south-nofolk-stalker
Well-Known Member
Take a chill pill, what will be, will be!
If the powers that be say crack on, if you don’t contractors will.
The way I see things going, you either jump on the wagon or get left behind
Will it stop (Red Deer Season Change)
- Thread starter David Barker
- Start date
If the powers that be say crack on, if you don’t contractors will.
The way I see things going, you either jump on the wagon or get left behind
David Barker
Well-Known Member
Firstly i don't get stressed lol. I also don't care one bit if Contractors take over. I have enough shooting and give much away. If you think the Scottish government have enough contractors to shoot a further 50.000 deer its you that needs to chill do the math,s 20,000,000 mil just killing deer at the moment 32,000. They would need to spend a further 30,000,000. I will sit back with my feet up and cull what i want. I cannot understand the mentality of Rec stalkers from southern England telling us to kill more deer.
That is a fair comment.. I cannot understand the mentality of Rec stalkers from southern England telling us to kill more deer.
Will it stop? No and it never should, the approach to everything in life, including deer management, is ever changing. As it should be as the environment changes around us
In the grand scheme of things it's not that many years since there were no Deer seasons and they had little protection.
There is possibly a case to be made that we have become to sensitive about deer management. Do we worry about seasons for rabbits, foxes or many other species.
In the grand scheme of things it's not that many years since there were no Deer seasons and they had little protection.
There is possibly a case to be made that we have become to sensitive about deer management. Do we worry about seasons for rabbits, foxes or many other species.
Freeforester
Well-Known Member
The perennial statement that ‘deer numbers are at an all time high’ is somewhat nebulous: are we meant to take this to mean red deer on open hill, where NatureScot have had the associated Deer Management Groups under a watchful eye (and often more) for years, and seem to be on the whole fairly content with deer numbers over most watershed areas, or is it perhaps the increasing numbers of roe deer in peri-urban environments, or woodland deer within the National Forest Estate, or some other? Can the statement be elaborated upon, even validated?
Who is pushing the statement, and where is the evidence to the effect, if not on the open hill? Who or what is the determining factor concerning what the ‘acceptable carrying capacity’ of any particular type of land-use block or watershed, and how is this determined, quantified and verified? The ‘why’ cannot really be homed in on without some specific information. Is the socio-economic model of a balanced and sustainable harvest of either venison and/or sport or trophy animals no longer acceptable?
In order to address a problem, it does tend to save time, effort and expense to locate and quantify it in the first instance. The carrying capacity per acre of eg sheep for either a meat crop or for breeding same on the uplands is generally possible to determine within reason; why would not a similar formula not apply to deer? Is sporting ‘traditional’ type deer stalking with attendant downstream activity for the local rural economy no longer a lawful or legitimate land use? No animal lives on snow and rock alone as a diet, so what level of grazing on the respective land-use types is deemed to be acceptable, and who decides this? If the food source is able to support a reasonable number of deer without ‘undue negative impact’, surely all is as it should be, whereas of there is a clearly identifiable habitat problem despite already low numbers, what then - are both areas of land to be accorded the same broad-brush designation?
A stalker acquaintance recently related to me a story of another who was called out to despatch a road accident-injured hind. Having done the deed, he opened up the old girl, and opened the placenta, whereupon the calf struggled to rise to its feet. I have no means of verifying the incident, but who can say there is no issue to consider? Those who hold the deer in respect and upon which their livelihood may depend upon managing often have a different view on the aspects of welfare that others, with perhaps different agendas or views, and whose conscience may not be so intimately involved, ‘seasoned killers’ may they be or otherwise. The hand with the knife tends to have the eye on the task required of it also, and all that goes with it.
Who is pushing the statement, and where is the evidence to the effect, if not on the open hill? Who or what is the determining factor concerning what the ‘acceptable carrying capacity’ of any particular type of land-use block or watershed, and how is this determined, quantified and verified? The ‘why’ cannot really be homed in on without some specific information. Is the socio-economic model of a balanced and sustainable harvest of either venison and/or sport or trophy animals no longer acceptable?
In order to address a problem, it does tend to save time, effort and expense to locate and quantify it in the first instance. The carrying capacity per acre of eg sheep for either a meat crop or for breeding same on the uplands is generally possible to determine within reason; why would not a similar formula not apply to deer? Is sporting ‘traditional’ type deer stalking with attendant downstream activity for the local rural economy no longer a lawful or legitimate land use? No animal lives on snow and rock alone as a diet, so what level of grazing on the respective land-use types is deemed to be acceptable, and who decides this? If the food source is able to support a reasonable number of deer without ‘undue negative impact’, surely all is as it should be, whereas of there is a clearly identifiable habitat problem despite already low numbers, what then - are both areas of land to be accorded the same broad-brush designation?
A stalker acquaintance recently related to me a story of another who was called out to despatch a road accident-injured hind. Having done the deed, he opened up the old girl, and opened the placenta, whereupon the calf struggled to rise to its feet. I have no means of verifying the incident, but who can say there is no issue to consider? Those who hold the deer in respect and upon which their livelihood may depend upon managing often have a different view on the aspects of welfare that others, with perhaps different agendas or views, and whose conscience may not be so intimately involved, ‘seasoned killers’ may they be or otherwise. The hand with the knife tends to have the eye on the task required of it also, and all that goes with it.
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