Thumbhole stocks, are they worth it? (Sako and S&L fans)

[wildfowler.250]

Right folks, here’s my dilemma with the new gun itch.

Currently have a sako 75 in .270. My first CF so had it about 15 years. Not had heavy use at all. I’ve bought a spare mag. The stock is fine but it’s probably the only thing I don’t love about it.

Convinced the old man to get a sako 75 in 6.5x55 a while back. He doesn’t stalk a huge amount and it meant I’ve got another caliber to play with in the same gun. Plus it’s quite a nice, mild caliber for him.

I’ve got a terrible craving for a Schultz and Larsen thumbhole - but I’ve yet to handle one. They also come with an adjustable cheek piece which is appealing.

Now the sako is smooth as silk. Nice action. Good trigger.

Should I spend my money on a kroseg adjustable stock for the sako first, and see how I get on with it? The cheek piece alone appeals. Or scratch the new gun itch and get a S&L.

New stock will probably set me back a grand. New rifle will probably set me back 2.5 which financially doesn’t make extra sense - but the cravings.

If I bed the kroseg with a gunsmith for the .270. Would the bedded stock switch across to the 6.5x55? The action is the same. I assume there’s no gun to gun variation? Or is there?


I need someone to come along and say spend the money on the stock and save the rest for hunting. S&L are rubbish etc. Or they’ve sold a sako and regretted it. Because otherwise I’m very much resisting a new gun purchase.

My head says if the stock will transfer, it may be a cheaper solution to a problem that’s not really a problem. Sometimes you just fancy a change!


Cheers!

 

[Donkey Basher]

I'd stick with the Sako & fit a new stock - I had the same thoughts as you last year but decided to keep my 20+ year old Tikka M595 & put it in an adjustable stock instead.

Re the bedding question, & before anyone with any greater knowledge & skills than me comes along, whether you can switch actions in the same stock is probably going to depend on the type of bedding you do. If you simply install pillars under the action then I would imagine that there will be no issues swapping between rifles. However, if you also 'glass' bed the action then I doubt very much that you'll be able to reliably swap the actions over at will - whilst both actions will have been manufactured to the same dimensions there will be tolerances involved which may make one a couple of thou different to the other in one or more dimension meaning that if you glass bed for the smaller action the larger one won't fit.

I'd still stick with the rifle & get a better stock for it.

 

[freid]

Like you have a 75 .270. The synthetic stock is fine. Plan to put it in a kroseg stock, but just picked up a McMillan stock so will see how I get on with that first.

I’ve handled the S&L stock. Personally I wouldn’t get one - they are v flimsy and could get it to touch the barrel with little pressure. It’s ergonomic, but that’s about it.

The S&L action itself is lovely, but bear in mind its single stack so you won’t be able to top load like you can your Sako.

I’m considering an S&L 8x57 for driven boar, but would be high grade walnut stock on that rifle.

 

[Bavarianbrit]

My neighbours son in law bought a new .270 thumbhole stocked in laminate wood not long after it broke through the big thumbhole and is now bodged up with steel pins and epoxy.

 

[Klenchblaize]

Go for it. I’m only holding back on pressing the deposit on a Gary Cain Thumbhole Sporter as I’ve yet to establish if my 75 is a turkey.

K

 

[Andy - Fish]

I own a S&L Thumbhole. 270 and have regularly used it and had alot of guests use it as well and never had a problem and IMHO I don't consider the stock to be ' v flimsy ' or had a problem with it touching the barrel but each to their own and as usually advised try handling a few different Thumbhole rifles to see if they suit you

 

[wildfowler.250]

I'd stick with the Sako & fit a new stock - I had the same thoughts as you last year but decided to keep my 20+ year old Tikka M595 & put it in an adjustable stock instead.

Re the bedding question, & before anyone with any greater knowledge & skills than me comes along, whether you can switch actions in the same stock is probably going to depend on the type of bedding you do. If you simply install pillars under the action then I would imagine that there will be no issues swapping between rifles. However, if you also 'glass' bed the action then I doubt very much that you'll be able to reliably swap the actions over at will - whilst both actions will have been manufactured to the same dimensions there will be tolerances involved which may make one a couple of thou different to the other in one or more dimension meaning that if you glass bed for the smaller action the larger one won't fit.

I'd still stick with the rifle & get a better stock for it.

Thanks! I hadn’t thought about the different types of bedding either. Nor do I know which is better. Perhaps @Ronin might be able to advise.

Like you have a 75 .270. The synthetic stock is fine. Plan to put it in a kroseg stock, but just picked up a McMillan stock so will see how I get on with that first.

I’ve handled the S&L stock. Personally I wouldn’t get one - they are v flimsy and could get it to touch the barrel with little pressure. It’s ergonomic, but that’s about it.

The S&L action itself is lovely, but bear in mind its single stack so you won’t be able to top load like you can your Sako.

I’m considering an S&L 8x57 for driven boar, but would be high grade walnut stock on that rifle.

The single stack is a shame. I think you’ll enjoy the McMillan. The marble stocks are lovely.

My neighbours son in law bought a new .270 thumbhole stocked in laminate wood not long after it broke through the big thumbhole and is now bodged up with steel pins and epoxy.

Well I suppose it is a weak point. I thought it may give a better trigger grip though.

Go for it. I’m only holding back on pressing the deposit on a Gary Cain Thumbhole Sporter as I’ve yet to establish if my 75 is a turkey.

K

In what way? Shot out? To be fair, a new barrel is 1200 at a ball park and with the price of even basic rifles, keeping them seems to make sense.

Not heard of Gary Cain. Will look into it.

I own a S&L Thumbhole. 270 and have regularly used it and had alot of guests use it as well and never had a problem and IMHO I don't consider the stock to be ' v flimsy ' or had a problem with it touching the barrel but each to their own and as usually advised try handling a few different Thumbhole rifles to see if they suit you

Yeah I’ll have to go out of my way to try one as not many retailers around but good to hear you like them!

 

[Heym SR20]

Thumbhole stocks are love and hate type of thing. I like the idea of them, and likes of Cochise Thumbhole do look pretty cool.

However when I have used a thumbhole I find them pretty uncomfortable.

With a conventional grip the recoil goes past your hand and into the shoulder, whereas with a thumbhole it goes straight into your hand, which can be pretty uncomfortable. A palm swell also feels great in the hand, until you shoot with any recoil, and again its why big game rifles tend not have palm swells or thumbholes. A nice thickness to the grip, yes, but a surface to transfer recoil to your hand.

Stock shape and style is very much a personal thing, and its one handling a stock / rifle and dry firing it but its totally another to actually use it, and shoot multiple cartridges through it.

 

[HonestJohn]

Shot the S&L thumb hole quite a few times now. Forend very flimsy, torque bipod and it throws shots. Cheek riser interferes with bolt removal to check barrel obstructions, so you have to lower and raise to different heights each time. Low mounted scope catch cases on extraction and dump them in the magazine weld

Beautiful rifles, **** poor execution

 

[John Gryphon]

Once you start using a TH stock you will readily enjoy the functionality.
My .220 Swift bedded in a Boyds circa 15 years ago.

 

[freid]

Shot the S&L thumb hole quite a few times now. Forend very flimsy, torque bipod and it throws shots. Cheek riser interferes with bolt removal to check barrel obstructions, so you have to lower and raise to different heights each time. Low mounted scope catch cases on extraction and dump them in the magazine weld

Beautiful rifles, **** poor execution

Interestingly I went to see a well know S&L dealer, and when I mentioned how much movement there was in the stock, and how easily it can touch the barrel, I was told that S&L knew about, and stressed that ever with the stock touching the barrel they promised it would still shoot to the same POA. I was dubious, so walked away.

On the cheek riser I also noticed that it had a lot of free play back and forth.

The whole thing just felt cheap, but on its own is an extra £900 for the stock…!

That said, I appreciate there will be lots of people who have them, love them and have had no problems. I’ve seen synthetic stocks from the same manufacturer - some stuff some flimsy for the exact same product.

Back to the OP, As always go and see and test a few for yourself to decide if it feels right for you.

To add, nothing against S&L rifles and will probably end up with one in my battery, but it won’t be a synthetic one.

 

[Border]

Forget the new gun itch. A new rifle won’t do anything that the old one wouldn’t.
The SAKO 75 is a great rifle, period. As are earlier SAKOs and Tikkas.
If you must, change the stock if it scratches the itch.
KKC also do a thumbhole version , inlet for M75, if that floats your boat.

 

[wildfowler.250]

Thumbhole stocks are love and hate type of thing. I like the idea of them, and likes of Cochise Thumbhole do look pretty cool.

However when I have used a thumbhole I find them pretty uncomfortable.

With a conventional grip the recoil goes past your hand and into the shoulder, whereas with a thumbhole it goes straight into your hand, which can be pretty uncomfortable. A palm swell also feels great in the hand, until you shoot with any recoil, and again its why big game rifles tend not have palm swells or thumbholes. A nice thickness to the grip, yes, but a surface to transfer recoil to your hand.

Stock shape and style is very much a personal thing, and its one handling a stock / rifle and dry firing it but its totally another to actually use it, and shoot multiple cartridges through it.

Thanks! Thats the beauty of asking on here is that I hadn’t considered a difference in recoil.
Agree with the trial. Easier said than done unless the shop has second hand rifles and a range like ivythron. I tend to rely quite heavily on reviews on here

Shot the S&L thumb hole quite a few times now. Forend very flimsy, torque bipod and it throws shots. Cheek riser interferes with bolt removal to check barrel obstructions, so you have to lower and raise to different heights each time. Low mounted scope catch cases on extraction and dump them in the magazine weld

Beautiful rifles, **** poor execution

That’s a couple now that have critiqued the stock. Which is a shame because they’re a good bit cheaper than the sako 90 and blaser equivalents .

Once you start using a TH stock you will readily enjoy the functionality.
My .220 Swift bedded in a Boyds circa 15 years ago.

View attachment 350515

Very nice! Sadly limited in older sako options

Interestingly I went to see a well know S&L dealer, and when I mentioned how much movement there was in the stock, and how easily it can touch the barrel, I was told that S&L knew about, and stressed that ever with the stock touching the barrel they promised it would still shoot to the same POA. I was dubious, so walked away.

On the cheek riser I also noticed that it had a lot of free play back and forth.

The whole thing just felt cheap, but on its own is an extra £900 for the stock…!

That said, I appreciate there will be lots of people who have them, love them and have had no problems. I’ve seen synthetic stocks from the same manufacturer - some stuff some flimsy for the exact same product.

Back to the OP, As always go and see and test a few for yourself to decide if it feels right for you.

To add, nothing against S&L rifles and will probably end up with one in my battery, but it won’t be a synthetic one.

That’s my main worry. I don’t want to fork out 2.5k on something that isn’t well put together. I’d rather buy a tikka and stick a pse on it at that point.

Forget the new gun itch. A new rifle won’t do anything that the old one wouldn’t.
The SAKO 75 is a great rifle, period. As are earlier SAKOs and Tikkas.
If you must, change the stock if it scratches the itch.
KKC also do a thumbhole version , inlet for M75, if that floats your boat.

I think this is probably the sensible route. I’m not too fond of the kkc looks but I could stick a kroseg on it. Scratches the new gun itch. I’ll still have the old stock if I prefer it. And I can put a new barrel on it as needed.

Bit boring if I pop my clogs with the same rifle I bought when I started out with but maybe that’s a sign of quality

 

[HonestJohn]

I think PSE do the aftermarket stocks for S&L, that would be my choice - the rifles, barrels and actions are fantastic. Let down by stock design and the single stack protruding mag, very uncomfortable to stalk with as it digs into your back when you swing the rifle far onto your back instead of swinging under your arm

 

[Craigsaun]

I would go for the new stock , it will look and feel like a new rifle . I was in your position when I had two tikkas, I hated the stock but loved the action, I ended up buying two Boyd’s stocks it was a transformation. Don’t rule out Boyd’s they are well made and very reasonable price, had them for 10years stalked in all weather no issues and they are still going strong

 

[tusker]

I have a Boyds thumbhole stock on my 270.I love it . It has been on the 270 for about 10 ears now and has been to Finland, Estonia and Namibia without any problems.
I also had a CZ 243 with a Boyds Thumbhole it is now with my nephew we both love it.
Tusker

 

[arrybash]

It may be the availability of a suitable replacement stock could be the deciding factor. I have sako 85's and concluded there are very few stock alternatives.

 

[Ronin]

Thumbhole

The clue in the name - the stock captivates the thumb making bolt cycling slooooow

You have to release grip, remove thumb and hand from the “hole” sufficiently to cycle the bolt and re grip to then set up for follow up or second shot

I’ve had them - used a Manners thumbhole for a few years but found it exactly as I’ve described above

However, I’ve built several rifles for clients using McMillan Lazzeroni and Boyd’s thumb hole stocks in previous years / though this style does not appear to be as popular now

It is interesting that several manufactures now offer rifles with such stocks (blaser, Shultz larsen et al)

Should you buy an aftermarket stock for the Sako 75

Well the carbon stocks mentioned do look nice,,,BUT other than the adjustable cheek piece do they offer any benefit over the stabdard Sako stock

All the Sako designs I can see have traditional pistol grip

Yet some Tikka options offer vertical pistol grip which are an improvement and do enhance accuracy in terms of hand and trigger finger position

Person preference prevails here

Bedding - Sako 75 requires pillar bedding with the forward pillar milling to accept the bolt in recoil lug at the base of the action

With my ocd head on there will be minor differences bettween two Sako 75 actions of the same action length

They may be small tolerance differences but if you are torquing the action down to 45-60 inch pounds then this will cause the action to flex

Any flex in the action will cause point of impact shift down range

Again I wouldn’t recommend having one stock and swapping actions between it

I’m not saying that because I want work (i don’t, it’s coming out my ears)

you don’t want to cause unnecessary flex in the action or stock

Neither are conducive to consistent accuracy

 

[wildfowler.250]

Thumbhole

The clue in the name - the stock captivates the thumb making bolt cycling slooooow

You have to release grip, remove thumb and hand from the “hole” sufficiently to cycle the bolt and re grip to then set up for follow up or second shot

I’ve had them - used a Manners thumbhole for a few years but found it exactly as I’ve described above

However, I’ve built several rifles for clients using McMillan Lazzeroni and Boyd’s thumb hole stocks in previous years / though this style does not appear to be as popular now

It is interesting that several manufactures now offer rifles with such stocks (blaser, Shultz larsen et al)

Should you buy an aftermarket stock for the Sako 75

Well the carbon stocks mentioned do look nice,,,BUT other than the adjustable cheek piece do they offer any benefit over the stabdard Sako stock

All the Sako designs I can see have traditional pistol grip

Yet some Tikka options offer vertical pistol grip which are an improvement and do enhance accuracy in terms of hand and trigger finger position

Person preference prevails here

Bedding - Sako 75 requires pillar bedding with the forward pillar milling to accept the bolt in recoil lug at the base of the action

With my ocd head on there will be minor differences bettween two Sako 75 actions of the same action length

They may be small tolerance differences but if you are torquing the action down to 45-60 inch pounds then this will cause the action to flex

Any flex in the action will cause point of impact shift down range

Again I wouldn’t recommend having one stock and swapping actions between it

I’m not saying that because I want work (i don’t, it’s coming out my ears)

you don’t want to cause unnecessary flex in the action or stock

Neither are conducive to consistent accuracy

Thanks! Very informative. I hadn’t realised they slow the reloading down? Must be fractions of a second in it? Interesting none the less.

You’re right it’s a lot of money for a stock where a Kalix teknik cheek riser would do the same thing. It’s probably more stupid aesthetics but when you get them cravings..

Really interesting about the bedding. I was thinking more along the lines of , if I buy a stock for my 75 .270 IV and get bored of the rifle, can I transfer it onto the old man’s 6.5x55 75 IV even after it’s been bedded? Just trying to minimise loss of I change my mind on it.


Thanks again for all the replies folks. Different opinions but that’s why it’s worth asking

 

[Steff]

Look at where precision shooters place their thumbs. On the side or the top, not around.
The (more) vertical position of the pistol grip is one thing, a thumbhole is another. They are currently very popular. But to me this is only because inexperienced people jump on it, not because they are better.

The same applies to adjustable raised check pieces. In most cases they are just BS. As long as you have a firm and defined contact with your yaw bone all is good. It doesn‘t have to squeeze up the flesh on your cheek.