Dead or not dead??

[Mungo]

Weird one today stalked into a stag at about 70m could only see its antlers as it was lying in dead bracken. Thought about calling it to stand but lots of trees and I had a very small shooting lane so I thought if it moves one step I won’t get a shot…. Anyway it finally looked towards me and I shot where I thought his head was through the bracken. Generally I don’t head shoot unless the animal is looking towards or away from me as this reduces the chance of a jaw shot. He keeled over as I expected and another bigger stag I’d not seen got up. I shot him in the chest and he ran on 20m or so. Anyway I located both stags after a brief search then went back the first one I shot. There was no way I was going to get both beasts out of the wood I was in as it was miles to the truck over rough ground so I decided to quarter them in the field and take out what I could. I rested my rifle on the animal and noticed it was moving. It was like the heart was beating!! I poked the eyelid again definitely dead… blood out of the nose and ear but I couldn’t locate the exit wound. Must have hit the neck bones and failed to exit I dunno?
Anyway on taking off the first rear quarter I cut through the artery and the blood pumped out like a fire hydrant. The heart was clearly working!!
I had spent maybe 20 mins looking for the second stag I shot so it had been a while before I got back to this one? Had I somehow paralysed the animal but not killed it or was it dead but the heart just pulsing? Really strange one.

Thinking about it, the most recent one of these I had was a sika staggie.

Shot face on at about 50m. Head was turned a little more than I realised. Shot went in the eye socket and out the side of the skull, quite high. Could clearly see brain matter both on the ground and exposed in the wound. Dropped to shot, then head came up and it was struggling about, breathing and flailing front legs. Still ‘alive and kicking’, though unlikely to go anywhere, and would have been fully dead soon. But I put a second shot into it at 5m.

 

[deerstalker.308]

Not much chance of suspending a 120kg stag but I get your point

Yeah, I do it with 180kg ones! Put your back into it man!

 

[Martiniblack577]

This is why people such as knackermen, hunt servants and the animal welfare charities use a pithing rod after using a captive bolt gun, there is no guarantee that they will cease to be just after a hole being up it their head!

Am surprised at a number of the comments here suggesting an issue around understanding how to recognise life extinct .

 

[Gmm243]

I shot a sika hind in the back of the hard at about 70m. She went straight down and I could see her kicking in the long grass beside the forest. When I got to her she was up on her front legs shaking her head around. I shot her at the top of the neck which killed her.
When I got a look at her the first bullet (100gn 243) had entered below her ears at the back of the head and had exited under her left eye. I can only presume the bullet skirted around the skull somehow instead of going straight through.

 

[olliehopes]

Am surprised at a number of the comments here suggesting an issue around understanding how to recognise life extinct .

No issue here. Brain dead is brain dead.... Central nervous system is different. Pithing helps prevent the kicking out as it helps destroy the nerves that fire after the brain has been destroyed.

 

[bogtrotter]

Weird one today stalked into a stag at about 70m could only see its antlers as it was lying in dead bracken. Thought about calling it to stand but lots of trees and I had a very small shooting lane so I thought if it moves one step I won’t get a shot…. Anyway it finally looked towards me and I shot where I thought his head was through the bracken. Generally I don’t head shoot unless the animal is looking towards or away from me as this reduces the chance of a jaw shot. He keeled over as I expected and another bigger stag I’d not seen got up. I shot him in the chest and he ran on 20m or so. Anyway I located both stags after a brief search then went back the first one I shot. There was no way I was going to get both beasts out of the wood I was in as it was miles to the truck over rough ground so I decided to quarter them in the field and take out what I could. I rested my rifle on the animal and noticed it was moving. It was like the heart was beating!! I poked the eyelid again definitely dead… blood out of the nose and ear but I couldn’t locate the exit wound. Must have hit the neck bones and failed to exit I dunno?
Anyway on taking off the first rear quarter I cut through the artery and the blood pumped out like a fire hydrant. The heart was clearly working!!
I had spent maybe 20 mins looking for the second stag I shot so it had been a while before I got back to this one? Had I somehow paralysed the animal but not killed it or was it dead but the heart just pulsing? Really strange one.

Good reason to bleed your beast, brain dead but heart still beating for a while not that
Uncommon.
Though as brain dead it would not feel any pain.

 

[Border]

Once chest shot a Sika stag on the edge of a track which went down.
Got to it and stuck it straight away to bleed it after the usual test. We left it where it was and went on to get truck so we could move to another area. We stopped to pick up the deer but it had gone. We eventually found it forty yards into thick cover. I will never understand how a dead, bled out deer could kick itself through so much cover and for such a distance. One of life's mysteries.

Gang of badgers

 

[Tim.243]

Gang of badgers

No Toby using a .222 lol

 

[Ratel]

Gang of badgers

 

[gixer1]

For all intents and purpose it was dead, if your brain isn’t sending signals you are dead, it’s not nice to think that a beast is alive and aware but I think in this case it was not aware of anything and the heart was simply still functioning.

 

[gixer1]

To confirm: you have a license to go around and shoot animals but don’t know if you cleanly kill or not?

Anyone that says they can 100% an animal is dead after a shot is a liar….you never know until you get to it. Simple as that - anyone that has seen enough deer shot has seen a head shot deer keep moving and even kick after lying still. They are amazingly tough animals that have a natural instinct to keep going or get to cover.

 

[HonestJohn]

What are you doing shooting stags in Feb?

 

[VSS]

Am surprised at a number of the comments here suggesting an issue around understanding how to recognise life extinct .

It's not always straightforward. 99% of the time it is, but occasionally nature throws a curve ball.
Perhaps not something that you've come across yet, not being a hunter and only shooting inanimate targets? No trouble recognising life extinct when the pigeon is made of clay.

 

[Camdig]

Sika stag last year high kneck shot about 120m dropped on the spot, happy days wee rolly before walking in 10-5mins when I got close could see foot movement, must be nerves, get right up to it and if its kneck wasn't broken it would have got up again! Quick reload and put another shot in. I was taken a back at just how much life it still had.

 

[HonestJohn]

Always approach a shot beast with a loaded rifle in your hands (not on shoulder), ready for an immediate shot if it gets up when it sees or hears you approach. Obviously approach from behind it so you can get close without risk if it seeing you.

Be very careful sticking or bleeding anything bigger than a roe buck if it’s a male, one swing of the headgear and you both might be dying together arm in arm.

 

[Camelfarm]

I've had a kick in the knee from a head-shot, stone dead parkland fallow that damn near broke my leg and left me hobbling for days - very solid lesson learned.

 

[gixer1]

What are you doing shooting stags in Feb?

He’s in Scotland…we have no closed season for male deer…

 

[gixer1]

Always approach a shot beast with a loaded rifle in your hands (not on shoulder), ready for an immediate shot if it gets up when it sees or hears you approach. Obviously approach from behind it so you can get close without risk if it seeing you.

Be very careful sticking or bleeding anything bigger than a roe buck if it’s a male, one swing of the headgear and you both might be dying together arm in arm.

Which way round is the deer facing in this picture? Kinda hard to tell until you are standing on it!

 

[Utectok]

Yeah, I do it with 180kg ones! Put your back into it man!

Or put your back out more like in my case

 

[Utectok]

If you shoot enough, there's always going to be a few anomalies.

Exactly I thought it was interesting and unusual the truth is I don’t shoot a lot of deer in the head maybe 2-3 a year out of the 60 odd I shoot each year. I guess that’s why it’s never occurred before.