Ranging with a fixed S&B 8x56 A7

[Heym SR20]

I must admit that I have a private snigger at some of the people that I take out on the estate here. Range finder required for a less than 150 yards shot, the need to dial up and down before the shot ,using puffer bottle to determine wind direction.
The old boys where we grew up would join us I think in pondering modern methods. Seen them empty a SMLE/MK4 magazine at impala for 7/8 animals on the deck, only the first one stood still the rest pronking as only impala can. Spotlighting crocs with open sights, shooting lion from a machan in the dark with moon sights on a double rifle, flying guineafowl with a 22rf, headshot on snake with 22rf, leopard with a shotgun so you know how close they were!
Different times so these days different methods.

I suppose everything is data driven these days. It’s also driven hugely by range and clay pigeon shooting. And many coming into shooting are first generation shooters. They have not grown up with a gun in their hands, no have innate ability to spot things.

You and I were very lucky. My Pa grew up in Zambia and collected birds eggs. He has a fantastic ability to find birds nests. A flick of a small fly catcher a few hundred yards away, stop and watch it. Going in and out of a fork of a tree - and there is the nest. Or watch a plover get up off a sandy beach, keep your eye on the spot, and there is the nest. I started shooting a pellet gun aged 4, can still feel stinging knees from dry grass, and misery of being told I was too little to go elephant hunting (i was aged about 4). When we left my grandparents had a small farm in suffolk, and with a little BSA Cadet I was constantly shooting rats and starlings around the chicken run. Later on progressed to a Army & Navy 410.

But we have plenty of newcomers starting deer stalking in their 20’s, 30’s, 40’s, 50’s, 60’s and 70’s. Many have little countryside experience.

I think this matters very little, indeed I think it is fantastic that many are coming to fieldsports later in life.

But they typically go through shooting schools and commercial ranges.

Estimating range by counting fence posts, or football pitches, and using the reticles are skills that we learned. But doesn’t result in a £600 sale for a rangefinder. Or Sir, those binoculars you have for birdwatching are ok, but you really need these rangefinding ones by Leica, but first let me show you these image intensifying ones that will show up deer hidden in the woods. And of course those 6x42 scopes are useless - you need a digital scope that talks to your binoculars and phone via bluetooth - even has apple carplay so you can watch Netflix whilst out stalking. As for the rifle - lots of sucking teeth. And the poor chap leaves the Stalking Show with a £20k hole in his bank account.

Then he rocks up to an estate where the stalker can imagine Rex Tarr’s version of this - similar his views on Golf!

 

[Rhodesianjess]

Rex Tarr's version would be worth listening to

 

[JamesH]

If your 72cm @ 100m is correct then working in mil works better in my head and is 7.2 mil

For my 6.5x55 at 100m zero that is 675yd (switch in units I know but I shoot at Bisley on yard ranges). Not much use for deer stalking.

I tend to zero at 200 yd/m for deer and it covers most shots. If a situation comes up for a 250+ shot I’ll only take it if I have time to range, dial and have a good rest.

If my maths is wrong please correct me, I’m sure you will!

 

[tim@tcs]

Having shot one for many years goes roughly like this @300m no matter what calibre you shoot, you’re going to be dropping somewhere between 10 and 15 inches, first of all you need to find out how fast your bullets going with your chosen weight find a ballistics program. I use the hornady one personally and have done for

I only use fixed mag scopes and I find that unless you really honestly know how far away the deer is using the reticle to estimate range is very hit and miss as no two deer are the same size exactly. I used to do a lot of walking and stalking but even knowing the distance to a hedgerow in front of your high seat doesn’t always help!
Experience should inform you of whether or not a shot can be taken and if any hold over is needed.
I’ve tried to get my loads to have a four inch arc from 60 to 260 yards so a dead on aim will do. Life, nature and ballistics don’t always meet up but when they do it’s magical!

 

[Mungo]

I pretty much do the same - I use an S&B 8X56 and find it an excellent stalking scope.

Some years back myself and a mate spotted a big sika stag and we both agreed it was about 120 yards away. I lay down in a gateway to take a shot and the crosshairs were covering more of the chest than I'd expected. I didn't shoot and was of the view there was something not quite right. The following night I stood in the same gateway and ranged the rushes beside where the stag stood and it came out at nearly 300 yards. Clearly there was something about the lie of the ground that fooled both of us but a simple scope and application of the brain saved the day.

These days I think many people want complex (and expensive) gadgets to remove the need for them to think and most marketing seems aimed in this direction offering coats that protect you from every possible condition without you needing to think about what you wear, scopes that will display all the ballistic info on your mobile phone so you don't need to think about wind and distance, bullets that are designed so you don't need to think about wind drift as they are marketed as removing this requirement... The list is endless

Two days ago I made the mistake you avoided here.

Sika calf stood on a forestry track, next to a gate leading out of the wood. I was at the other side of the wood. I was certain the wood was only 100m or so across. Lined up on it. Hmm… looks a bit small in the crosshairs. Must just be a small deer. Shot. Clean miss. Deer looked startled, then ran off. Furious with myself, convinced that either there was something wrong with the scope or my shooting was even more dismal than usual. Walked up to the shot site. Seemed to take rather a long time to get there. Finally realisation dawned. Turned found, ranged to where I’d shot from. Nearer 280m.

 

[caorach]

Two days ago I made the mistake you avoided here.

Sika calf stood on a forestry track, next to a gate leading out of the wood. I was at the other side of the wood. I was certain the wood was only 100m or so across. Lined up on it. Hmm… looks a bit small in the crosshairs. Must just be a small deer. Shot. Clean miss. Deer looked startled, then ran off. Furious with myself, convinced that either there was something wrong with the scope or my shooting was even more dismal than usual. Walked up to the shot site. Seemed to take rather a long time to get there. Finally realisation dawned. Turned found, ranged to where I’d shot from. Nearer 280m.

It is easy done. I'm not at all good at estimating range and find it especially difficult on things like forest tracks. Bigger, or smaller, than normal deer can throw you off as I find a lot of my range estimation is done on the basis of "looks very small," "Looks shootable," and so on. However 99 times out of 100 it works well and most of the other times once the cross hairs of the scope go on the deer you get a good indication of whether you can shoot or not. The truth of the matter is that most people have a fairly good concept of how big the deer they are shooting is going to be and so if they need to aim off they have an idea what this looks like on the body of the deer. There isn't a precise aiming mark on a deer anyhow so all the measuring and calculating and peering at the mobile phone so that your aiming point is calculated to the nearest fraction of an inch is meaningless.

I often wonder how many people enjoy their day out stalking compared to those that seem to turn it into a day of calculations and worries and gadgets, they might as well just go to work if you ask me. I appreciate that it is different for people who do it as an occupation but I'm under no pressure to shoot numbers, go out in bad weather etc. and so my focus is on having a good time.

 

[Mungo]

It is easy done. I'm not at all good at estimating range and find it especially difficult on things like forest tracks. Bigger, or smaller, than normal deer can throw you off as I find a lot of my range estimation is done on the basis of "looks very small," "Looks shootable," and so on. However 99 times out of 100 it works well and most of the other times once the cross hairs of the scope go on the deer you get a good indication of whether you can shoot or not. The truth of the matter is that most people have a fairly good concept of how big the deer they are shooting is going to be and so if they need to aim off they have an idea what this looks like on the body of the deer. There isn't a precise aiming mark on a deer anyhow so all the measuring and calculating and peering at the mobile phone so that your aiming point is calculated to the nearest fraction of an inch is meaningless.

I often wonder how many people enjoy their day out stalking compared to those that seem to turn it into a day of calculations and worries and gadgets, they might as well just go to work if you ask me. I appreciate that it is different for people who do it as an occupation but I'm under no pressure to shoot numbers, go out in bad weather etc. and so my focus is on having a good time.

I struggle most if I’ve been shooting one type of deer for a while, then switch to another.

In this case, I’d been exclusively shooting hill roe for about 9 weeks. They always look tiny, even when you’re stood next to them! So a sika at 300m looks a lot like what I’d been shooting at 100.

Two hours after my miss, I saw sika out in clearfell across a valley. They looked enormous through a x8 scope, but I ranged them to 300. Fortunately, I knew that but if ground well anyway, and knew the rough distance, or else I might well have made the same mistake again.

Shooting across valleys and along forestry tracks really messes with my distance estimation. Added to which I have no depth perception!

 

[tim@tcs]

I have tended to over estimate the distance ending up with shots a bit higher on the deer than I would have preferred but better to over than under!