SACS what do they actually do ?
- Thread starter mudman
- Start date
Well said that man !!!
Bandit Country
Well-Known Member
But did you actually find out what other organisations did? Many other shooting organisations - including SACS - made and continue to make serious representations to Government in support of shooting sports. BASC get a high profile at such times because they are on speed dial for all media outlets and as soon as anything gun related crops up they get the call for a comment. Unfortunately 'comment' in the media doesn't necessarily sway Government thinking. My own view is that BASC's policy of appeasement is very poor representation and we need something far more robust. They act more like apologists for our sport, rather than defending it - which is why I also cancelled my membership.
'DAVID BASC' does his Society no favours with his commentary and gives the lie to the 'united we stand' rhetoric. United? Yes, but only if BASC is in charge. One thing you can say for other shooting organisations is that they don't come on SD and stir it up by putting the boot into others?
howa243
Well-Known Member
Be interested to know what you ound out about the organisation that you joined that made you think that they were more supportive of our sport.
If you ever wanted to know why our sport is doomed all you have to do is look at this thread.
achosenman
Well-Known Member
The sad fact is that behind the scenes representations to government don’t make headlines and are therefore easy to ignore.
The future of shooting sports will be decided by popular opinion and the press. The groundswell of opinion caused government to ban handguns and semi autos. We ignore that at our peril.
BASC are on speed dial because they understand that to influence the outcome you have to be sat at the table. Quiet representation to government ministers won’t work in the face of popular opinion…after all, there’s votes to be had.
ATB
The future of shooting sports will be decided by popular opinion and the press. The groundswell of opinion caused government to ban handguns and semi autos. We ignore that at our peril.
BASC are on speed dial because they understand that to influence the outcome you have to be sat at the table. Quiet representation to government ministers won’t work in the face of popular opinion…after all, there’s votes to be had.
ATB
Bandit Country
Well-Known Member
Oh yes, as to what SACS do (sic)? In addition to providing good value insurance you might have a read of this http://www.sacs.org.uk/images/law_society_response.pdf SACS made a response on behalf of members on all sides of the various UK border(s) - did you?
They were also at the Shooting Show, albeit not quite such a grand stand as others, but their volunteers had traveled quite a long way. For a small outfit I think they 'do' rather well. Personally, I think I get a far bigger and better bang for my buck. Little acorns, mighty oaks, doncha' know David! Pip, pip.
They were also at the Shooting Show, albeit not quite such a grand stand as others, but their volunteers had traveled quite a long way. For a small outfit I think they 'do' rather well. Personally, I think I get a far bigger and better bang for my buck. Little acorns, mighty oaks, doncha' know David! Pip, pip.
Bandit Country
Well-Known Member
Blimey - now I know how Hillary Mantel feels like. As I've said elsewhere I moved to SACS because of personal recommendation and a demonstrable track record of supporting members in their dealings with various constabularies. I don't know if SACS is "more supportive" of our sport. What I do know is that BASC isn't the organisation I want representing me as I don't think they're up to the job.
I would suggest this thread isn't evidence of our sport being doomed - rather it confirms that so called representative organisations are failing to unify the shooting fraternity?
Bandit Country
Well-Known Member
As for 'votes to be had' the total membership of BASC (and any other shooting outfit) spread across the country is negligible in terms of political impact. 'Being sat at the table' is actually an arguement for more lobbying organisations, rather than a single monolithic 'voice'. Just about everyman and his dog gets officially 'consulted' these days as part of any legislative process, which is why so many minority anti-gun outfits get a hearing. The more pro-shooting organisations there are the more pro-shooting 'voices' there will be at the table.
Three post in a row? I'm off for a lie down.....
boltaction
Active Member
Scots_stalker
Well-Known Member
+1
X2
Paul at Fechan
Well-Known Member
is that because BASC's comments got more media attention that the prime minister's??? wake up Cameron made one powerful statement that knocked the issue right on the head.
That's the leader of the UK putting his foot down in the media representing out interests directly in the long term.... BASC can't take credit for that one, sorry I'm in the real world.
achosenman
Well-Known Member
By that I mean the uneducated mass hysteria generated by the media in the general population...will have a vote. The flip side is that a reasonable number out of that population are not stupid, just uneducated.
A reasoned counterpoint has to be put otherwise we will see runaway ignorance win the day once again.
ATB
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Pheasant Feeder
Well-Known Member
Yes they did get more coverage than the PM, and his statement on knee jerk reactions was indeed critical, but had the shooting community not been represented and the media frenzy had whipped up the masses into hype and hysteria, it would have been a brave politician to stand his ground against what could have been overwhelming public opinion.
BASC has invested in their media centre which, at the time I thought was a waste of money. How wrong I was. It is this foresight into the fact that the world has moved on in terms of 24 hours of news coverage and the internet that puts them out in front for me. The enemies to our sport are as media savvy as ever and whether we like it or not we need a voice that can challenge the mis-information that is often spread. I do not knock any of the other shooting organisations or the work they do, the CA is probably the only organisation with the resources to do a similar job but for my money I still feel that the public associate them with the hunting ban, and I have no wish for shooting to be perceived to be too closely associated with fox hunting, not because I am against hunting, but because I don't see it doing shooting any favours in terms of public opinion. The CA also seems to be trying to cover many rural issues, but in terms of representing shooting sports I think we need an organisation dedicated to shooting to fight our corner.
Many of us sit here typing our responses and arguing our view point, but I suspect few, if any of us would have the abilities and confidence to sit on national news programes and defend shooting from questions and scrutiny by journalists and interviewers who are experienced in questioning world leaders and politicians day in day out.
I am pleased you are happy with your choice, as am I.
Quite correct, we could choose to sit back and not combat negative press, nor try combat the failings of the licencing system etc. and just rely on a cheap insurance deal…
We could sit back knowing that our insurance may pay out in the (unlikely) event we have an accident but we will see our shooting eroded away because our cheap insurance company did not bother to stand up and do something about it.
I will happily pay the extra few quid to have a large organisation stand up in the media et al to help keep my sport safer, but if all I want is cheap insurance I know where to go… my home insurance!!!
David
David,
For what it is worth, I really do wish BASC would take a real stand against the continuing barrage of miss-represented information and mud throwing the likes of the RSPCA / RSPB / Environment Agency plaster across the press.
Also why do they not start lobbying for LACS and the aforementioned to be held accountable for dead-end cases bought before the CPS to then be dragged out and extinguished by the legal system? The public pays for these ridiculous antic by all of the above, and yet the BASC seem to do very little.
id like to see some of my money go to fighting this gross injustice, are the BASC doing enough to secure the funding from the government that these others seem to receive unconditionally?!
BASC Member
remington65
Well-Known Member
Maybe the way to deliver the knock out blow to obstructive firearms depts is to employ some othe most obstructive licenseing managers.
remington65
Well-Known Member
basc has employed an ex licensing manager who has been one of the most obstructive that i have heard about.
6pointer
Well-Known Member
I wounder were BASC get there cash please don't say membership because its not that just about keeps them ticking over. DMQ and the so called voluntary approach. Well David and Peter its time the public realise that our wonderful sport is more incestuous than the catholic church. If as is likely the scottish government through there advisers make it mandatory for any one wishing to shoot alone in Scotland MUST reach a level of competence.
Who do you think stands to make the most cash from this decision. Also how can BASC stand alone for its members when it rely,s o the government body,s for its stalking schemes. Also while we are at how can we have a fair and independent decision on these very subjects when the head of BASC Scotland is also one of the heads of the Scottish governments ad visors.
David Peter and all you BASC members wake up do you think SACS did not want to be in on some of the major decisions on the future of scotland's deer management. Yes they did and applied to be on the net works and were declined because they were not part of the clan .
SACS are the biggest supporter of the initial lowland deer groups bar none.
Who do you think stands to make the most cash from this decision. Also how can BASC stand alone for its members when it rely,s o the government body,s for its stalking schemes. Also while we are at how can we have a fair and independent decision on these very subjects when the head of BASC Scotland is also one of the heads of the Scottish governments ad visors.
David Peter and all you BASC members wake up do you think SACS did not want to be in on some of the major decisions on the future of scotland's deer management. Yes they did and applied to be on the net works and were declined because they were not part of the clan .
SACS are the biggest supporter of the initial lowland deer groups bar none.
BUCKSCOTLAND
Active Member
i am thinking of joining NGA ? any body used them before
From SACS
Dear, oh dear, oh dear - the minute I look away the kids start misbehaving.....
Hi guys - apologies for the long absence, but as you all know I don't have the time to monitor all the forums - the agreement is that if there is something I should know about going on, someone on the site will let me know and I will come in and try to sort out the problem if there is one.
I got a message the other day about this thread, but I was working on our scathing response to the stupid bloody proposals to introduce airgun licensing in Scotland by our loopy Justice Minister, and the deadline is tomorrow so I have to finish that first. The full response, in which I am not kind to him, should be on our website in a couple of days - I hope, because the website host moved us to a new server recently and it all went belly-up for a bit.
I'm at the PAW Conference tomorrow all day - I'll sit down and get a proper response done as soon as I can - certainly in the next few days, so this would be a REALLY good time for anyone to ask any other questions and I can do the whole lot in one go.
Best regards to all
Ian
Dear, oh dear, oh dear - the minute I look away the kids start misbehaving.....
Hi guys - apologies for the long absence, but as you all know I don't have the time to monitor all the forums - the agreement is that if there is something I should know about going on, someone on the site will let me know and I will come in and try to sort out the problem if there is one.
I got a message the other day about this thread, but I was working on our scathing response to the stupid bloody proposals to introduce airgun licensing in Scotland by our loopy Justice Minister, and the deadline is tomorrow so I have to finish that first. The full response, in which I am not kind to him, should be on our website in a couple of days - I hope, because the website host moved us to a new server recently and it all went belly-up for a bit.
I'm at the PAW Conference tomorrow all day - I'll sit down and get a proper response done as soon as I can - certainly in the next few days, so this would be a REALLY good time for anyone to ask any other questions and I can do the whole lot in one go.
Best regards to all
Ian
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