DSC 2 Gralloch disposal ?

[liongeorge]

I am starting my DSC2 shortly and having browsed the best practice guide there is nothing written about gralloch disposal except to refer to By-product disposal guide which is not included in the main guide and I can not find it online. Any AW's or out there can point me in the right direction

 

[stalker.308]

Ha, I remember this very question. The best practice authors dared not ask for guidance for fear of an answer they didn't want, so the guide never followed. In reality all gralloch is left on the land, away from watercourses/ditches and not easily found by members of the public.

 

[Buchan]

By product legislation sort of skips over game, so gralloch carefully covered up. If you deal with the carcass at home, it's OK to put the bits in the bin. You can lokk the regs up if you are really keen....

 

[pinkfoot1]

Ha, I remember this very question. The best practice authors dared not ask for guidance for fear of an answer they didn't want, so the guide never followed. In reality all gralloch is left on the land, away from watercourses/ditches and not easily found by members of the public.

Seconded!

 

[timbrayford]

Sooner or later you will come across burying the gralloch 1 meter deep is "Best Practice", but as others have said the reality is that it gets hidden away from the public gaze for other wildlife to consume, Red Kites especially benefit from it. Alternatively if you have access to a deer larder disposal via a licensed waste carrier is appropriate.

 

[Odders]

My only concern with leaving it exposed is potential lead ingestion by scavengers, especially birds, which appear to be more susceptible to lead poisoning than the four legged kind.
It might be an idea to dispose of any parts with possible lead contamination in a manner that doesn't leave them available to other beasties.

 

[timbrayford]

My only concern with leaving it exposed is potential lead ingestion by scavengers, especially birds, which appear to be more susceptible to lead poisoning than the four legged kind.
It might be an idea to dispose of any parts with possible lead contamination in a manner that doesn't leave them available to other beasties.

Good idea, perhaps if this could be a significant problem consider non-lead alternatives. Don't the RSPB & FC specify non-lead only?

 

[Monkey Spanker]

Sooner or later you will come across burying the gralloch 1 meter deep is "Best Practice", but as others have said the reality is that it gets hidden away from the public gaze for other wildlife to consume, Red Kites especially benefit from it. Alternatively if you have access to a deer larder disposal via a licensed waste carrier is appropriate.

Tim, that is pretty awful advice! Gralloch, unsurprisingly contains a serious amount of lead shards from a standard lead hunting bullet. Raptors will indeed take every advantage of such a free feast, and scavengers such as Buzzards and Red Kites will be first in the queue. However, due to the nature of how such birds digest their food makes them more susceptible to lead poisoning! Their mechanical stomach (gizzard) actually grinds their food using grit which breaks down the lead particles to a size where it can be ingested. Birds are also very intolerant to lead ingestion.
Leaving gralloch on the surface will soon get rid of it, but we should all be mindful that it contains lead, and if we wish to continue to use lead for hunting, we should attempt to minimise its effects to counter those that would wish to see it banned. Having used non lead bullets for some time now, I actually prefer them! Apart from the increased risk of ricochet which is generally accepted, the terminal effects on deer are actually very impressive!
In answer to the OP question, there are 3 options really:
1. The good book will tell you to bury it 1m deep and away from water courses etc.. Unless you have a JCB in your stalking kit, this is not really a practical solution!
2. Use a licenced waste carrier or incinerator.
3. Leave it out on the ground. This is clearly the simplest and cheapest option, but should be done responsibly! Respect public access and be discreet where you leave it! Soft gralloch will disappear quite quickly, but heads and legs may be around for months and may distress dog walkers when pooch runs up to owner with a half rotted severed deer head! Try to cover it under brambles or down an old disused rabbit hole so that raptors can't get at it. Foxes, rats and badgers will undoubtedly discover it, but their digestive system is similar to ours where lead will just pass straight through them! Anyone who eats enough game will have ended up with a No.6 shot in the bottom of the pan that refuses to flush!
Common sense really.
Good luck with the DSC 2.
MS

 

[timbrayford]

Tim, that is pretty awful advice! Gralloch, unsurprisingly contains a serious amount of lead shards from a standard lead hunting bullet. Raptors will indeed take every advantage of such a free feast, and scavengers such as Buzzards and Red Kites will be first in the queue. However, due to the nature of how such birds digest their food makes them more susceptible to lead poisoning! Their mechanical stomach (gizzard) actually grinds their food using grit which breaks down the lead particles to a size where it can be ingested. Birds are also very intolerant to lead ingestion.
Leaving gralloch on the surface will soon get rid of it, but we should all be mindful that it contains lead, and if we wish to continue to use lead for hunting, we should attempt to minimise its effects to counter those that would wish to see it banned. Having used non lead bullets for some time now, I actually prefer them! Apart from the increased risk of ricochet which is generally accepted, the terminal effects on deer are actually very impressive!
In answer to the OP question, there are 3 options really:
1. The good book will tell you to bury it 1m deep and away from water courses etc.. Unless you have a JCB in your stalking kit, this is not really a practical solution!
2. Use a licenced waste carrier or incinerator.
3. Leave it out on the ground. This is clearly the simplest and cheapest option, but should be done responsibly! Respect public access and be discreet where you leave it! Soft gralloch will disappear quite quickly, but heads and legs may be around for months and may distress dog walkers when pooch runs up to owner with a half rotted severed deer head! Try to cover it under brambles or down an old disused rabbit hole so that raptors can't get at it. Foxes, rats and badgers will undoubtedly discover it, but their digestive system is similar to ours where lead will just pass straight through them! Anyone who eats enough game will have ended up with a No.6 shot in the bottom of the pan that refuses to flush!
Common sense really.
Good luck with the DSC 2.
MS

Read post 7, I think that deals with lead poisoning issues.

Having stalked in the Chilterns I stand by what I say about the Red Kites feeding on deer grallochs.

 

[Overlay]

I am starting my DSC2 shortly and having browsed the best practice guide there is nothing written about gralloch disposal except to refer to By-product disposal guide which is not included in the main guide and I can not find it online. Any AW's or out there can point me in the right direction

Morning LG
re gralloch disposal

I have three areas I stalk on which are different deer species

my own lease I take in excess of fifty fallow does and a sprinkling of bucks per annum off as Maintenance on age/numbers all of these gralloch procedures are whether in the field or on the outside of the larder on the wash down hardstand disposed off via a locked waste bin and collected within two days by a licensed contractor, thats not on the lease or anything, it’s the way I prefer it, I don’t have any footpaths or members of the public to worry about, I prefer not to have it on site to attract additional foxes etc to the estate feeding on offal

An FC site I stalk on, all offall is placed in a sealable bin and collected for disposal

my work, all deer grassed are gralloched on site ( if appropriate) and all offall is double bagged and taken away for proper disposal

For me I prefer to leave the forest the same as I found it, not littered with an old head and legs that joe public can complain about and more importantly no disease or lead shot, the offall will disappear quickly but at a cost of possible lead shard ingestion by other birds or animals.

my answer would be to simply leave the place as you found it, free of organic matter, take it away for disposal and everyone is happy and there is no reason of complaint from anyone

The above probably wouldn’t be acceptable on the Hill but it’s all about doing the best you can at the time

Good luck with your L2

phil

 

[Monkey Spanker]

Read post 7, I think that deals with lead poisoning issues.

Having stalked in the Chilterns I stand by what I say about the Red Kites feeding on deer grallochs.

Of course they will feed on gralloch as it is a free and easy meal for them, but is it really beneficial if it kills 9% of them and reduces the health of the remainder?
Read some science:
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0048969707001003
MS

 

[levigsp]

Tim, that is pretty awful advice! Gralloch, unsurprisingly contains a serious amount of lead shards from a standard lead hunting bullet. Raptors will indeed take every advantage of such a free feast, and scavengers such as Buzzards and Red Kites will be first in the queue. However, due to the nature of how such birds digest their food makes them more susceptible to lead poisoning! Their mechanical stomach (gizzard) actually grinds their food using grit which breaks down the lead particles to a size where it can be ingested. Birds are also very intolerant to lead ingestion.

MS

I am afraid to say you are wrong on this one and Ill explain: A bird of prey is not a Chicken or Duck, it does NOT have any grit in its gizzard, doing so would likely kill it.
In layman's terms A bird of prey eats the meat, including bones etc that are either swallowed whole or broken up, this passed into it the first stomach where acids and enzymes break the meat down, this mass is then passed into the second stomach/gizzard where it is crushed by the muscles squeezing the liquid out which is then past further down, whilst the waste in the form of fur, bone etc is coughed up in the form of a pellet. Problems arise when the meat contains regular spherical shaped pieces of lead, eg fishing split shot and shooting shot, this cannot get coughed up because of how the muscles work etc, but irregular lead shards easily mix with bone and fur to be coughed up. Friend I have who use birds of prey will happily feed rifle shot meat, rabbits and deer etc, but never shotgun shot game. Another thing that might interest some is the fact that if to many lead pellets are in the gizzard, the birds often die because they cannot squeeze the food from the first stomach and starve to death!

 

[Monkey Spanker]

I am afraid to say you are wrong on this one and Ill explain: A bird of prey is not a Chicken or Duck, it does NOT have any grit in its gizzard, doing so would likely kill it.
In layman's terms A bird of prey eats the meat, including bones etc that are either swallowed whole or broken up, this passed into it the first stomach where acids and enzymes break the meat down, this mass is then passed into the second stomach/gizzard where it is crushed by the muscles squeezing the liquid out which is then past further down, whilst the waste in the form of fur, bone etc is coughed up in the form of a pellet. Problems arise when the meat contains regular spherical shaped pieces of lead, eg fishing split shot and shooting shot, this cannot get coughed up because of how the muscles work etc, but irregular lead shards easily mix with bone and fur to be coughed up. Friend I have who use birds of prey will happily feed rifle shot meat, rabbits and deer etc, but never shotgun shot game. Another thing that might interest some is the fact that if to many lead pellets are in the gizzard, the birds often die because they cannot squeeze the food from the first stomach and starve to death!

Opinions will always be divided over this where fishermen and shooters will argue against this to protect their sport, but your theory does not explain how such raptors are found to have ingested such levels of lead into their blood?
I manage a 11,500 acre estate in Northamptonshire where we have hundreds of Red Kites. We try to keep gralloch hidden from them as best we can, but they are pretty efficient scavengers! Many of us use non-toxic bullets, as do the FC who also manage a large chunk in this area. The population continues to thrive in this area. Probably coincidence, but I like to think we are doing our bit for conservation. Gralloch from animals shot with copper bullets which retain pretty much 100% mass on exit probably are good for them to eat? The deer certainly don't seem to notice the difference!
MS

 

[sikamalc]

common sense needs to be applied in the disposal of the gralloch of deer.

In most instances I try to make sure that any waste is put in the pit we have on the estate. I like to keep areas clean, especially around high seats. Therefore most of the deer I take are bled in the field but the remainder is done back at the larder.
However I am well aware that many stalkers don't have such facilities, and certainly on other areas I have this is not possible. Therefore any gralloch should be disposed away from any watercourse, ponds etc. If there are any holes or upturned tree root areas this is a good place to bury it under. Or in heavy brambles or cover where no bird of prey is going to find it easily.

Common sense, and being respectful.

 

[User00025]

Sooner or later you will come across burying the gralloch 1 meter deep is "Best Practice", but as others have said the reality is that it gets hidden away from the public gaze for other wildlife to consume, Red Kites especially benefit from it. Alternatively if you have access to a deer larder disposal via a licensed waste carrier is appropriate.

I'm afraid the Red Kites in our area prefer Grey Partridge and Mallard ducklings Tim. I leave mine for the foxes, with good results.

 

[Erik Hamburger]

Good idea, perhaps if this could be a significant problem consider non-lead alternatives. Don't the RSPB & FC specify non-lead only?

The Woodland Trust also specifies non-lead amo only.

 

[Vulpesvulpes]

At this time of year if it wasnt for gralloch thousands of birds and animals would starve to death.

 

[Monkey Spanker]

At this time of year if it wasnt for gralloch thousands of birds and animals would starve to death.

Wouldn't that be nature's intention though?
That's a bit like saying loads of foxes and buzzards would starve if we didn't have so many pheasants about!

 

[Monkey Spanker]

The Woodland Trust also specifies non-lead amo only.

We have also moved away from lead at the Wildlife Trust sites.
MS

 

[zambezi]

Having due concern for raptor ingestion of lead comes second to my own welfare and those with whom I share my venison. I have seen deer shot with a .243 lead based bullet where shards travelled at almost 40 degrees to point of entry and lodged in prime cuts. For a couple of years I have been using Sako non-toxic ammo. No failures yet and all one shot kills.