Preferred bullet - chest shots

wildfowler.250

Well-Known Member
This is a straightforward question and I’m just interested to see how the opinions split on here..

- Let’s say, sub 300 yards

- Any deer species,(but probably more interested in red/fallow/sika)


- Chest / shoulder shot


Do you prefer a (hunting) ballistic tip. Rapid expansion and dump a lot of energy quickly.

Or

A bonded / soft point with a decent mushroom and a more reliable pass through?


I’ve used both in the past but tend to lean more towards the bonded but keen to see how folk on here think.


Cheers!
 
Sub 300yards, I don’t see any huge advantage to using a more frangible bullet, as ultimately it’s still very close range.

A deforming monolithic such as the Barnes TTSX in a suitable weight for a reasonable calibre will drop most deer where they stand within these ranges.

Frangible bullets come into their own at greater distance where lower terminal velocity is involved. These may also be beneficial when head/neck shooting.

It’s about matching bullet construction to usage IMO.

Ben
 
Sub 300yards, I don’t see any huge advantage to using a more frangible bullet, as ultimately it’s still very close range.

A deforming monolithic such as the Barnes TTSX in a suitable weight for a reasonable calibre will drop most deer where they stand within these ranges.

Frangible bullets come into their own at greater distance where lower terminal velocity is involved. These may also be beneficial when head/neck shooting.

It’s about matching bullet construction to usage IMO.

Ben
Completely fair point. More frangible bullet for slower speeds and potentially not opening up quite so violently either
Ballistic tip doesn’t control expansion in hunting rounds.

A lot of these bullets like ELDX have a thick jacket/core which stays together though. And I suspect any of the BTs in say .30 cal are geared purely towards a hunting bullet than vermin?
 
A lot of these bullets like ELDX have a thick jacket/core which stays together though. And I suspect any of the BTs in say .30 cal are geared purely towards a hunting bullet than vermin?

Yes, that was my point - the bit of plastic doesn't control expansion (and has very little impact on ballistics at normal hunting ranges so it's mainly a marketing tool).

But your original post was a choice between a) frangible ballistic tip and b) bonded / soft point. It's like saying "do you prefer apples or apples".
 
Yes, that was my point - the bit of plastic doesn't control expansion (and has very little impact on ballistics at normal hunting ranges so it's mainly a marketing tool).

But your original post was a choice between a) frangible ballistic tip and b) bonded / soft point. It's like saying "do you prefer apples or apples".
That’s a fair point! I was looking at the Nosler partitions earlier today and I was like “why am I considering nearly £1.50 per bullet when a standard soft point or bonded will do the same for less”
Never thought about it. Most shots sub 200yds, look through scope, squeeze trigger, dead deer.
Doesn't make any difference so long as it's not fmj. Sometimes buy ballistic tips sometimes softpoints, even been known to buy coppery thingies, they work as well.

That’s far too relaxed and sensible an approach 😂
 
308 150g Speer Hot Core, expanded more/hit harder in 1 in 10 barrel compared with 1 in 14.

If you work out the rotational speed difference it suggests centrifugal force is a factor in bullet expansion?
 
This is a straightforward question
far from it in my opinion…

Chest shots and shoulder shots present very different media for any bullet and introduction of different species and ranges/terminal velocities presents even more variables

Nipping a bullet between the ribs on a chest shot at 200m on a roe presents a very different resistance compared to a shoulder shop on a rutting red stag


Frangible bullets do increase the potential of expansion at lower terminal velocities or ranges…BUT…they also can severely reduce penetration by doing so especially with smaller calibres with lower bullet weights.

Bonded bullets are useful where thicker skinned heavier game can present over expansion with less resilient cup and core bullets.
Not sure we have the game to justify a harder bonded bullet like they have in Africa

Ballistic tips do nothing except standardise tip profile and help with a higher BC.
Thinner jackets, larger meplat and larger voids in the nose assist in expansion and frangibility

Bullets that expand, deform, shedding material, creating secondary wound channels, slowing down dramatically with increased friction through deformation and loss of mass …work in a very different way to those such as monolithic/solids of copper/brass that are designed to expand but maintain their original mass (as opposed to frangible non lead offerings).

The high velocity pass through of a bullet that does not deform beyond 1.5x calibre diameter and doesn’t shed mass creates a huge cavitation bubble, much larger than a bullet slowing down.
This destroys organs and puts a huge shock wave into the central nervous system if the bullet is placed close enough.

High frame rate video on gel blocks show a high velocity pass through creates a much longer “bubble” through the entire gel block
Usually a 24” width.
Compared to the 25-50% of the width of the block with cup/core bullets that shed and slow down.

The downside is when the terminal velocity drops to the point where the pass through velocity is low and the cavitation bubble is not big it fast enough to create the organ damage or CNS shock.
Common complaint of non lead bullets that have been mismatched to quarry or terminal velocity

I personally prefer a bullet that allows a wide range of shot placement options at a wide range of distances or terminal velocities.

For the vast majority a standard soft point will do more than enough with any chest, shoulder, neck or head.
As will a solid non lead or a bonded, harder lead cup and core bullet.

Where some of the lighter, frangible bullets fail is at very high terminal velocities/shorter ranges when the particles that break off create huge carcase damage but can also often fail to penetrate a heavier thicker skinned target if placed on the shoulder


There are bullets that will work well at reasonable ranges in a rifle like a 20” 6.5 Creedmoor but turn into Grenades when driven out of a 24” 6.5PRC with an extra 5-600fps
ELD-X for example

Similarly a heavier copper/brass monolithic in the same scenario would work better in the faster cartridge and worse in the slower one.

I run ELD-X and Peregrine monolithic in 300NM with MVs of 3250fps for a 200/208gr
The ELD-X in that weight class does not break up
The solids could take out most vehicles let alone deer

I run 147gr ELD-M in 6.5-284 pushing 2950fps
The 143gr ELD-X in the same cartridge I found to be far too frangible in the small sample I used them for

I run 95gr VMax in the 6.5Grendel at 2750fps
The MV is low and I want a faster more frangible bullet for shorter range quarry of all types.

You need to match bullet to cartridge to velocity/distance to quarry
 
in .243 I shoot 100gn Partitions and in .308 I shoot 165gn Partitions, they go in, make a mess on the inside and they generally come out the other side, resulting in a dead Deer, I shot a few Reds with 165gn A-Max years ago but they made a horrible snotty mess so they got ditched
 
I like a small, clean wound channel with complete pass through. If an arrow can kill a deer a bullet sure can. I would much prefer the blood to be laid down in trail form outside the animal than forced amongst the tissue layers and turned to jelly, wasting good meat. I've shot over 500 deer and have only lost a couple, so I don't find that a bad ratio to work with.
 
With my .308 in the past 2 years I've used:

  • 150gr American White tail (non bonded)
  • 150gr Super hammerheads (bonded)
  • 150gr SSTs (Btip)
They've all performed as expected. Both AW and SHH had exit holes about the size of an inch but the SSTs had much bigger exits. I could stick 3 fingers in those. I was dubious about the SSTs because of all the talk about excess meat damage but I haven't found it to be too bad I was happy with the blood trail they provide, especially when shooting dense woods.

I've 3 SSTs left (I'll probably get through them this weekend) and then I'm onto Sako game head pro loaded with sierra gamechangers.
 
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