BASC to remove "Legal Expenses Cover" wef 31 July 2020

[Roestalker39]

I could be wrong but BASC only introduced legal expenses a few years ago? And you are all now leaving it in droves because they are now withdrawing a provision which many members did not have for a long time anyway? Maybe after a few years they decided that the legal expenses cover was just not value for money? I believe SD members were joining SACS a few years ago because their main selling point was they provided LEI whereas BASC did’nt. then SACS quielty dropped LEI, now BASC are doing the same. Did you all leave SACS when they ditched LEI. this post could be complete bollox if my memory serves me wrong, but I just cannot be bothered to trawl back through SD and use google etc. Anyway I,m sticking with BASC.

Aye still pocketing the money though aren’t they ? Stick with basc mate you deserve everything you get

 

[Roestalker39]

Combined with the reluctance to challenge and lack of robust action, I find this decision incredible. As a member of many years standing, I take no pleasure in feeling vindicated that I have not renewed my membership. Sad situation, possibly disastrous.

Noooooo don’t Bash them they’re our best hope

 

[terrier1]

In that case I'm glad I didn't disappoint

You don't like BASC? Fine. I'm not too keen on it either but I'm prepared to accept that there are some good people working there.

Perhaps, just like politicians, we get the shooting organisations we collectively deserve?

maybe all the good working people should rise up and get the village idiots who are making these changes OUT.

 

[mudman]

Aye still pocketing the money though aren’t they ? Stick with basc mate you deserve everything you get

Pocketing the money? What do you think they are doing with it, divvying up into brown paper envelopes and shar8n* it among themselves?

 

[enfieldspares]

Has the invoice of 2020-2021 for hosting a day's pheasant shooting for a number of MPs landed on the doormat at Marford Mill?

Remember this I posted a while back? Can any BASC Member ask how much is being spent this year 2020-2021?


Geoffrey Clifton-Brown MP

£741 + £800 + £772 + £772 + £825 = £3910

Gifts, benefits and hospitality (UK)
Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor : Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: supper, bed and breakfast, and one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, Derbyshire, 16 December 2012; total value £741.60
Date of receipt of donation: 16 December 2012
Date of acceptance of donation: 16 December 2012
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society, No 28488R

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor : Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting and supper, bed and breakfast at Catton Hall, Derbyshire; total value £800.50
Date of receipt of donation: 13 December 2013
Date of acceptance of donation: 13 December 2013
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society, No 28488R

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting and one night’s accommodation at Hoar Cross Hall Hotel Staffordshire; total value £772
Date received: 17 December 2015
Date accepted: 17 December 2015
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 21 December 2015)

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, South Derbyshire and one night’s accommodation at Hoar Cross Hall Hotel Staffordshire; total value £772
Date of receipt of donation: 16 December 2016
Date of acceptance of donation: 16 December 2016
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 19 December 2016)

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting and one night’s hospitality, total value £825.45
Date received: 15 December 2017
Date accepted: 15 December 2017
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 08 January 2018)



Wiggin, Bill MP (North Herefordshire)

£825 + £953 = £1778

Gifts, benefits and hospitality from UK sources
Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, South Derbyshire and one night’s accommodation; total value £825.45
Date of receipt of donation: 15 December 2017
Date of acceptance of donation: 15 December 2017
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 09 January 2018)

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, South Derbyshire and one night’s accommodation; total value £953
Date received: 24-25 September 2018
Date accepted: 24 September 2018
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 30 October 2018)



Brady, Sir Graham MP (Altrincham and Sale West)

£826 + £825 = £1651

Gifts, benefits and hospitality from UK sources

Name of Donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, South Derbyshire and one night’s accommodation at Hoar Cross Hall Hotel Staffordshire: total £826.73
Date of receipt of donation: 16 December 2016
Date of acceptance of donation: 16 December 2016
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 23 December 2016; updated 10 January 2017)

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, South Derbyshire and one night’s accommodation at Hoar Cross Hall Hotel, Staffordshire: £825.45 in total
Date received: 15 December 2017
Date accepted: 15 December 2017
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No. 28488R
(Registered 15 January 2018)



SPENCER, Mark MP (Sherwood)

£850 + £850 + £772 + £670 = £3152

Gifts, benefits and hospitality (UK)

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor : Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting and one night’s accommodation at Catton Hall, Derbyshire, total value £850
Date of receipt of donation: 13 December 2012
Date of acceptance of donation: 13 December 2012

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting and one night’s accommodation at Catton Hall, Derbyshire, total value £850
Date of receipt of donation: 13 December 2013
Date of acceptance of donation: 13 December 2013
Donor status: unincorporated association

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting and one night’s accommodation at Hoar Cross Hall Hotel Staffordshire; total value £772
Date received: 17 December 2015
Date accepted: 17 December 2015
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 13 January 2016)

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting with a value of £670
Date of receipt of donation: 15 December 2017
Date of acceptance of donation: 15 December 2017
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R

 

[Roestalker39]

Pocketing the money? What do you think they are doing with it, divvying up into brown paper envelopes and shar8n* it among themselves?

No of course not it goes on nice lunches and motors mate

 

[Roestalker39]

maybe all the good working people should rise up and get the village idiots who are making these changes OUT.

Why bother just let it die a death

 

[HallyButt]

The easiest way to resolve the fact that the members have bought a policy for the year when they renewed and are loosing this benefit after subscription is for BASC to purchase a run off legal expenses plan so at renewal members lose the policy, then its up to them to decide if they renew, the underwriters see a reducing risk so cover can at least be provided for those who bought it etc.
I‘ve had issues with the way the BASC insurance policy is dealt with for years and challenged them on it and asked David Ilsley some questions he did not like about commissions and close relationships to the broker, at the time they had always been with the same broker and never shopped around as an example, not sure if that has changed since then, but I was politely told it was nothing to do with me and mind my own business.

Couldn’t agree more, the costing attributed to this has always been laughable with no effort to look at alternatives, doubtless huge incentives and commissions paid (unclear where to..) The FCA reference is intriguing but sadly they are toothless and slow to react, this has always looked suspect to me.

 

[8x57]

Has the invoice of 2020-2021 for hosting a day's pheasant shooting for a number of MPs landed on the doormat at Marford Mill?

Remember this I posted a while back? Can any BASC Member ask how much is being spent this year 2020-2021?


Geoffrey Clifton-Brown MP

£741 + £800 + £772 + £772 + £825 = £3910

Gifts, benefits and hospitality (UK)
Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor : Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: supper, bed and breakfast, and one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, Derbyshire, 16 December 2012; total value £741.60
Date of receipt of donation: 16 December 2012
Date of acceptance of donation: 16 December 2012
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society, No 28488R

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor : Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting and supper, bed and breakfast at Catton Hall, Derbyshire; total value £800.50
Date of receipt of donation: 13 December 2013
Date of acceptance of donation: 13 December 2013
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society, No 28488R

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting and one night’s accommodation at Hoar Cross Hall Hotel Staffordshire; total value £772
Date received: 17 December 2015
Date accepted: 17 December 2015
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 21 December 2015)

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, South Derbyshire and one night’s accommodation at Hoar Cross Hall Hotel Staffordshire; total value £772
Date of receipt of donation: 16 December 2016
Date of acceptance of donation: 16 December 2016
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 19 December 2016)

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting and one night’s hospitality, total value £825.45
Date received: 15 December 2017
Date accepted: 15 December 2017
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 08 January 2018)



Wiggin, Bill MP (North Herefordshire)

£825 + £953 = £1778

Gifts, benefits and hospitality from UK sources
Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, South Derbyshire and one night’s accommodation; total value £825.45
Date of receipt of donation: 15 December 2017
Date of acceptance of donation: 15 December 2017
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 09 January 2018)

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, South Derbyshire and one night’s accommodation; total value £953
Date received: 24-25 September 2018
Date accepted: 24 September 2018
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 30 October 2018)



Brady, Sir Graham MP (Altrincham and Sale West)

£826 + £825 = £1651

Gifts, benefits and hospitality from UK sources

Name of Donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, South Derbyshire and one night’s accommodation at Hoar Cross Hall Hotel Staffordshire: total £826.73
Date of receipt of donation: 16 December 2016
Date of acceptance of donation: 16 December 2016
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 23 December 2016; updated 10 January 2017)

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, South Derbyshire and one night’s accommodation at Hoar Cross Hall Hotel, Staffordshire: £825.45 in total
Date received: 15 December 2017
Date accepted: 15 December 2017
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No. 28488R
(Registered 15 January 2018)



SPENCER, Mark MP (Sherwood)

£850 + £850 + £772 + £670 = £3152

Gifts, benefits and hospitality (UK)

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor : Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting and one night’s accommodation at Catton Hall, Derbyshire, total value £850
Date of receipt of donation: 13 December 2012
Date of acceptance of donation: 13 December 2012

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting and one night’s accommodation at Catton Hall, Derbyshire, total value £850
Date of receipt of donation: 13 December 2013
Date of acceptance of donation: 13 December 2013
Donor status: unincorporated association

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting and one night’s accommodation at Hoar Cross Hall Hotel Staffordshire; total value £772
Date received: 17 December 2015
Date accepted: 17 December 2015
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R
(Registered 13 January 2016)

Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC)
Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL
Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting with a value of £670
Date of receipt of donation: 15 December 2017
Date of acceptance of donation: 15 December 2017
Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R

Assuming that this information is correct I can only say that BASC have totally lost the plot. The working man who does a bit of stalking or rough shooting would be horrified to see that his membership fees to the association is being used to entertain M.P.s who probably earn considerably more than they do. Frankly it's taking the wizz.

 

[countrryboy]

I could be wrong but BASC only introduced legal expenses a few years ago? And you are all now leaving it in droves because they are now withdrawing a provision which many members did not have for a long time anyway? Maybe after a few years they decided that the legal expenses cover was just not value for money? I believe SD members were joining SACS a few years ago because their main selling point was they provided LEI whereas BASC did’nt. then SACS quielty dropped LEI, now BASC are doing the same. Did you all leave SACS when they ditched LEI. this post could be complete bollox if my memory serves me wrong, but I just cannot be bothered to trawl back through SD and use google etc. Anyway I,m sticking with BASC.

That was exactly wot I understood too.
Basc started this about the same time sacs gave it up.

I do remember sacs claiming it was too expensive for wot they got back and they were better off not paying for the insurance and paying for the legal stuff themselves.
They will also have more control of the cases they take on.
Dunno if sacs stood by there word and took cases on???

Would be interesting to know, but I doubt basc will ever give an honst answer from them
Have the insurance companies rejected many/any claims that basc wanted to persue???

To be honest basc may be right with this 1, if there not getting anything like 1 million quid worth of legal representation back, as long as they use the money they are saving to fight the same cases or hopefully more.

This is where it falls down massively as the fact basc are completely gutless and coldnae fight sleep so its members will continue to be shafted ( both from basc and the police)


Why why why would u not claim the expenses of the police, they may not care about HoG guidelines but when it starts hitting there pocket rogue firearms depts would soon be brought into line.
Claiming that expenses would be the same as winning w court cases financially without the expense or risk, just can't see why u wouldnt ( althou in an ideal world that cash would be going on police officers wages or equipment)

 

[phillips321]

Geoffrey Clifton-Brown MP
£741 + £800 + £772 + £772 + £825 = £3910

Wiggin, Bill MP (North Herefordshire)
£825 + £953 = £1778

Brady, Sir Graham MP (Altrincham and Sale West)
£826 + £825 = £1651

SPENCER, Mark MP (Sherwood)
£850 + £850 + £772 + £670 = £3152

What did these MPs do that deserved such donated days? I know people who give up plenty of their free time for juniors coming into the sport who don't get anything other than a pat on the back...

 

[ChrisWill184]

To be honest basc may be right with this 1, if there not getting anything like 1 million quid worth of legal representation back, as long as they use the money they are saving to fight the same cases or hopefully more.

Whether the cases are there or not to ‘get value’ out of the £1m spent isn’t the point. If I don’t have to claim on my house or car insurance then I am delighted as I have not had any issues. Same goes for here. Am I glad I have it there in the background in case something happens - definitely.

The opening statement in the announcement of “BASC acts in the best interests of its members and shooting” is fairly sweeping I must say. Certainly not my best interests here.

Also frustrated that I found out about this issue on here and I had to search for it in this months magazine to show it to my father, who is also not happy. Stuff like this should be emailed individually or posted as a minimum, as I would expect from any insurer.

Frustrated.

 

[enfieldspares]

Here's some details of shooting enjoyed by MPs in 2018:

Adams, Nigel (Selby and Ainsty)
Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC) Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL Amount of donation, or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, South Derbyshire and one night’s accommodation; total value £953 Date received: 24-25 September 2018 Date accepted: 24 September 2018 Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R (Registered 01 November 2018)

Djanogly, Mr Jonathan (Huntingdon)
Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC) Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL Amount of donation, or nature and value if donation in kind: One day's shooting and one night's hospitality, total value £953 Date received: 25 September 2018 Date accepted: 25 September 2018 Donor status: Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R (Registered 05 October 2018)

Garnier, Mark (Wyre Forest)
Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC) Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, South Derbyshire with a value of £700 Date received: 25 September 2018 Date accepted: 25 September 2018 Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R (Registered 07 November 2018)

Wiggin, Bill (North Herefordshire)
Name of donor: British Association for Shooting and Conservation (BASC) Address of donor: Marford Mill, Rossett, Wrexham LL12 0HL Amount of donation or nature and value if donation in kind: one day’s shooting at Catton Hall, South Derbyshire and one night’s accommodation; total value £953 Date received: 24-25 September 2018 Date accepted: 24 September 2018 Donor status: Registered Industrial and Provident Society No 28488R (Registered 30 October 2018)


£953 + £953 + £700 + £953 = £3,559

 

[enfieldspares]

Again can a BASC Member ask if any BASC Staff were also in attendance, as guns, on this date in 2018? And if so how many staff and if their day's shooting was paid for by BASC?

 

[countrryboy]

Whether the cases are there or not to ‘get value’ out of the £1m spent isn’t the point. If I don’t have to claim on my house or car insurance then I am delighted as I have not had any issues. Same goes for here. Am I glad I have it there in the background in case something happens - definitely.

The opening statement in the announcement of “BASC acts in the best interests of its members and shooting” is fairly sweeping I must say. Certainly not my best interests here.

Also frustrated that I found out about this issue on here and I had to search for it in this months magazine to show it to my father, who is also not happy. Stuff like this should be emailed individually or posted as a minimum, as I would expect from any insurer.

Frustrated.

While the principle of insurance may be the same, but with a house fire ur insurance wont pick and choose wether to pay out
From wot I understand with this legal insurance they only take on sure fire winners
But if the insurance company was picking and choosing it's cases ur insurance isn't really worth that much. Makes it more of a lottery than insurance
Potentially if basc had a set off balls u could be better covered without the insurance as they could take any case they wanted even more dodgy cases to set precedents.
The problem is not a lack of insurance it's the lack off balls.
Sacs dropped it years ago and no one batted an eye.

Is that why only 75 folk have used it?
Because many other cases have been deemed not winnable enough so insurance company refused them?
75 out of 150k is a tiny proportion, I would of thought more people would have legal issues than that. That's only about 1.5 issues a week.
U'll see more problems than that reading the legal section on here and that's for however many active members of this site, no where near 150k



Must admit I'm surprised how upset u all are by this when basc have only had it for 5 years, but hardly a whimper when basc single handed finished lead shot off or when basc never made a noise over the trophy hunting legislation ( it could very easily mutate until finishing guided stalking off) and not only finished the little trust shooters had in there useless org but managed to sabotage and bring other more honest orgs down to there level, effectively damaging every shooting org at a time when we need them most.
I reckon in 20- 30 years time that 1 letter will have done more damage to shooting than p ackham and WJ ever did.

Not sure wot paying a few mpzs for a days shooting comes into it.
Just the way things are done .
In the grand scheme of things a few days shooting is not really here or there and let's face it basc an allegedly a pro shooting org ( despite there best attempts to sabotage it) if u can't get a few days shooting out a shooting org u have a problem
The. ammount some big businesses will spend of corporate shooting days will be frightening

 

[Wsm]

It's not so much of a case of how many cases were taken on but more of a case of how many potential cases were resolved with the threat of further action of which I can speak from experience

Removing the option of legal cover is like playing poker and showing the other players your hand

 

[countrryboy]

It's not so much of a case of how many cases were taken on but more of a case of how many potential cases were resolved with the threat of further action of which I can speak from experience

Removing the option of legal cover is like playing poker and showing the other players your hand

I do agree with u but potentially if they used the 1 mill saving to employ some legal types on the books there would be nothing to stop them stil taking cases on that the insurance might refuse.
Infact they should be able to take more on as can afford to lose the odd 1 if basc already paying the lawyers wages.

So basc could still have the threat, the in problem is basc is completely gutless

 

[Woodsmoke]

Well, I trust the bullet currently passing through BASC's own foot is of the non-toxic variety . . . .

I confess to feeling a touch of schadenfreude

 

[8x57]

I do agree with u but potentially if they used the 1 mill saving to employ some legal types on the books there would be nothing to stop them stil taking cases on that the insurance might refuse.
Infact they should be able to take more on as can afford to lose the odd 1 if basc already paying the lawyers wages.

So basc could still have the threat, the in problem is basc is completely gutless
[/QUOT

It's not so much a matter of just employing lawyers ( we were taught on prosecution training that solicitors should only ever be used for the very simplest of cases, always employ a barrister).
It's more the matter of recovering costs. You can win the case outright but the court decides to not award costs or even damages, or even decide to split the costs. Costs usually run into many tens of thousands of pounds. For that matter it is always far better to only resort to the courts as an absolute last resort after all other attempts at resolution have failed.

But to announce that you are removing the threat of last resort is I agree showing your hand and a sign of total weakness.

 

[ChrisWill184]

I do agree with u but potentially if they used the 1 mill saving to employ some legal types on the books there would be nothing to stop them stil taking cases on that the insurance might refuse.
Infact they should be able to take more on as can afford to lose the odd 1 if basc already paying the lawyers wages.

So basc could still have the threat, the in problem is basc is completely gutless

Unfortunately I can’t see £1m going very far if you had to employ even 1 experienced legal type and then if any cases are lost (such as the that mentioned earlier at £40k court costs, not including the amount redeemable by the opposite party) that number could be much higher. As a result even less cases are taken on.

I do understand that with LEI they can pick and choose what they go for but it is wholly better having the possibility of a fight than rolling over for the sake of a few pounds per member, which by the way they are keeping and not handing back.

Whether other orgs had it and then dropped it is not the issue. BASC in my mind have not consulted the members on a number of issues recently including this, not communicated it properly and are removing a very powerful tool in winning challenges against our sport/hobbies/livelihoods.

With recent events from wild justice, animal rights orgs, vegans, police and doctors and idiots that would happier eat a McDonalds burger than understand where it came from we need to be building an arsenal of tools on top of what we have to challenge these issues, not dropping them.

Im just disappointed I suppose. BASC are one of, if not the biggest organisation we have to support and act on our behalf when it comes to shooting mattes. I really want them to do well. I don’t want to bash them but I am getting more and more concerned that they have no clout anymore and now have actively removed one hammer in the tool box.