Why are we shooting less and less

[nun_hunter]

Todays youth are too woke and easily offended to go out in the field and control wildlife.

More likely is that they don't want to go out in the countryside with a bunch of old men who do nothing but moan about the youth of today while simultaneously treating them like a slave while they decide if they're worthy of being passed down their great wisdom of country life

 

[Nickb]

More likely is that they don't want to go out in the countryside with a bunch of old men who do nothing but moan about the youth of today while simultaneously treating them like a slave while they decide if they're worthy of being passed down their great wisdom of country life

Whilst they decide their gender and sexuality before considering if the animal to be dispatched is offended by this

 

[south-nofolk-stalker]

Don't cancel him again. He's one of the few on here that make any sense.

You’ll make me blush

 

[sikamalc]

Apologies malc but at what point have I not said any thats not the truth?

Others don’t want to say it, but I will.

I am not disagreeing with you Lee, but we are going over the same ground all the time.

Yes more deer need to be shot, especially Fallow and Muntjac. But, its never going to be easy to make sure every area is covered. Too many if, but's and maybe's. There are a lot of people who don't shoot enough, and have huge areas to maintain, but its also in many instances not as easy as one might think.

You yourself have a problem with the next door not allowing the Red deer to be culled. And that is common across the whole of the UK. Areas where you cannot stalk, or the landowner wants you there 24/7, or his cousin shoots it once a year, or its a protected area, or its a wood owned by some old lady who likes to see the deer. I could go on. Over the past 45 years of my stalking, I have, like many seen all sorts of reasons.

At days end you can only do so much, and some of these so called syndicates are a bit of a joke as well. I know for a fact that a well known syndicate has recently lost a number of places. One in particular because they were all pilling on there to shoot over a couple of hundred acres, leaving machinery in a mess and leaving guts and legs everywhere.

Whether the government do something about the numbers of deer, I cannot see that happening anytime soon. They are to worried about loosing their seats at the moment. I would be more concerned about the anti hunting shooting Labour party getting in and clamping down more on firearm ownership. Mind even this lot in at the moment have done us no favours.

There all bloody idiots as far as I'm concerned.

 

[south-nofolk-stalker]

I am not disagreeing with you Lee, but we are going over the same ground all the time.

Yes more deer need to be shot, especially Fallow and Muntjac. But, its never going to be easy to make sure every area is covered. Too many if, but's and maybe's. There are a lot of people who don't shoot enough, and have huge areas to maintain, but its also in many instances not as easy as one might think.

You yourself have a problem with the next door not allowing the Red deer to be culled. And that is common across the whole of the UK. Areas where you cannot stalk, or the landowner wants you there 24/7, or his cousin shoots it once a year, or its a protected area, or its a wood owned by some old lady who likes to see the deer. I could go on. Over the past 45 years of my stalking, I have, like many seen all sorts of reasons.

At days end you can only do so much, and some of these so called syndicates are a bit of a joke as well. I know for a fact that a well known syndicate has recently lost a number of places. One in particular because they were all pilling on there to shoot over a couple of hundred acres, leaving machinery in a mess and leaving guts and legs everywhere.

Whether the government do something about the numbers of deer, I cannot see that happening anytime soon. They are to worried about loosing their seats at the moment. I would be more concerned about the anti hunting shooting Labour party getting in and clamping down more on firearm ownership. Mind even this lot in at the moment have done us no favours.

There all bloody idiots as far as I'm concerned.

Well said Malcom, certainly troubled times ahead.

 

[User00047]

Maybe the BASC could run a course to train existing hunters on ways to safely and properly help train more hunters?

Also I like the idea of “rod and gun clubs”
Like they have in America. With an actual building where the members can go and socialise etc.

 

[stevec]

Maybe the BASC could run a course to train existing hunters on ways to safely and properly help train more hunters?

Also I like the idea of “rod and gun clubs”
Like they have in America. With an actual building where the members can go and socialise etc.

I have seen those clubhouses in Germany as well.

 

[StephenToast]

I am not disagreeing with you Lee, but we are going over the same ground all the time.

Yes more deer need to be shot, especially Fallow and Muntjac. But, its never going to be easy to make sure every area is covered. Too many if, but's and maybe's. There are a lot of people who don't shoot enough, and have huge areas to maintain, but its also in many instances not as easy as one might think.

You yourself have a problem with the next door not allowing the Red deer to be culled. And that is common across the whole of the UK. Areas where you cannot stalk, or the landowner wants you there 24/7, or his cousin shoots it once a year, or its a protected area, or its a wood owned by some old lady who likes to see the deer. I could go on. Over the past 45 years of my stalking, I have, like many seen all sorts of reasons.

At days end you can only do so much, and some of these so called syndicates are a bit of a joke as well. I know for a fact that a well known syndicate has recently lost a number of places. One in particular because they were all pilling on there to shoot over a couple of hundred acres, leaving machinery in a mess and leaving guts and legs everywhere.

Whether the government do something about the numbers of deer, I cannot see that happening anytime soon. They are to worried about loosing their seats at the moment. I would be more concerned about the anti hunting shooting Labour party getting in and clamping down more on firearm ownership. Mind even this lot in at the moment have done us no favours.

There all bloody idiots as far as I'm concerned.

Sites like this and people like you are the part of the problem.

You actively stifle discussion about shooting more deer.

Lee started a poll about shooting females out of season and you deleted it.

 

[south-nofolk-stalker]

Sites like this and people like you are the part of the problem.

You actively stifle discussion about shooting more deer.

Lee started a poll about shooting females out of season and you deleted it.

I do understand where malc is coming from, and I am very black and white and it might come across offensive to others as this is a public forum, unfortunately it’s not friendly reading but it’s truthful

 

[TheEngineer]

People would get out and hunt if they had access to land.

Here in Ireland there is a public bidding system annually for sporting rights in state owned forestry plantations. Whilst I believe this bidding systems should be done away with and replaced with a free access for all system, it does at least give people who might otherwise not have access to land (city dwellers, don't know landowners in the country, etc.) a place to shoot. The number of deer hunting licenses issued here has gone from 300 odd in the 1970s to over 6,000 last year.

I've never hunted in the UK but all the talk on here of DSC1s, management plans/ cull plans, clients, deer managers having X land and Y land tied up - to an outsider it all looks like hunting infrastructure is very much designed around "getting in" and concentrating high volume deer shooting into hands of a small few managers/ contractors or expensive syndicates rather than really getting fresh blood into the sport.

I don't know is that the fault of these managers and syndicates or are they just a symptom of a system where land is property rather than an at least semi public amenity. I believe (based on absolutely zero evidence mind you) that deer numbers could be managed exclusively by recreational hunters if there was a kind of "right to hunt" similar to a right to roam in areas with high numbers of deer. This could managed with a "check in/ check out" system similar to what has been rolled out here for the national forests here. It's never going to happen but I don't think sustainable deer hunting is possible given the way land seems to be currently managed in the UK (purely based on what I read on here).

We are also dealing with high deer numbers here in Ireland but thankfully getting access to privately owned land here is a lot more laissez faire - I don't know of any landowners charging for hunting rights, be that deer or game and have never been refused hunting permission because "someone else has it taken". On more than one occasion I have taken wrong directions and ended up on the wrong land only for the actual landowner to come up and tell me to shoot away to my hearts content. Does that happen in the UK?

If there was a kind of overall national governing body for deer syndicates that could act as a reference point for putting would-be stalkers into local syndicates with land permission (similar to the way the NARGC works for game shooting clubs in Ireland), I feel like that would at least give people a place to start when they google "how to get in to deer stalking".

As for all this talk of the younger generation, some grumpy old fascists in this thread need to take a look in the mirror at those who raised them! It's folks like you that give country sports a negative and elitist reputation. This is a direct cause of your sport being regulated out of existence by your democratic representatives!

This post has turned into a bit of a general rant but to summarise shooting needs (in my opinion);
- Better public access to hunting land in favour of deer managers or contractors
- A deer shooting org (either new or using the framework of an already existing organisation) that can put would-be hunters in local clubs or syndicates
- For people to be nice to each other!

 

[sikamalc]

Sites like this and people like you are the part of the problem.

You actively stifle discussion about shooting more deer.

Lee started a poll about shooting females out of season and you deleted it.

Oh really.
Then leave the site then. Moderating this site is not an easy task. All three owners of this site have given away and helped many people. It's up to us to moderate our site. If your not happy with our decisions. Leave.

 

[StephenToast]

Oh really.
Then leave the site then. Moderating this site is not an easy task. All three owners of this site have given away and helped many people. It's up to us to moderate our site. If your not happy with our decisions. Leave.

If it's that hard a task you could leave just as easily as me.

I think it needs saying. You repeatedly stop threads that discuss ways to cull more deer. You closed the shoot more deer thread and a while ago one about the use of drones.

The poll about shooting females out of season was relevant and had potential to be a useful discussion. Especially off the back of the removal of the season for males in Scotland and the potential changes after the Defra consultation in England. There was no need to close it just because you don't like the idea.

You also repeatedly dismiss the notion that there are too many deer or more need to be shot, changing seasons, night shooting etc.

There will always be a cross section of interests on a site like this but you are actively silencing the people at one end of the argument.

 

[sikamalc]

Why should I leave a site that I own ? Not likely.
Another poll on shooting female deer was irrelevant. What would it prove. Nothing. It would just prolong another argument between a few on here.

I have not dismissed the fact that more deer in some parts of the UK need culling more. What I have drawn to peoples attention is that its not as straight forward at times to find a solution.
I do not like the idea of an extended stag season in Scotland, that's a fact. It will have little or no impact on deer numbers.

Whether you like it or not, the site is moderated by the owners of this site. And you have the right to leave at anytime.
Obviously you think this is not the site for you so please let Admin know and we will cancel your membership.

Thank you.

 

[StephenToast]

Why should I leave a site that own ? Not likely.
Another poll on shooting female deer was irrelevant. What would it prove. Nothing. It would just prolong another argument between a few on here.

I have not dismissed the fact that more deer in some parts of the UK need culling more. What I have drawn to peoples attention is that its not as straight forward at times to find a solution.
I do not like the idea of an extended stag season in Scotland, that's a fact. It will have little or no impact on deer numbers.

Whether you like it or not, the site is moderated by the owners of this site. And you have the right to leave at anytime.
Obviously you think this is not the site for you so please let Admin know and we will cancel your membership.

Thank you.

The poll was absolutely relevent but you didn't like it so you cancelled it. You are ignorant of the problem and are perpetuating the situation with deer in the UK.

Go ahead and cancel me. I've got nothing to gain from this shower of ****.

 

[Mungo]

People would get out and hunt if they had access to land.

Here in Ireland there is a public bidding system annually for sporting rights in state owned forestry plantations. Whilst I believe this bidding systems should be done away with and replaced with a free access for all system, it does at least give people who might otherwise not have access to land (city dwellers, don't know landowners in the country, etc.) a place to shoot. The number of deer hunting licenses issued here has gone from 300 odd in the 1970s to over 6,000 last year.

I've never hunted in the UK but all the talk on here of DSC1s, management plans/ cull plans, clients, deer managers having X land and Y land tied up - to an outsider it all looks like hunting infrastructure is very much designed around "getting in" and concentrating high volume deer shooting into hands of a small few managers/ contractors or expensive syndicates rather than really getting fresh blood into the sport.

I don't know is that the fault of these managers and syndicates or are they just a symptom of a system where land is property rather than an at least semi public amenity. I believe (based on absolutely zero evidence mind you) that deer numbers could be managed exclusively by recreational hunters if there was a kind of "right to hunt" similar to a right to roam in areas with high numbers of deer. This could managed with a "check in/ check out" system similar to what has been rolled out here for the national forests here. It's never going to happen but I don't think sustainable deer hunting is possible given the way land seems to be currently managed in the UK (purely based on what I read on here).

We are also dealing with high deer numbers here in Ireland but thankfully getting access to privately owned land here is a lot more laissez faire - I don't know of any landowners charging for hunting rights, be that deer or game and have never been refused hunting permission because "someone else has it taken". On more than one occasion I have taken wrong directions and ended up on the wrong land only for the actual landowner to come up and tell me to shoot away to my hearts content. Does that happen in the UK?

If there was a kind of overall national governing body for deer syndicates that could act as a reference point for putting would-be stalkers into local syndicates with land permission (similar to the way the NARGC works for game shooting clubs in Ireland), I feel like that would at least give people a place to start when they google "how to get in to deer stalking".

As for all this talk of the younger generation, some grumpy old fascists in this thread need to take a look in the mirror at those who raised them! It's folks like you that give country sports a negative and elitist reputation. This is a direct cause of your sport being regulated out of existence by your democratic representatives!

This post has turned into a bit of a general rant but to summarise shooting needs (in my opinion);
- Better public access to hunting land in favour of deer managers or contractors
- A deer shooting org (either new or using the framework of an already existing organisation) that can put would-be hunters in local clubs or syndicates
- For people to be nice to each other!

Forestry and Land Scotland are trialling public access culling in a few places.

It’s a nice idea, but the fear is that private individuals lack the equipment, resilience and ability to be effective in areas with large numbers, difficult terrain and long extraction distances.

 

[Reloader708]

In my experience, being the owner of a teenager who has lots of teenage friends; generally they arnt interested!! Not just the traditional feild sports has we know them but in all things.
Look at most hobbies and interests, they're nearly all in decline, even pubs! Younger people don't go to the pub! They don't shoot or fix old cars up, or anything. I don't think it's shooting in particular where the average age of the participants is getting older and fewer!
Interestingly the forestry company I work for as just embarked on its annual most challenging task, trying to find a forestry student for the next year....they don't exist!! It seems everyone working in forestry keeps getting older, even the stalker!

 

[south-nofolk-stalker]

Let’s face it, we are shooting less because it’s a ball ache!

It’s a ball ache to get ground
It’s a ball ache to get the S/G FAC certification
The overall cost is a ball ache

In reality the 95%of the young are not interested

As hobby stalkers / deer managers we are expected to pay to do a job that we should be paid to do. (Syndicates)

Why bother?

I won’t be in 41/2 years time, when my tickets are up, I am done.

Between family and work, I am going to spend my time fishing and sailing, less hassle and far less political

 

[EssexBigMac]

Let’s face it, we are shooting less because it’s a ball ache!

It’s a ball ache to get ground
It’s a ball ache to get the S/G FAC certification
The overall cost is a ball ache

As hobby stalkers / deer managers we are expected to pay to do a job that we should be paid to do.

Why bother?

I won’t be in 41/2 years time, when my tickets are up, I am done.

Between family and work, I am going to spend my time fishing and sailing.

***pending 60,000 members incoming messages to ask you for your permissions ***
I am a hobby stalker and still enjoy going to different locations and general control of vermin. I have friends who have shot too much and lost the love for it. I fully get their feelings after 20+years of feeling like a chore rather than what they enjoy anymore.
@sikamalc and @StephenToast now now gentlemen we have enough people against us as a community, we do not need infighting. You both have valid points however it is a public forum and needs some control.

 

[south-nofolk-stalker]

***pending 60,000 members incoming messages to ask you for your permissions ***

already handed the vast majority away to friends, who within the time frame of November to now have just gained another 500 acres next door because the bloke who had it got turfed off

I’m down to my last 500 that will see me out and even better I can just walk out the gate

 

[sikamalc]

The poll was absolutely relevent but you didn't like it so you cancelled it. You are ignorant of the problem and are perpetuating the situation with deer in the UK.

Go ahead and cancel me. I've got nothing to gain from this shower of ****.

I'm perpetuating the situation of deer not being shot well that gave me a good laugh this morning. I've seen some crap written on here, but that's in the top 10. I am so thankful that you seem to think I have that much influence and can stop deer stalkers shooting more deer on their land Jesus!!

Your wish is granted, bye.