Revert To Closed Ticket When Moving Constabulary…

[Devon Stalker]

Evening All, I’d be interested in your thoughts on this.

I have just moved home and accordingly changed constabulary. I haven’t yet received my ticket back post address change, but it has been alluded to that I may be changed from an open to a closed ticket, because my new constabulary have a set period of time one must hold a firearms licence before open status is granted. I may not fit into this category because my ticket was previously opened on request, partly because of my former membership of a deer management group with land dotted about the county.

Thoughts please on the legitimacy of this?

 

[ashray]

interesting ,i retired two years ago and had my fac open for 40 years but as i retired and no longer had land to shoot on my fac was closed on renewal last september. <thames valley.>

 

[Apthorpe]

Worth writing to them to ask them to list all the different, special firearms laws which apply in Northumberland, because you’re only familiar with the laws in England.

 

[Frank Homes]

Evening All, I’d be interested in your thoughts on this.

I have just moved home and accordingly changed constabulary. I haven’t yet received my ticket back post address change, but it has been alluded to that I may be changed from an open to a closed ticket, because my new constabulary have a set period of time one must hold a firearms licence before open status is granted. I may not fit into this category because my ticket was previously opened on request, partly because of my former membership of a deer management group with land dotted about the county.

Thoughts please on the legitimacy of this?

A change in conditions with restrictions equals a partial revocation...iinsist on a formal letter giving you the right to appeal..that might alter their decision.

 

[Greenmist]

As I understand it, existing conditions should be valid for the duration of the certificate, even if you change area. Happened with a friend of mine with a .410 pistol, our area aren't keen on them and a number of his new colleagues have had requests declined, as he had it on his certificate from his previous area it was kept on, albeit begrudgingly, might prove an interesting scenario on renewal

 

[Rusty Gate]

Worth writing to them to ask them to list all the different, special firearms laws which apply in Northumberland, because you’re only familiar with the laws in England.

….and when do they anticipate completing the land checks for each permission your currently holding ( worded carefully )

 

[finnbear270]

Historically for me, I have had attempts to restrict a new or fresh calibre to closed conditions ............................ I soon put that right.

 

[VSS]

My daughter experienced the same.
She had .22lr, .222 & .243 all on open conditions with North Wales Police. When she moved to the Midlands her new FAC came back with closed conditions for the .243
She queried this, and was told it was because she hadn't owned the .243 for long enough to be sufficiently experienced in its use (3 years, I think was their requirement for any calibre to be opened).
When she pointed out how ridiculous this was, given what she did for a living, the fact that she had a .308 on a government permit as her work rifle, and was shooting more deer in a month than many people will achieve in a lifetime, they relented and restored the open condition for the .243

 

[Devon Stalker]

Thanks All, great to hear there are some options in this situation. I’ll wait and see what comes back.

 

[cjm1066]

You have a valid FAC, changing address changes nothing, they have no legal power to do this.

 

[Stalker62]

You have a valid FAC, changing address changes nothing, they have no legal power to do this.

They absolutely do.

 

[cjm1066]

How, it's valid until expiry or revoked, changing address is neither of these so no legal power.

 

[Griff254]

You’d like to think that as you hold a valid open FAC this shouldn’t be the case.

But that could all change based on the opinion/mindset of the Chief of Police for the area you’re moving into…hopefully not (fingers crossed).

 

[Sinistral]

A change in conditions with restrictions equals a partial revocation...iinsist on a formal letter giving you the right to appeal..that might alter their decision.

You have a valid FAC, changing address changes nothing, they have no legal power to do this.

How, it's valid until expiry or revoked, changing address is neither of these so no legal power.

Although there is a right of appeal against a refusal to grant or renew a certificate, there is no right of appeal against the imposition of conditions.
The landmark case which established this was in 1998 where Reg Buckland of SHC lost against the CC of Cambrigeshire at Cambridge Crown Court. His justification was poor IMO, and as this is my area I followed this closely. I still have the transcript, and nothing has changed since.
If an FAC holder moves to another area, and his FLD changes then his FAC with the current firearms remains in force. The new CC may change the Conditions at will, but usually this doesn't happen until everything is reconsidered at his next Renewal.
There is a right of appeal against a decision to refuse to vary the existing conditions attached to a firearm certificate (section 29 of the 1968 Act), but not against the initial decision to impose conditions, sorry to say.

 

[Greenmist]

As I've just realised you've moved to Northumberland (I think) I don't think it will be an issue, the firearms team are quite sensible and do apply common sense in most cases

 

[timbrayford]

Evening All, I’d be interested in your thoughts on this.

I have just moved home and accordingly changed constabulary. I haven’t yet received my ticket back post address change, but it has been alluded to that I may be changed from an open to a closed ticket, because my new constabulary have a set period of time one must hold a firearms licence before open status is granted. I may not fit into this category because my ticket was previously opened on request, partly because of my former membership of a deer management group with land dotted about the county.

Thoughts please on the legitimacy of this?

Just point out that you've had an open certificate for X number of years and confirm your good reason for firearms ownership , it would be somewhat unusual for them to disagree, beggar the point with them in a respectful manner if they don't.

 

[Mickeydredd]

but it has been alluded to that I may be changed from an open to a closed ticket, because my new constabulary have a set period of time one must hold a firearms licence before open status is granted

who exactly did the alluding out of interest?

 

[Heym SR20]

My suggestion would be to support the change of address with confirmation of your “open” FAC and confirmation of the key pieces of ground over which you have permission to shoot, and that you also regular shoot over other land as a guest, contractor or whatever, abd that you anticipate this continuing as part of your duties under the deer management group.

Fundamentally with any discussion with officialdom is to gibe them the supporting evidence to justify their decision.

As a courtesy I would also contact your previous FLO, make him aware that you are moving and thank him for all his support and help over the years.

 

[Devon Stalker]

I’m pleased to say it’s come back open. Very sensible, and speedy, thank you Northumberland!

 

[nic531]

As I understand it, the open ticket is granted when you have sufficient experience to safely decide on the decision to shoot or not. Your experience has not changed and according to HO and NPCC guidance it is neither calibre nor quarry specific so should carry over, even if you went from deer to say Boar shooting