in the FOD, or similar, almost exclusively at night, within 100m, using NV, ot thermal.

For driven boar, then yes, one of the 30 cals, or 9.3's is perfect.

For shooting in the FOD, it's common to head shoot, to make sure you don't have the boar running off into the woods, and getting lost ! So accuracy is most important, because there are few cartridges that won't kill a boar, or many animals with a head shot.

My personal preference is a 6.5mm, more than enough for head shooting boar, fallow, or Reds. It's also relatively light on recoil, so it's easy to maintain sight on the boar, incase you need a follow up shot, and as you may need to shoot from awkward positions from a seat stand, when the boar won't play game !

Any of the mainstream 6.5's will do an excellent job, just find a rifle you're comfortable with.

 

[Gorgon]

There's a big difference between shooting "Driven boar", & shooting boar in the FOD, or similar, almost exclusively at night, within 100m, using NV, ot thermal.

For driven boar, then yes, one of the 30 cals, or 9.3's is perfect.

For shooting in the FOD, it's common to head shoot, to make sure you don't have the boar running off into the woods, and getting lost ! So accuracy is most important, because there are few cartridges that won't kill a boar, or many animals with a head shot.

My personal preference is a 6.5mm, more than enough for head shooting boar, fallow, or Reds. It's also relatively light on recoil, so it's easy to maintain sight on the boar, incase you need a follow up shot, and as you may need to shoot from awkward positions from a seat stand, when the boar won't play game !

Any of the mainstream 6.5's will do an excellent job, just find a rifle you're comfortable with.

It would appear that I am about to embark on an internet adventure looking at various 6.5mm cartridges! I have a feeling this will take some time. Is there a particular 6.5mm I should begin this task with?

 

[oldhamstocks]

I’m worryingly obsessed with the Steyr Scout II in .308 at the moment, and you can get it in 6.5 CM, 19 inch barrel though, but VERY fast cycle shootable (got a shot at length with one recently)

 

[splash]

Greetings all! I'm planning on putting in my first variation shortly but I'm having to make decisions on rifles and calibres. Not a bad problem to have, but I'm after some input.

Firstly, I want to do a one for one. I have a Parker Hale in .243 but it's not screw cut. I have found that in the dead of night the muzzle flash is as bright as the sun and it sounds like a cannon going off. As such, I'd like something I can put a moderator on without invoking the wrath of the Parker Hale fan club! I've had a look at some rifles and I think it's going to be a toss up between a Bergara B14, Howa 1500 or Mauser M18. I'm hoping to hear from people who own/have used these particular rifles to figure out which to get. They all felt nice to hold and I did examine the fore end of the Howa to check for flex which was there but needed quite a bit of force to get it to move, so I imagine it will be fine? The rifle will be used for deer (roe) and foxes.

The second rifle will be a new calibre. I want to do some trips to The Forest of Dean after boar and also use it for bigger (fallow) deer. I'm thinking a .30 of some description. I'm going to hand load so ammunition availability isn't too much of a problem but I was thinking .308 or 30-06. .308 seems very popular compared to 30-06. In fact there were two rifles listed on Guntrader within 100 miles and I saw them both sat next to each other in the same rack! It seems there isn't much in it performance wise until heavier bullets are used but reading about both calibres has not helped me come to a decision. Which of these would be best for boar and deer, or is there another calibre that does it better? I'm not set on a .30 per say but it seems to be the best choice for both types of quarry. I will stand correction though!

Lastly, I have an unused moderator slot for the .243. When I do the variation will this stay or will I need to ask for it again? In fact would it just be best to phone the firearms folk?

I think that's all for the minute. I'm going back to the shop tomorrow with the intention of putting a deposit on a .243 then getting the paperwork sent off. I'm a bit reluctant to put a deposit on something else as I may not get it granted.

Thanks in advance!

Buy a used Sako or Tikka

 

[co’den]

Bear in mind that the minimum recommended calibre for boar in the UK is .270. 150g lead or 110g copper.
I only know this as I asked my FEO to confirm that my rifles were conditioned for boar. He pointed me to the following.

Home | Wild Deer Best Practice Guidance

bestpracticeguides.org.uk

 

[Gorgon]

I’m worryingly obsessed with the Steyr Scout II in .308 at the moment, and you can get it in 6.5 CM, 19 inch barrel though, but VERY fast cycle shootable (got a shot at length with one recently)

I had to Google this and while I'm sure it's a fine rifle what with it being a Steyr, I'm afraid it's not really my cup of tea!

 

[Gorgon]

Buy a used Sako or Tikka

I'd considered this and even a new T3x but they're quite pricey!

 

[oldhamstocks]

I had to Google this and while I'm sure it's a fine rifle what with it being a Steyr, I'm afraid it's not really my cup of tea!

It’s a bit niche but it was fantastic to shoot! If I had a spare 2.2K blabs and a slot I’d love one -very capable wee rifle

 

[suburban bushwacker]

It would appear that I am about to embark on an internet adventure looking at various 6.5mm cartridges! I have a feeling this will take some time. Is there a particular 6.5mm I should begin this task with?

the one your gunshop sells. lots of us now shoot 6.5 Creedmoor as its widely available. All the 6.5's are excellent: 6.5 Grendel smaller rifles, 6.5 x 47 because reasons, 6.5 swede older and European rifles, 6.5x53 historic rifles, 6.5x284 rifles for people who like their gunsmith and wish to visit him regularly.

If you want a rifle that does everything both a 6.5 and a 308 do, just with a certain panache, 7mm08 might be the one for you.

 

[spanner]

It would appear that I am about to embark on an internet adventure looking at various 6.5mm cartridges! I have a feeling this will take some time. Is there a particular 6.5mm I should begin this task with?

Just saying I have a low round count 6.5 x 55 Sako 75 Deluxe for sale at Bond and Bywater, screw cut and shoots superb. I only used it for Deer and shot half a dozen or so a year with it for 15 years. Have given up my FAC due to loss of my ground through it being sold.

 

[Lateral]

It would appear that I am about to embark on an internet adventure looking at various 6.5mm cartridges! I have a feeling this will take some time. Is there a particular 6.5mm I should begin this task with?

I have three 6.5's, and they are all excellent.

My first was a 6.5x47, recommended by a couple of friends who both shoot a lot of deer. It's a very accurate round, next to zero recoil, but for deer you need to home load, as there is only factory target ammunition available.

Depending on bullet, I'm getting 2900-3000fps with a 129-130g bullet, & 43g of powder.

I also have a 6.5CM, in Tikka Tactical chassis stock, another fantastic cartridge, circa 2850fps with a 143g ELD-X, also circa 43g powder. Used it at Orion outdoor range, shooting gongs out to 850m/920yds. We were very lucky no wind on the day we shot, and it was too easy, once the scope was dialled in, never missed, and it became boring. This is 100% down to the rifle, and not my shooting ! Sadly too heavy for stalking, but the cartridge is excellent, and there's plenty of factory ammunition to choose from.

Lastly, and I have to say the rifle I tend to go for, the 6.5PRC. I have loads for both 130g Barnes TSX 3093fps, & 143g ELD-X at 3070fps, both capable of cloverleafing. PRC requires about 35-40% more powder than the other two, but you'll gain circa 200fps over the CM.

 

[suburban bushwacker]

I’m worryingly obsessed with the Steyr Scout II in .308 at the moment, and you can get it in 6.5 CM, 19 inch barrel though, but VERY fast cycle shootable (got a shot at length with one recently)

if you want one, there's one in The OSM armoury that's for sale

 

[25 Sharps]

Bear in mind that the minimum recommended calibre for boar in the UK is .270. 150g lead or 110g copper.
I only know this as I asked my FEO to confirm that my rifles were conditioned for boar. He pointed me to the following.

Home | Wild Deer Best Practice Guidance

bestpracticeguides.org.uk

As posted above it doesn’t really apply for paid boar shooting in the uk, almost all of which is over bait from a tower. Boar are shot stationary in the brain, a 6.5 or even a .223 will do the job no issue at all.

There is no legal minimum for boar, as you say the .270 is just a recommendation.

 

[25 Sharps]

I have three 6.5's, and they are all excellent.

My first was a 6.5x47, recommended by a couple of friends who both shoot a lot of deer. It's a very accurate round, next to zero recoil, but for deer you need to home load, as there is only factory target ammunition available.

Depending on bullet, I'm getting 2900-3000fps with a 129-130g bullet, & 43g of powder.

That seems pretty quick considering neither viht nor hodgdon get past 2700/2800, one powder giving 2825.

 

[Lateral]

That seems pretty quick considering neither viht nor hodgdon get past 2700/2800, one powder giving 2825.

Any speeds I post, come from chronograph testing, LabRada, Magnetospeed, and more recently a Garmin Zero.

Due to the "I'll sue you" culture in the US, published load data needs to be ultra conservative, taking into account the lowest common denominator ? So I, like others can load based on a mix of owners real life results, online data, and what I see as I develop a load. Sometimes I achieve above expectations, and other times, I struggle to get close, like at the moment, I'm struggling to achieve expected velocities from my .223 But that's life.

 

[25 Sharps]

Any speeds I post, come from chronograph testing, LabRada, Magnetospeed, and more recently a Garmin Zero.

Due to the "I'll sue you" culture in the US, published load data needs to be ultra conservative, taking into account the lowest common denominator ? So I, like others can load based on a mix of owners real life results, online data, and what I see as I develop a load. Sometimes I achieve above expectations, and other times, I struggle to get close, like at the moment, I'm struggling to achieve expected velocities from my .223 But that's life.

Not denying the speed, but questioning the pressure or at least indicating to new reloaders that the speed is achievable when you don’t actually know the pressure.

Those would be good speeds with a creedmoor with its additional 10% capacity, let alone the smaller x47 cartridge.

 

[HandB]

Greetings all! I'm planning on putting in my first variation shortly but I'm having to make decisions on rifles and calibres. Not a bad problem to have, but I'm after some input.

Firstly, I want to do a one for one. I have a Parker Hale in .243 but it's not screw cut. I have found that in the dead of night the muzzle flash is as bright as the sun and it sounds like a cannon going off. As such, I'd like something I can put a moderator on without invoking the wrath of the Parker Hale fan club! I've had a look at some rifles and I think it's going to be a toss up between a Bergara B14, Howa 1500 or Mauser M18. I'm hoping to hear from people who own/have used these particular rifles to figure out which to get. They all felt nice to hold and I did examine the fore end of the Howa to check for flex which was there but needed quite a bit of force to get it to move, so I imagine it will be fine? The rifle will be used for deer (roe) and foxes.

The second rifle will be a new calibre. I want to do some trips to The Forest of Dean after boar and also use it for bigger (fallow) deer. I'm thinking a .30 of some description. I'm going to hand load so ammunition availability isn't too much of a problem but I was thinking .308 or 30-06. .308 seems very popular compared to 30-06. In fact there were two rifles listed on Guntrader within 100 miles and I saw them both sat next to each other in the same rack! It seems there isn't much in it performance wise until heavier bullets are used but reading about both calibres has not helped me come to a decision. Which of these would be best for boar and deer, or is there another calibre that does it better? I'm not set on a .30 per say but it seems to be the best choice for both types of quarry. I will stand correction though!

Lastly, I have an unused moderator slot for the .243. When I do the variation will this stay or will I need to ask for it again? In fact would it just be best to phone the firearms folk?

I think that's all for the minute. I'm going back to the shop tomorrow with the intention of putting a deposit on a .243 then getting the paperwork sent off. I'm a bit reluctant to put a deposit on something else as I may not get it granted.

Thanks in advance!

If you are handloading and willing to consider a 7mm, that is a good option as there are lots of excellent and reasonably priced 7mm bullets available. I own a 7x57 and it is an absolute hammer and easily overshadows my .243. With the 7mm I am averaging 2993fps with 130gr bullets, which is about 200fps more than I get with 100gr bullets in my .243. And if you want even more 7mm power in a short action format then several members on here rate the .284 Winchester and can no doubt guide you on that topic.

 

[7Miller]

Like you I was undecided on a calibre that would cover me for boar, but mainly used for deer and fox. Inhave a slot for a 6.5CM but whilst there is no LEGAL requirement for a .270, it is recommended and to play it safe, I decided on a.....
So I went for the 7mm-08.... The comment I get when speaking to people in gunshops/Gunsmiths is........ "oooh lovely round".

So if home loading that's the one I'd choose.
I do fancy a 6.5PRC though over the creedmoor for the extra velocity etc but have to weigh up barrel life etc.

7mm-08 gets my vote

 

[co’den]

---

As posted above it doesn’t really apply for paid boar shooting in the uk, almost all of which is over bait from a tower. Boar are shot stationary in the brain, a 6.5 or even a .223 will do the job no issue at all.

There is no legal minimum for boar, as you say the .270 is just a recommendation.

Aye, you’re right. However, if you ask for a variation for a rifle to shoot boar from a tower or otherwise, your FEO will likely refer you to the best practice guidance I attached.
It’ll be difficult to argue that 6.5 or 223 will do the job when best practice says minimum .270.
Here’s an extract from the response to my variation request. It’s definitely worth considering if you’re spending money on new kit -

Dear Mr ……….

I am writing with regards to your Variation application you recently submitted. I am working through your application and can see that you have requested a few changes to your Conditions, particularly with regards to Wild Boar. Unfortunately, we do not have a specific Condition solely encompassing just Wild Boar, however I have done some research, and it seems currently Wild Boar have no official status or restrictions, they will come under your General Condition as Lawful Quarry. There is however guidance for shooting ( see link) and please also be aware that your .270 is the minimum calibre needed for use with Wild Boar.

Just to make you aware, currently, no course is needed but I wouldn’t be surprised if this was to change in the future and the same could be said about Boars Status and Restrictions too.

Hope that helps.